Cuddyer Drawing Interest From Rockies?

Tracy Ringolsby, a name we should all be familiar with by now from The Rocky Mountain News, says Cuddles will be an interesting name to watch. With Minnesota's alleged interest in Garrett Atkins, and Colorado apparently shopping Matt Holliday, AND with the Twins having an abundance of outfielders (sort of), could this be a match?

Earlier in the day, Ringolsby once again mentioned the Twins had engaged with the Rockies in "initial" talks regarding Atkins. While Cuddyer might thrive with the Humidor, it's fair to say I have questions about Garrett's ability to his outside of Coors. Stay tuned.

over 3 years ago Jesse 6 comments 0 recs |

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I'd take it

As much as I’m not one to quickly give up on Cuddyer and get rid of him. I’d be ok if we could get Atkins for him and a smaller piece. I don’t know that Atkins is that affected by playing in or out of coors, splits be damned. Mostly he just hasn’t hit as high of an average when out of Coors field. He has 45 homers in comparison to 44 in about the same number of at bats. He just gets less hits away from home. Unless there’s something I’m missing the main thing to worry about a guy from Coors is home runs. It seems to me the guy might just hit better at home, no matter where that is. Unless there’s something I don’t understand about Coors field allowing guys to just plain get more hits rather than just home runs.

In fact I’m more concerned about the questions surrounding his defensive capabilities. Right now Buscher/Harris combo is pretty good defensively and decent on offense. A few more jacks is what Atkins would hopefully bring but if he’s giving up just as much defensively I don’t see the point.

I’m still all about a Beltre or bust mentality and if we can’t get him then move on and look for a shortstop or 2B to trade for like Cano or Hardy.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Nov 6, 2008 11:25 PM EST reply actions

The Coors Factor

It’s not just homers in Coors – I believe their park factor is strong for all kinds of hits. Extra base hits of all types would obviously be more common (the same effect that changes a warning-track fly into a homer would put a routine fly out off the wall), but I can see a good explanation for higher singles rates as well – supposedly the thin air also negates a lot of the effect of breaking balls, meaning that it’s simply easier to hit the ball there. This appears to be borne out in Atkins’ strikeout rate – in roughly the same number of PA, he has 146 strikeouts at home and 215 on the road.

I just looked at Atkins’s splits again looking up this post, and holy cow he’s terrible on the road. Seriously, .260/.328/.424, at the cost of a starting outfielder, with no payroll savings? The Buscher/Harris platoon (Bridan Buschris?) will probably put up similar numbers (just with fewer homers) for under a million bucks.

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Nov 7, 2008 10:15 AM EST up reply actions

I don't think it's fair...

to go JUST on road numbers for Colorado players. Because I think most players hit better at home, at least slightly.

I think the “true” player is somewhere in between. Personally I bet Atkins is around an .800 OPS player overall (not much above 2007 away numbers). Which is pretty much about the same hitter Cuddyer is, but at 3b. There may be no bigger Cuddyer guy than me, and I’ve defended him on dozens of occasions, but I think I’d do Cuddyer for Atkins if nothing else of real value is involved. As I mention below, ideally we could add something in to get Jeff Baker as well and install him at 2b (Casilla to SS). I think we’d be a much better team, and we’d really be helping ourselves out RH-wise.

by DJSkillz on Nov 7, 2008 10:34 AM EST up reply actions

True... I was being a bit hasty there

Eliminating the home park from a guy in Coors or Arlington isn’t really fair, you’re right – if he played for another team in the division, he’d get almost 20 games in that park. I posted them largely because the numbers were so jarring, and I figured they were a decent shorthand for his expected production. Beltre usually gets the opposite treatment – we tend to use his road stats rather than come up with a compromise. I wouldn’t be shocked at an 800 OPS, although I also wouldn’t plan on it.

If he’s an 800 OPS guy, it’s not as bad a deal for the Twins, although I still am skeptical that he presents much of an upgrade from the incumbent platoon, especially if he’s no better than them defensively. I guess the real question in a Atkins-Cuddyer swap is whether the upgrade from Buschris to Atkins offsets the downgrade caused by replacing Cuddyer’s AB with some combination of Delmon, Gomez, and Pridie (assuming Gomez and Delmon would get the majority of the days off in the current 5-man OF/DH rotation). Also, even if Atkins is no better than Harris defensively, removing Cuddyer would improve the outfield defense by getting Gomez more playing time, so it would probably be a net positive on that side of the ball.

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Nov 7, 2008 11:31 AM EST up reply actions

Don't get me wrong....

I’d rather have Beltre, or even Kouzmanoff, than Atkins, but everything depends on cost too. I’m not sure where the true value lies; none of us do.

by DJSkillz on Nov 7, 2008 3:44 PM EST up reply actions

I prefer Beltre....

and I still like Cuddyer a lot, but I wouldn’t be opposed to this deal as long as it’s essentially a 1 for 1. Price is about the same if you calculate Atkins’ likely arbitration #‘s the next 2 years, and I think they’re very similar overall hitters. Heck, even defensively (Cuddy to 3b) they’re probably not that much different. But this does solve a positional need if the Twins are insistent on Cuddy not playing 3b again. And so I think it makes a lot of sense. In fact, since we wouldn’t really be adding payroll and would be fixing 3b, it actually allows us to have a LOT of money spent on say, SS. We could honestly make a big play for Rafael Furcal if that’s the case.

Another alternative would be to expand a deal to include something like Humber for Jeff Baker if the Rockies are so inclined. Throw in Guerrier too if need be. In that scenario I’d play Baker at 2b and shift Casilla to SS. Not ideal, but that’s a much improved offense, and done cheaply. Plus we’d still have a LOT of pitching left in the next year or 2 for another deal if the need arises.

by DJSkillz on Nov 7, 2008 12:16 AM EST reply actions