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Prospect Run-Off (Ramos or Mijares?)

The poll is closed and we are again in need of a prospect run-off to determine who gets to be our choice for Twins Prospect #5 and join this group:

  1. Danny Valencia, 3B
  2. Ben Revere, OF
  3. Aaron Hicks, OF
  4. Angel Morales, OF
  5.  

Star-divide

So, who would you rank more highly... Jose Mijares or Wilson Ramos?

Poll
Who would you rank higher?
Jose Mijares
72 votes
Wilson Ramos
74 votes

146 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs | Comment 19 comments

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Comments

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I'm going

I’m going Ramos. What he has accomplished in pitchers leagues is astounding. And doing it all while playing great behind the plate.

A special talent. This organization seems to have a knack for finding great catchers.

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Oct 12, 2008 3:09 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Pierzynski

Pierzynski was one of the better catchers in the AL when he was with us, made an all-star team…

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Oct 12, 2008 10:36 PM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Catchers

Two years ago, there were six catchers drafted by the Twins in the majors:

Valentine
Pierzinski
Mauer
LeCroy
Moeller
Miller

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 13, 2008 10:12 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Gotta go with Ramos...

…who as said above, could become a very good major league catcher. Although Mijares is ready to step into a key bullpen role, a solid defensive catcher who hits very well could be someone who is a key part of the organization for a decade. Upside goes to Ramos without a doubt. Mijares on the other hand is almost a certainty to being a solid bullpen guy, with Ramos still a question mark as he has two more levels to climb before taking that final step.

by roger13 on Oct 12, 2008 4:03 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lovin'

I just love Ramos’ peak performance translation over at Baseball Prospectus: .282/.353/.464 with 18 HR in 461 AB.

by PhoenixV on Oct 12, 2008 5:12 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I still got to go with Mijares.

At the end of next season he could be the savior of our bullpen and I compare that to a player that hasn’t advanced out of the Florida League. No matter how much his talent translates to I want to see him against AA competition before I vote for him in the top ten.

by Beerbear on Oct 12, 2008 6:03 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ok....

but look at the early winners at the top of the list. Ramos has played at a higher level than them and his ceiling is every bit as high, given his position.

I think it’s intellectually dishonest to vote for those guys and not vote for Ramos here, personally.

I love Mijares; always have. But Ramos’ upside is so much more that you have to go with him. Dominant setup guy vs. All-Star caliber C. That’s a no-brainer IMO.

by DJSkillz on Oct 13, 2008 10:13 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

AA up

I don’t know about the rest of you, I feel the need to put more of a plus next to players who have proven themselves in at least AA over A ball players. Whem I evaluate my prospect list, I ask 2 questions in addition to their skill set. 1. how likely is the player going to make it to the majors, and 2. what kind of impact can he make? A ball players get rated higher on the list when there are not many prospects at AA or AAA and when they have high ceilings. Once a player establishes themselves in AA and is a prospect, they are close to knocking on the door to the majors.

Ramos has a higher ceiling than mijares but he is farther away from making it a reality. For that I have to vote Mijares.

by doofus on Oct 12, 2008 6:37 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly...

That is the purpose of this series of prospect votes… Because we all have differing opinions on what makes a good prospect. For some, it is 100% about ceiling. For others it is about closeness to the big leagues. For most, it is somewhere in between. No one is wrong… but having this community of voters helps give us a general consensus.

I think everyone here knows my thoughts on some of this, particularly about relief pitchers who won’t pitch more than 75 innings in a season and has only 8 games pitched above AA.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 12, 2008 7:05 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

I’m usually actually more in the camp that prefers to vote for guys who have seen, or will soon see, AA for the highest spots, but there is a HUGE ceiling gap between some of these guys in the lower levels and the guys at the top.

That said, my next few picks are higher up guys for me. After Ramos, I’m taking Hughes, probably Mijares some point soon after that.

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Oct 12, 2008 10:38 PM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Just a thought about when we go to a run-off...

To save us some time, we should probably name the winner #5 and the loser #6.

I mean, if it’s anything like the vote for #2 turned out, whoever loses will win the next one handily anyways.

Any thoughts on this?

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http://goallineblitz.com/game/signup.pl?ref=2882412

by joeiscool12 on Oct 12, 2008 11:38 PM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Excellent suggestion joe...

…will second this Seth. What do you think?

by roger13 on Oct 13, 2008 7:35 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agree-

I agree, especially since, as stated by Adam below, the run-offs are close.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 13, 2008 11:04 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Or,

You could do an MVP style vote—10 points for first, 9 for second, and so on. But that would muddy the discussion. Maybe you could do 3 at a time—5 points for 1st, 3 for second, 1 for third.

I’ve had to force myself to look well beyond next season, and instead try and envision twenty years from now—will we remember Mijares (or even Valencia?) Or will we be talking about Revere hitting .400, Hicks winning the triple crown, Morales slugging 50 homers, and Ramos throwing out 50% of basestealers while having a 1.000 OPS?

OK, perhaps a bit of a stretch, but they are young enough to still hope, whereas with the higher level guys, you know what you are getting.

I’ve been thinking about a three-tiered prospect list. Tier 1 would be already major leaguers like Gomez and Young who still have tremendous tools and upside. Will they make it? Seems like their upsides are still every bit as good as Hicks or Morales.

Then you’ve got the guys on the slow track. AA and AAA guys who are moving slowly, but still may become very good players. Guys like Baker or more recently Blackburn and Span (although Span is maybe more of a Tier 1 guy.) Maybe Valencia and Plouffe would be guys at the top of this tier, with lesser prospects like Pridie and Duensing and Humber included as well.

Then finally at Tier 3 you’ve got guys with tremendous upside who may move quickly but still may flame out into anonimity. By default they are lower level and young and more often then not hitters. If Ramos is the real deal, he’ll skip Tier 2 and move to the big leagues as a Tier 1 guy (or even better, a ‘made man’, as I would refer Mauer, Baker, Liriano, Slowey, etc.) And that would have to happen within 3 years max, and probably less. Anyway, with this tier we could protect ourselves from having to admit three years from now that once upon a time we thought some guy named Aaron Hicks was the top prospect in the system, even though he was never able to hit at High-A.

by Han Joelo on Oct 13, 2008 11:16 AM EDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Whew, these run offs have been close

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Oct 13, 2008 9:51 AM EDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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