Minnesota Twins Winter Meetings Open Thread, Wednesday
by Jesse on Dec 10, 2008 7:46 AM EST
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PrintDay 3 of the Winter Meetings, here we go...
5:02 pm - It's late in the UK. But keep checking back for updates from your other admins, should something go down. In the meantime, be sure to log your own speculation in the comments and keep your own newsflashes coming in!
4:36 pm - The Astros are definitely shopping Ty Wigginton, which is something that we already knew...more or less for sure. Tim Dierkes at MLB Trade Rumors mentions the Twins have been attached to his name over the last couple of days, as have been the Toronto Blue Jays. He'd be another decent Twins-type acquisition that shouldn't break the bank on prospects.
3:27 pm - Corey Brock at MLB.com has more on the Cubs-Padres-Twins-Phillies go-round. He says this could actually be a three or four team deal, and tosses out a few names of use.
2:53 pm - Carrie Muskat at MLBlogs has written what can only be described as a forceful entry, whose tone seems annoyed or angered more than anything else, about the Twins activity on Mark DeRosa. It sounds like she feels the Twins are trying to wedge themselves into a situation they don't belong:
The Twins are reportedly trying to become the third team in the Padres-Cubs talks regarding Jake Peavy, and have come up with a package of young players in hopes of luring Mark DeRosa from Chicago. But a Cubs source said Wednesday the versatile DeRosa is staying put and not going to be dealt.
The Cubs, Philies and Padres are still talking about a potential deal, but there is no timetable. There also is no pressure on the Cubs to get something done.
Whether it's true or not, it smacks of posturing and contradicts what we've been hearing for most of today. Also, she spelled "Phillies" incorrectly. Stay tuned to find out how this one turns out.
2:02 pm - LEN III is back with an early afternoon update. Not much to report, just a couple of quick points.
- Both Minnesota and Philadelphia are hawking Mark DeRosa, but it sounds like the Twins have more ammunition for pulling the trigger.
- Nick Punto might be the Phillies' next choice, if they can't land DeRosa.
- The Twins have a real opportunity to be a pain in another team's rear end, even if it's not on purpose. If the Twins get DeRosa, re-sign Punto, and then if Minnesota decides to be difficult should the Phillies decide to chase Delmon Young? That'd be a good way to strain a relationship.
11:33 am - With the idea of a Twins-Cubs-Padres three-way flowing through our heads, could the Twins find their infield upgrades in one fell swoop? This chart is far from finished, but the main players are in place. A few prospects can be plugged in to make this deal suitabe to all three clubs. Who are the extra pieces?
| Teams | Padres Receive | Cubs Receive | Twins Receive |
| Twins Trade | 3B Luke Hughes (?) RHP Anthony Swarzak (?) |
RHP Philip Humber (?) |
X |
| Cubs Trade | *Fill in names here* | X | 2B Mark DeRosa |
| Padres Trade | X | RHP Jake Peavy | 3B Kevin Kouzmanoff |
From a Twins angle, another pitching prospect or two would need to be involved. Some of the prospect names I've thrown out on Minnesota's behalf can be mixed and matched, but they do need to be good prospects. Would Delmon Young need to be involved? I'm not sure he would be.
10:40 am - Joe C. runs through the halves of '08 for a number of players, including Delmon Young, and made an astute observation:
"[After May 31 Delmon Young] batted .305/.343/.444 with 10 homers and 54 RBI. For comparison, after May 31, Torii Hunter batted .275/.342/.461 with 14 homers and 52 RBI in a solid first season with the Angels."
10:23 am - A morning update from LEN III, and it sounds like the Twins are trying to hone in on an infield upgrade.
- The Twins and the Cubs talked yesterday about Mark DeRosa. He recorded 670 at second base for Chicago, and over 100 innings at third. Although he'll be 34 next year, he's blossomed over the last three years as an everyday player. From '06 - '08, he's hit .291/.368/.453.
- Sounds like today the Cubs are submitting a list of pitchers they'd need for DeRosa.
- Ron Gardenhire isn't opposed to trying Alexi Casilla at shortstop.
- La Velle believes that the Twins, Cubs and Padres might work a three-way deal that would move Jake Peavy to Chicago.
- Nick Punto will come back to the Twins for an offer before he signs anywhere else.
- Minnesota is interested in Kevin Kouzmanoff of the Padres, and Neal thinks he might be the primary fall back option of nothing happens with DeRosa.
- Ty Wigginton is a "gamer" in Twins circles, and is another player they have discussed.
- Jorge Cantu is falling on the charts.
- Doesn't sound like Michael Young is on the radar, either.
9:50 am - It's been a quiet morning so far, so let's take a quick cruise around Minnesota's SB Nation sites...
- The Wolves lost...again. McHale is now 0-1 as the Pups' head coach.
- The VIkings won't be getting another Prime Time slot until the playoffs, if they make it. This means I'll need to go to a friend's place on Sunday afternoons and hope that SKy is covering them.
- Golden Gopher basketball is off to an 8-0 start. An inflated record? Possibly. Probably.
- Finally, Marian Gaborik is back with the Wild, but not yet ready to play. Could he stay healthy for just one season, and then maybe pull his head out of his ass? That'd be great. The Wild need his contributions.
7:07 am - Already a few more things on the table.
- Thanks to Adam Peterson for the heads up in the comments of Tuesday's thread, but The New York Post is reporting that the Yankees will sign C.C. Sabathia today.
- Something else from LEN III last night, where he outlines the current options for Nick Punto. Neal says he could start at second for Arizona, shortstop for the Dodgers or the Twins, or be a backup option for the Phillies. He also says it'd probably take about $4 million per year to keep Punto.
6:47 am - Things will start to kick off over the next couple of hours, but in the meantime here's a roundup of what's happened overnight...
- The Rockies have agreed in principle on a deal for southpaw Alan Embree. Does this make Huston Street more expendable? I wouldn't think so, but you never know.
- Mark Sheldon at MLB.com says three teams are interested in infielder Jerry Hairston, Jr. Cincinnati has made themselves a suitor at the Winter Meetings, and it sounds like Philadelphia could be in the mix as well. Last year, the utility player hit .326/.384/.487 in 80 games with the Reds, but has a career .700 OPS. I'm chalking some of that up to luck, some of it up to a hitter's park, and some of it to just having a good year. I don't want anything to do with Hairston, but I do find it interesting to keep track of free agent infielders...or super-utility guys, like Hairston. Hairston's father, grandfather, uncle and brother have all appeared in baseball sometime over the last sixty years...so that's interesting.
- This was briefly covered in the comments last night in yesterday's thread, but the Twins have inquired on pitcher Joaquin Benoit from Texas. Benoit is a strikeout pitcher (215 strikeouts over 206.2 innings the last three years) with control problems (a disturbing 7.00 BB/9 in '08, due in large part to shoulder issues), and a tendency to lean toward being a fly-ball pitcher. If healthy, this is they kind of guy that could actually help the bullpen...but he has to be healthy. He's right-handed, throws a fastaball with movement (90-92), a slider/curve and a changeup.
- In that same report, it's said that the Twins are dangling Boof Bonser. In spite of his performance last season, he does have some things going for him: versatility (bullpen/rotation), age (27 for '09), decent control, the ability to miss bats, and (when he's on) a good fastball/curveball combination.
- The competition is nearing a deal for Kerry Wood, on what sounds like a two-year deal with a vesting option.
- Last night an LEN III's blog, he poses some questions regarding the Twins, and what they could have done to make their offer more attractive to Casey Blake.
- Blake's contract breaks down thusly (courtesy of La Velle). 2009: $5 million. 2010: $6 million. 2011: $5.25 million. 2012: $6 million, with a $1.25 million buyout. All of this tells me that, no matter what we might speculate, if the Twins offer of two years at $14 million wasn't good enough, then it was indeed about the years AND the money. The Dodgers will either pay $17.5 million over three years (very likely), or $22.25 million over four (shock horror!).
- Finally, late last night, Jerry Fraley posted that the Pirates are looking to trade their "front-line" shortstop, Jack Wilson. Fraley brings up a few teams looking for a "front-line" shortstop--including Kansas City, Oakland and the Dodgers. Minnesota wasn't listed.
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Tejada
Over the Baggy, another Twins blog, last nigh wrote the following:
An insider source told me that the Twins and Astros have the preliminary deal in place that would bring Miguel Tejada back to the American League. It is unclear as to what the Astros have coming to them for the former MVP.
I e-mailed him because I was kinda shocked after La Velle said he wasn’t an option and his name hasn’t come up. He told me that an inside source told him that the deal is in place, and the teams are “locking in the players” like they did with the Rincon/Morlan part of the Rays trade last season.
This might be interesting…
by Twins Territory on Dec 10, 2008 8:27 AM EST reply actions
Over the Baggy is a good blog.
But I have a hard time buying into this. No other press source has come out with this yet, on either side of the equation.
We heard yesterday that the Twins had kicked tires on a couple of Astros, but a number of sources shot down the Tejada-to-Minnesota idea.
Most importantly to me…I don’t want Tejada. I don’t think he’s worth the cost, and I think the Twins could do better for production.
I don't know what to think..
I’m not sure that he’d make this up, and I’ve talked with him before. At the same time, I’ve heard LENIII shut it down saying “Tejada is NOT an option” and thus far, I’ve seen nothing about this anywhere.
I think I’d take him if we aren’t giving up Young or Cuddyer because he’ll likely be here one year. I saw that the Twins would like the fact that they’d get draft picks from him next season if he was a Type A. And, I think the Astros would need to pick up part of the deal for this season.
We’ll see….
by Twins Territory on Dec 10, 2008 8:41 AM EST up reply actions
I certainly don't want
to imply he’s making it up. But just based on everything we have heard regarding the Twins and Tejada, I might doubt his source.
But that’s a dead end—we don’t know who it is, and I’m not about to ask. The source clearly doesn’t want to be identified.
No thanks
I hope this is not true. I do not want Tejada as our shortstop, especially if it means giving up another piece, e.g., Young, Cuddyer, starting pitcher. Terrible fielder, not nearly the hitter he used to be, attitude problems, etc.
I guess there would be hope of a comeback, but for $13M next year (last year of his contract), I want something more sure and long term as a SS option.
However, at the very least I’d like the aggressiveness…
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 9:51 AM EST up reply actions
Wrong Info
I haven’t heard of any attitude problems with Tejada since he left Baltimore. His attitude is the only reason the Astros haven’t given him away for free – he’s been a great clubhouse presence. He also had the best zone rating in the national league last year. That being said, he is terrible offensively.
by seanbergmanrules on Dec 10, 2008 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
Since he left Baltimore
is the key. Absolute dog his last year in Baltimore.
However, I hadn’t looked very hard at the fielding numbers. His range factor was poor (7th out of 10) last year, but zone rating was, as you state, best in the NL. Fielding bible had him at +7 last year, and Baseball Prospectus has him at +10 FRAA.
So, I stand corrected on his fielding last year. Can’t speak to attitude last year, guess I was tainted by his last year in Baltimore. I’m a local out here in Maryland, although not an O’s fan…
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 9:12 PM EST up reply actions
LENII
Based his entire analysis on body language. He said Antony made a gesture that he interpreted as a no. Perhaps Antony wanted to say, “don’t go there” because he doesn’t want the cat out of the bag before the details are worked out.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Guess
we’ll have to see what happens with the rumors today and go from there.
by Twins Territory on Dec 10, 2008 8:42 AM EST up reply actions
No
He doesn’t seem like a good target, but he is an impact bat to hit between Morneau and Kubel, so it makes some sense as long as e can play third base. My guess is they’re working on the DeRosa/Kouzmanoff deal and the Miggy deal is a back-up.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I could live with Tejada at 3B
His bat has diminished and he’s well beyond his prime, but I could live with it as long as we got a real SS, not just resign Punto.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
And,
as long as the Astros would pay a nice chuck of his salary. I wouldn’t want the Twins to pay millions for a guy who looks like he’s about to take a nose-dive in the production department.
and when that nose dive happens,
kiss that type A free agent goodby.
ahh, the roids era ended, and so did Tejada’s production, oh well.
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Dec 10, 2008 4:33 PM EST up reply actions
I was told by someone I contacted with the team that I “should ignore it. not true.”
by Twins Territory on Dec 10, 2008 7:36 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not too interesting, either...
But I’ll take it if the Twins refuse to do anything else. I’ll probably be among the largest of his criticizers, but I’ll stick to the fact that he will only be with us for 1 year…then give us two picks.
I would rather another trade went down, though.
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by Andersklasen on Dec 10, 2008 9:56 AM EST up reply actions
Doubtful
I doubt Tejada will give anyone picks. Given his age, declining production and steroids, I can’t see a team willing to offer him a decent contract. Tejada is a perfect example of a guy who would make substantially more through arbitration than he would on the open market, especially if he cost a signing team a first round draft pick. Tejada is definitely someone you don’t offer arbitration to.
by seanbergmanrules on Dec 11, 2008 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Someone will sign him
The question is not “will he get signed” the question is, “will he qualify as a Type A or B free agent.” Based on his 2008 numbers (92 OPS+), that is by no means clear. As a shortstop, he should be at least a Type B if he can manage a 100 OPS+ in 2009. I’d say that’s likely, considering that his 2008 OPS+ is a career low. AS a third baseman, he prolly needs to do somewhat better than that. It’s not a science because Elias doesn’t do the ranking until after the season. But based on past years, I’d say something like and OPS+ of 110 would guarantee at least Type B. Considering that his career OPS+ is 112, that’s a decent bet. The one proviso is age. At 34, 2008 could be the start of a decline. So their is a chance he won’t even make Type B status.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Gardenhire must really, really hate Delmon Young!
I think this is amazing. In an interview whose sole purpose was to retract his anti-Delmon slip last week, Gardy still couldn’t resist criticizing him!
From the Strib:
“Like everything with every player, we want him to flow into our program and understand what we are all about, and he played,” Gardenhire said. “He’s a little more stubborn than some of the guys.”
Gardenhire insisted he gets along well with Young and believes he is just used to getting advice from his father, Larry, and brother Dmitri, a 13-year major league veteran.
“That’s who he listened to, and our goal was to try to break into that and get him to understand what we are about, and that’s all it’s ever been,” Gardenhire said. “Delmon was not a problem, not an issue, and I would hate to think that somebody would think it was.”
http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/35844269.html?page=2&c=y
So between his assigned statements of “Delmon was not a problem, not an issue, and I would hate to think that somebody would think it was,” etc., Gardenhire couldn’t hold back from calling him stubborn, uncoachable, and unwilling to follow the program or understand what the Twins are all about. I can only conclude that he just really can’t stand the guy.
If this was the first day of Spring Training, I’d be fine with putting him on notice by telling him that if he wants playing time he has to shape up with his attitude. But at the Winter Meetings? If you really don’t like a guy, that’s the time to pump up his trade value by saying he has a wonderful attitude and did everything we asked of him, he has a bright future here, yadda yadda. That Gardenhire just can’t hold back, even in this context, speaks volumes. In fact I would now guess that the impetus to trade him is coming in large part from Gardenhire
If he happens to be playing poker at the Bellagio...
Can someone lend me like 3 grand and book my plane ticket? I’ll pay you back next week. :)
Sabathia 7 years $160M
Sherman: Sabathia will sign with Yankees
Ken Rosenthal reports that NY upped their offer from 6/140 to 7/160.
JJ Hardy
With this signing I bet JJ Hardy can now be had for some pitching.
Hardy
I understand the sticking point to be including Slowey/Baker instead of Perkins/Blackburn.
IF we could get a pitcher elsewhere, I’d consider Slowey for Hardy.
Otherwise, would Milwaukee consider Perkins-Bonser-Swarzak/Humber/Mulvey/Duensing/Manship for Hardy? They’re not hot on Perkins, but if additional arms are included, it may help out their bullpen chealpy.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
J.J. Putz
Tigers talking to Seattle about Puts. Could include Jeff Larish, who could play 3B.
This could potentially free up Adrian Beltre in a trade…perhaps reduce the asking price.
Mark Derosa
According to LEN3 the Twins talked to the Cubs about Derosa. I hadnt heard his name kicked around much but it’s intriguing to say the least. Derosa has a .370+ OBP the last two seasons. He’s only under contract for one year but if he could be had at a decent cost then I’d be all for it. The Padres want pitching and that’s where whoever we sent the Cubs would likely end up.
Derosa could play 2B or 3B next year for us, however I’d really want us to make one more move for a long term solution at either 2B or SS. I’m all for a one or two year plug in at 3B as I’m confident one of our own prospects will turn out to be ok.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
I'd be happy with DeRosa
as one piece, we still need to fill the other.
I’m getting a nagging suspicion that we may trade for DeRosa as our 3B solution and then resign Punto at SS.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
I'd rather have DeRosa at second,
and then swing a deal for Ty Wigginton at third.
Two underwhelming moves, but they’d make this team better.
Or better yet,
in order to facilitate the Cubs-Padres-Twins deal, the Twins could get both DeRosa and Kouzmanoff.
The Cubs get Jake Peavy, the Padres get something from the Cubs and perhaps Luke Hughes and a pitcher from the Twins?
I don’t have it worked out, but this is a situation where all three teams could come out winners.
Not enough
It would take more than that for us to get DeRosa and Kouzmanoff. Over at Vikes Talk we’ve speculated that the following might get it done.
Twins give up Young, Blackburn, prospect. Twins get Kouzmanoff, DeRosa, Gaudin.
SD gives up Peavy, Kouzmanoff. SD gets Young, Marshall, Blackburn, prospects from MN and Cubs
Chicago gives up Marshall, DeRosa, Gaudin, prospect(s). Get Peavy.
In this scenario, I’m probably OK with the balance from our end, but Chicago may not be giving up enough and SD may not be getting enough. What do you think?
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
I knew that wasn't enough...
…I was more or less thinking it out as I typed. There’s definitely more that would need to be involved.
Underwhelming
but they feel like Twins moves, and they probably would not break up our young core.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 12:24 PM EST up reply actions
Derosa's HR
Don’t get too excited about his 21 homers as his previous 3 best years were 13, 10, and 8. So unless he’s found some old man strength I would be surprised if he touches 20 again.
This is his career batting line but he’s definitely shown improvement in the last few years. I like him at the right price (a pitching prospect or two from the lower levels w/ potential, not a MLB starter).
.279 .348 .422
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
He's been much better since becoming a full-time player.
From ‘06 – ’08, he’s hit .291/.368/.453…but I think his real value probably falls somewhere between that line and his career line.
Pop-up homers
I saw him hit 2 or 3 homers that were pop-ups that caught the wind and blew out. They were in key moments of the game too.
Still he’s a good hitter, good clubhouse guy and I’d be happy if we got him.
Wrigley Field
Not exactly a big field…
But I like the idea of Mark Derosa way more than other names I’ve been hearing. I would be very happy with that 3 way trade especially if we get someone like Gaudin for the pen (or as a starter).
If Chicago's coming back with a list of pitchers for DeRosa
We should also be asking San Diego for the same (including position players) that they’d take for Kouzmanoff. That’s how we do this three way trade.
Chicago: DeRosa and Gaudin for Blackburn and prospect. – Makes sense to me. Blackburn could really thrive in SD, fewer HR in Petco. Blackburn is more valuable than DeRosa, so Gaudin for prospects helps to balance it out.
San Diego: Young for Kouzmanoff – Makes sense for us, may not be equal value for Young. Works for SD, since Headley could move to 3B and SD finally gets a corner OF.
A question for the group. Would you do the exact same trade, except with Denard Span instead of Delmon Young? More palatable or less palatable?
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
less palatable
because we are getting a hitter in DeRosa and more power in Kouzmanoff to offset what Young was to provide. There is no speed in the deal to offset Span, although DeRosa could leadoff with the .370 obp.
I'm with you
Span has real value as our leadoff hitter. .387 OBP with speed is exactly what we need in front of Mauer and Morneau…
I’d only be willing to deal Span if we got a leadoff hitter elsewhere (Furcal, Roberts). I’d prefer not to go with Casilla leading off, at least not at this point in his career.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
Span is not on the table
The Twins would need to be blown away. They reportedly turned down Seattle when it asked for APn as part of the Beltre deal. Ditto Colorado as part of the Atkins deal. Beltre>Atkins>Kouzmanoff.
And no, I would not trade Span stright up for Kouzmanoff. I think Young is more valuable than Kouzmanofff, wo it might take a second player to make it work with Young. But I suspect the three-way deal that Jesse outlines above but involving Young and an arm is more realistic.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Delmon
I like Delmon better and I think he’ll be the better hitter and give us a nice righthanded power bat hitting 20 to 25 homers. I also though Mauer would hit more homers and that hasn’t happened yet either. However without us getting another leadoff type guy (Derosa could be) I don’t see us dealing away Span. It really comes down to the value that the Padres would put on those two players. If we could get away with giving up Duensing instead of Blackburn depending on how they value the two OF then I’d lean that way.
I think us giving up both Young and Blackburn for Kouzmanoff/Derosa would be a lot however if you throw in a decent reliever it may be worth it.
I’m not a big fan of us trading Young in the first place on top of that I’d rather we go for a short term option at 3B and long term at SS as we don’t have as good of prospects at SS/2B as we do at 3B. BELTRE AND FURCAL IN 09!!!
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
I'm not as high on Young as Span
It’s tough to develop true lead-off hitters. We haven’t had one around here since Knoblauch. Also, Span’s defense is very good. Young’s, not so much. All things considered, I prefer Span.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
ADRIAN!!
I would really really like to see Beltre as a twin. That would be amazing. Behind Morneau… oh baby..
I haven't heard anything
about the Twins and Adrian Beltre these last three days. With all the other names kicking around right now, I don’t think he’s very high on the list of players the Twins are likely to end up with.
I'm guessing he's a backup option
and the Peavy trade talks are on the front burner now. If we don’t end up doing something there, or directly with SD for Kouzmanoff, then perhaps we go to Seattle. Just my speculation.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
On that trade
Cubs receive Peavy
Padres receive Young, Bonser and three Cubs prospects
Twins receive DeRosa and Kouzmanoff.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I'd do in a heartbeat as well
Trading Young and Bonser for DeRosa and Kouzmanoff? Sign me up.
However, from a SD perspective, is Bonser a better pitching option than some of the others I’ve heard from Baltimore (Olson), Philadelphia (Kendrick), etc.?
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
I just threw Bonser out there
…because his name has been in the rumors. But the Twins are loaded with attractive pitching prospects: Mulvey, Duensing, Swarzak, Manship…
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
For the record
I would give up Young, Bonser and Duensing or Manship (but not Mulvey or Swarzak) to get both Kouzmanoff and DeRosa. ALternatively, keep Bonser for the pen and send Duensing and Manship to the Pads along with Young for Kouzmanoff and DeRosa.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I'd do that.
And I have to admit it does seem quite likely that any deal would probably involve Young, I’d just prefer if they could do it without trading him.
Agree
While a deal would probably require Young, I’d prefer to get a trade done without him as well.
Heck, why can’t we send two pitchers directly to SD in exchange for Kouzmanoff? Then we can target other 2B/SS options such as Escobar, Furcal, Roberts, Hudson, etc.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 10, 2008 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah
But I think the Twins are determined to take the best available options and “get after them” to use Antony’s words. The Cubs and Pads need a third man in for this fight, and it would be silly not to at least try to get all the pieces you need out of it if they fit.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Carrie Muskat vehemently disagrees.
It’s the Cubs-Pads-Phillies or nobody, dammit!
Actually, judging from the things she says, I’d guess that a trade of Mark DeRosa is right around the corner. But, I’ve been wrong before.
I don't get it
Where did she “vehemently disagree” ? She said they don’t want to deal Derosa but I don’t see how she was forceful or angry? Sorry, just think maybe you’re reading too much into it.
Anyhow, I’m all for the Twins trying to give up more pitching than give up Delmon Young.
We have so many guys that are major league ready or very close to major league ready. Why not give up some combo of Swarzak/Duensing/Mulvey/Humber/Blackburn/Perkins/Manship/Bonser. Damn, we have a lot of guys there. We could also consider some of our younger guys like Robertson/McCardell/Bromberg etc. We’d only want to give up one of Blackburn/Perkins but I think somewhere in that glut of talent we could find someone capable of filling a 5th starter role and someone who could be our backup. Besides, Livan is still on the market, why not sign him, guys a wily crafty gutsy gamer veteran.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
You're right.
I’m definitely blowing it out of proportion, but I’m doing it on purpose. The wording struck me as funny. In particular it was the last sentence: “There also is no pressure on the Cubs to get something done.” Why even say that? Did she feel like The World was putting too much pressure on the Cubs to trade DeRosa? It gives off a whole “We’ll deal him when we want to deal him and only then, dammit!” vibe. It’s like a subordinate coming up to you at work at telling you that, just so you know, they’re doing their job right now.
I agree with your point on the pitching depth, and I think that this year that’s something the Twins are trying to use to their advantage. The Brewers, the Padres, the Astros…any number of those teams would be happy to take on young pitching in a deal.
That's true
Saying the Cubs are in no hurry was kind of odd. The fact is I don’t think that’s true. Especially with CC signing I could see another club finding a way to get in on Peavy. If we see Burnett and Sheets sign too then the Peavey market might expand rather quickly.
The Cubs should strike quickly while they don’t have as much competition.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
Not enough
unless the Padres really value Young. I could see Bonser and maybe one of our lower level pitching prospects that have good potential but not just Bonser.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
"Also, she spelled "Phillies" incorrectly."
I think you meant to say:
Also, she spelled “Twins” incorrectly.
Delmon Young
and Probably Slowey..Perkins or Blackburn would have to be included in that deal….But i tell ya this..If the Twins Trade Francisco Liriano…I’m a Brewers Fan.
MLB Trade Rumors.com
Says the Cubs will be giving the twins a list of pitchers they want…Hopefully they can Land DeRosa.
CC Sabathia Got Way Too Much Money…Wholy Shit….Just shows that the MLB should have a Damn Salary Cap….Players Like Sabathia and Santana shouldnt be able to Make this Much Damn Money.
The thing with those outrageous salaries,
is that baseball can afford it. What would you have them do with all that extra revenue if they started a salary cap?
Personally I’d shuttle more of it into the community, into things for fans as well, and improvements on at-the-game activities and infrastructure. But I don’t think that will happen anytime soon.
The Players
Getting the money is better than that owners getting it and because they ain’t going to reduce ticket prices it’s the lessor of 2 evils.
1941 .406
Not so,
the problem with the “the players getting the money” over the owners, is that only about 5 teams can pay outrageous saleries. that means eventually, with out a cap, most teams are relegated to AAAA status. good only for developing the stars that will play for those 5 teams.
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Dec 10, 2008 6:00 PM EST up reply actions
I don't
think that is true a lot of the top FA get signed by the same teams, teams that can sign young players to LT contracts can keep competitive.
1941 .406
Mid Market
teams will never be able to sign their players to 100+ million doller contracts, and if and when they try, they will not be able to play competative base ball, since tehy will have one player and a bunch of scrubs for the rest of the contract.
Will the Real Thor Please Stand Up ... ?
by the Real Thor on Dec 11, 2008 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
Would you really want to
sign players to 100MM contracts even if you could? Elite hitters maybe but Pitchers almost certainly no.
1941 .406
Depends
I’d do it for Sabathia cause he’s still young and he’s never been injured. I would not have done it with Santana because of his injury history.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Tip of the iceberg
WFAN in New York reported this morning that the Yankees have a 4 year $60M offer on the table to Derek Lowe and 5 years $91M offer to A.J. Burnett. It’s conceivable that they could leave this week with Sabathia, Burnett and Lowe…
by Adam Peterson on Dec 11, 2008 7:40 AM EST up reply actions
Another correction
Block said Duensing is a right hander. Actually he is a lefty in the mold of Glen Perkins.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I want to say that I like the idea of DeRosa if it isn’t one of the big time pitchers. More so, I like the idea of Kouzmanoff and DeRosa. I wish something more would happen with this.
by Twins Territory on Dec 10, 2008 7:38 PM EST reply actions
Looks like the indians just traded Guitierez for Luis Valbuena and Joe Smith. Joe Smith is a pretty decent reliever and Valbuena came out of nowhere last year for the Mariners, but still projects to be somewhere between a backup and league average. Looks like the Tigers and Indians and taking small steps forward.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2008 12:53 AM EST reply actions
...while the Twins play blackjack...
Nothing unusual here. Just a bunch of Norwegian white boys having fun in Vegas. :)
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by Andersklasen on Dec 11, 2008 1:44 AM EST up reply actions
Mariners trade Putz to the Mets
Mets get Putz as setup man in huge trade
Sounds like the Mets have traded for Putz as an 8th inning setup guy. Three way trade including the Indians.
Mets get Putz, Jeremy Reed, Sean Green
Mariners get Aaron Heilman, Endy Chavez, Jason Vargas, Franklin Gutierrez, three minor leaguers
Indians get Joe Smith, Luis Valbuena
I understand that Seattle overplayed its hand a bit with Detroit, asking for both Larish and Joyce in exchange for Putz. Detroit was willing to include one, but not both.
What does this mean for the Twins? Seattle did not pick up a 3B in this deal (don’t know about minor leaguers though), but they did pick up Gutierrez. Along with Balentien and Ichiro they have completed their OF. Means trading Delmon Young for a Beltre package probably won’t happen. Not that it would have made much sense, Beltre’s not enough to trade Delmon straight up.
Other trade news
Edwin Jackson traded for Matt Joyce
Also, heard on XM that Melky Cabrera is going to Milwaukee for Mike Cameron. I haven’t seen anything confirming this.
I saw it on a couple of sites
It looks to me like the Rays definately got the better of this deal. Jackson had kind of a flukey season – no real improvement in any of his peripherals but posted a lower ERA. Look for his ERA to be close to 5 this year.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2008 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
I agree
Jackson’s control problems have been an issue for some time. Detroit may not have gotten any better through this trade.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 11, 2008 10:06 AM EST up reply actions
LEN3 on DeRosa and others
Says Twins are out of the Peavy three way trade…for now. Wonders why the Twins could not step in and take Jason Marquis (and his $9.875M salary) to make the trade work. Speculates SD may be asking for Slowey, which is a bridge too far.
Says there could be problems with Beltre and his limited no trade clause.
Sounds like he’s as frustrated as many of us:
“It’s not time to be an alarmist but the Twins better do more this offseason than re-sign Nick Punto.”
“Man, the team I cover never makes a trade here…”
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