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The Run Value of Swapping Liriano and Livan

Pretty much everybody around here seems to want to ditch Livan Hernandez in favor of Francisco Liriano, the Second Coming of Johan "Should've Won 3 Cy Young Awards By Now" Santana. So, much like I did with the question of batting Gomez 9th, I decided to grab some perspective by calculating the added run value of simply releasing Hernandez and calling up Liriano to take his place.

My question is this: How many more runs will the Twins prevent the opposition from scoring if Liriano gets Livan's remaining 11 starts?

Creating projections

First we need to gauge each player's true talent level. This is easy to do for Hernandez; I just plug his stats and birth date into The Hardball Times' in-season Marcel projection spreadsheet. This yields that Livan should be good for a 4.74 (fielding independent) ERA over the remainder of the season, meaning that his aggregate ERA for the 2008 season would end up at 5.11.

It's a bit more difficult for Liriano, since I want to base my analysis on his excellent work in Rochester this year as well. It's not right to just plug in his minor league totals, since the level of competition obviously doesn't match what he would face in MLB, and furthermore, Marcel bases its projections on major league averages.

Thus, I went to Baseball Prospectus to look up Liriano's minor leagues stats translated to a major league context. This transforms the Franchise's 3.10 International League DERA (defense independent ERA) into a 4.09 major league DERA. I typed the relevant translated statistics into the Marcel pitcher projection spreadsheet as a separate 2008 row, and voilà: We get a 3.63 true talent ERA for Liriano.

The big (?) difference

Having done the above, it's easy to see how many runs Liriano would save more than Livan. Over 9 innings, Liriano is projected to allow 1.11 runs less than Hernandez, which is 0.123 runs per IP. The Twins have 55 games left to play in the 2008 season, so that's probably around 11 remaining starts per spot in the starting rotation. Hence, if the Twins swapped Francisco and Livan right now, it would probably affect approximately 66 remaining IP (6 innings a start seems about right to me).

Multiplication shows that Liriano is then worth 8.14 runs more than Livan from this point of the season and out.

Conclusion

As in the case with Gomez, the added run value is quite a bit smaller than I expected. 8 runs is equivalent to a little less than one win in the standings. Now, one might argue that Liriano's projections are a bit conservative, since he has pitched way better as of late, and we should probably assign more weight to these stats than to the stats from the beginning of the season. However, I don't think this would change the result much.

Still, the Twins need to do this move. If they can trade Hernandez before the deadline, they would only gain from that on the major league level and maybe receive some fringe prospect as icing on the cake. It would also help Liriano's development tremendeously, as he is obviously getting tired of fanning AAA batters.

Whatever "veteran presence" Hernandez provides, it can't possibly outweigh the positives of having Francisco take his spot in the rotation.

That's my two cents - what are your thoughts?

2 recs  |  Comment 10 comments

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Good post

But baseball is entertainment. And with the Twins 1/2 out of first and a huge crowd on hand, my grandma and I were subjected to Livan, Boof, and Bass. Yeesh. How is this team contending again?

by wcooley on Jul 31, 2008 8:45 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Livan

I don’t expect Livan to put up an ERA as low as 4.74 ERA over the rest of the season (unless I am misunderstanding this number). He seems to be deteriorating, not improving.

by snolls on Jul 31, 2008 9:23 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Easy equation

Liriano > Livan.

It’s not hard. The Twins should do their fans the service of putting the best team on the field. Period.

by Neil on Jul 31, 2008 9:53 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree

Going along with your equation analogy, I just wanted to estimate the difference “Liriano minus Livan”. We all know it’s a positive number; however, I think people would disagree wildly about just how big the number is.

When watching Livan and reading about Francisco in AAA I had the feeling that the swap could maybe be worth as much as three og four wins for the Twins, but the numbers tell us otherwise (and if Livan’s true talent level is something like a 5.30 ERA instead, the benefit is still less than two wins).

by PhoenixV on Jul 31, 2008 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Question

For the people who believe in Livan’s veteran presence helping the team out: how come Livan can’t provide his veteran presence while taking Bass’s role as mop up guy?

by Hoya on Jul 31, 2008 11:17 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Good question.

I brought this up a couple of weeks ago and was shot down. If they can’t trade him, but they can trade Boof, this makes the most sense. Plus it gives them their “backup” starter, right there in the bullpen. Warm, comfortable blanket!

by Jesse on Jul 31, 2008 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because Livan is a veteran

and grizzled veterans dont get treated that way by Gardenhire or the Twins organization and there is something to be said for that. The org needs to try and trade Livan to someone else who will let him start if that is what he wants BEFORE they just decide you are not good enough so we will demote you.

Not saying he shouldn’t be demoted, but that he deserves the respect of trying every other option first – including DFA if that is what he prefers. That is treating him with respect and being treated with respect goes a long way with players.

by montanatwinsfan on Jul 31, 2008 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

They should try talking to him.

What veteran wouldn’t welcome a conversation, even one that says, “look, you’ve been outperformed by the young kids. What are you open to?” If he’s not open to playing in a relief role, cut him. If he is, do it. Nothing bad could come from a simple conversation.

by Neil on Jul 31, 2008 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Respect

Veterens get treated that way all the time when they stop performing.

And it isn’t like a marginal reputation with veterens is going to hurt the Twins anyway. So what, the next Sidney Ponson or Livan Hernandez won’t want to come here? it isn’t like we ever sign good veterens anyway.

Maybe all these old guys always want to come here because we kiss washed up guys’ asses so much. Maybe the Tony Batistas of the world see that we’ll let him start no matter how bad he is just because he’s been around a long time.

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Jul 31, 2008 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hear, hear

New slogan: At the Metrodome, every day is Veterans Day!

by PhoenixV on Jul 31, 2008 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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