Open Thread: Twins @ Red Sox Recap

by Jesse on Jul 7, 2008 10:00 PM EDT in Game Recaps Comment 16 comments

July 7, 2008.

Hey all, I'm in bed by the time this one wraps up, so here's your chance to let the site know your brilliant thoughts on tonight's match-up! As usual...some questions to get us started...

* How did Baker perform tonight versus your expectations? Better? Worse? About the same?

* What was the breaking point?

* What's the Twins highlight of the game?

* Who gets your star(s) of the game?

See you tomorrow, we'll finally get to some more of those mid-season grades!

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Sox Game 1

A rare bad call by Gardy putting Bass in for the 8th … not good. I know they are looking to give him big innings, but today was not the proper stage. Bad call, Gardy. Should have gone Guerrier or Crain. Oh well … Delmon Young—6 LOB! I’m trying to be patient folks. Trying …

by VikeFan333 on Jul 7, 2008 10:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

The highlight for the Twins was the pitching of Scott baker. No contest. It seemed he scouted Boston’s hitters very well, and pitched out of a couple of jams, including the bases loaded with 1 out. Great game by Baker, as he continues his push to be the ace of the staff.

by matty_b on Jul 7, 2008 10:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Why Bass?

I thought the pecking order was:

Nathan
Guerrier
Crain
Reyes
Bass
Breslow
Bonser

So it’s a 0-0 game and Crain hasn’t pitched in a few days, so why bring in Bass? I’d like to here Gardy’s explanation on that one.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Jul 7, 2008 11:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hell I would have taken anyone not named Boof in that situation. I saw Bass warming up in the bottom of the 7th along with Reyes and was screaming at my TV even then

What would my life be like without the '91 World Series?

by MJesser on Jul 7, 2008 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1

As was I. Still, I’m more upset that Monroe couldn’t come up with the sac fly (since he was in the game). He should not be on our team.

by snolls on Jul 7, 2008 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

+2

I was screaming at my radio. Why is he not willing to bring in Crain in a tie game?

http://noblingblings.blogspot.com/

by Aaron Fix on Jul 8, 2008 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Props

for listening on the radio. It’s underrated normally, but with John Gordan you’re lucky to come out with your ears not bleeding.

Here is my take, from my blog:

” Both Baker and Mauer had outstanding games. Mauer had obviously done his homework and knew exactly what pitch to throw to each batter. Baker went seven solid innings giving up only two hits and allowing no runs. He struck out seven batters and walked two men in the process. After the seventh inning finished up I thought Baker would come out in the eighth to continue his dominance. I was shocked to find out that I was dead wrong.

-Nothing against Brian Bass, or Ron Gardenhire, but they were the wrong people for the job tonight. Bass has been used sparingly in recent weeks, only logging 11 innings of work since June 15. The decision to actually put a reliever in was also questionable. Before tonight’s game Baker had an average of 84.2 pitches thrown per game. This is quite low, but I’m sure he would have been capable of finishing out at least one more inning. Don’t tell me the adrenaline wasn’t there.

-Nevertheless, Brian Bass came in and threw a first pitch 90-mph slider to Dustin Pedrioa which he promptly drilled down the left-field line. The ball was about a foot from a home run, and six inches from being a foul ball as it slammed into the Monster.

Bass then proceeded to throw three 90-mph fastballs (the first low, the second high, and the third right down Broadway) to J.D. Drew. He grounded out, but advanced Pedroia to third.

Then good ‘ol Manny stepped to the plate. After being criticized for taking three straight strikes to end the Red Sox hopes the night before, he wanted to be the hero tonight. He was. Bass threw him six straight fastballs; the first 95-mph, the second 94, and the next four 96. On the sixth pitch Manny hit a ground ball on the right side that snaked into the outfield, scoring the one and only run of the game. Bass then walked Mike Lowell on four pitches and was taken from the game. “

Twins Fix
http://www.twinsfix.com

Bleacher Report Senior Writer:
http://bleacherreport.com/users/4918-Andrew_Kneeland

Check them out!

by Andersklasen on Jul 8, 2008 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Quite upset

I was very pumped up come the 8th inning having been watching the gamecast during my night class. I literally ran from the class room to the bar during Okajima’s pitching change. After Morneau’s walk I was a amped a little more thinking, ‘Alright, Kubel isn’t the strongest bat against lefties, but he can do this.’

Unfortunately Gardy decided to replace the teams 3 best hitter and made the switch. Which I would be ok with if we had a good option. But he decided to put in the lefty-masher who has mashed those lefties to the tune of 228/259/415 over the last two years in about 200 plate appearances. The guy who hasn’t hit lefties particularly well since 2005, at least not for a guy that’s supposed to be able to hit lefties.

But Monroe got the at-bat. Not the guy who’s had similar problems hitting lefties this year but has proved as recently as last year that he could hit lefties pretty well with a 897 OPS. Not even the guy who has hit lefties to the tune of 361/413/454 from ‘05 to present. Those would be Harris and Redmond respectively. Nope, we went with the true masher.

But whatever. That’s a relatively small misstep compared to the removal of Baker for Brian Bass. First of all, if you decide that you are going to keep Baker under 100 pitches instead of letting him go out for the eighth with a short leash whatever. I don’t think it’s the right decision, but it’s the common decision these days.

Secondly, Guerrier should have been available. If you have determined that Guerrier is the set up man, then there is no need to have used him in Saturday’s game with a three run lead. But even so Crain, Breslow, and even Bonser should probably be options before Brian Bass. It is just inexcusable. Just completely baffling. Everyone knew it was the wrong decision before it was even done.

Lastly, do you pitch to Manny in that situation? It’s easy to second guess now, but Manny is still a world class hitter and by far the best hitter on that squad. I’m in the camp of not letting their best hitter beat you. I would have been fine if they walked Manny and made Lowell and Youkilis beat them. What do you all think?

by Milt on Tilt on Jul 8, 2008 2:06 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Baker

According to JoeC at the Strib, Baker said he was finished. (it was super muggy in Boston yesterday. An hour before the game, I clicked over for weather conditions and saw the dew point was a tropical 75 degrees and an air temp of 82. ugly stuff!). So I dont have a probably with Gardy taking Baker out. Putting Bass in was a mistake. I dont know, its like Gardy wanted to see if Bass could do an high pressure 8th inning situation. Anyway, if you walk Manny, you gotta face Lowell and Youkilis next, both of those player are no easy outs. It stinks not having Neshek around for a game like that!

I have also stated my postion on PH Monroe there. I had no problems with it

by DedicatedFollowerOfFashion on Jul 8, 2008 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Monroe

I didn’t have a problem with moving Monroe in the DH spot either. He’s 2-2 in pinch hitting this year with two bombs. Not bad. True, he’s not that good against right handers this year, but he has improved tremendously.

Kubel still can’t hit lefties too well, so there, I think Gardy made the right move. But Bass? Nope … Not close to being sold on him yet. I miss Patty ..

by VikeFan333 on Jul 8, 2008 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

righties and lefties

Contrary to what you said, Monroe is actually very good against right-handers and horrendous against left-handers this year. He is actually hitting .141 against lefties, with a pathetic .250 slugging percentage.

Of course, Kubel is pretty horrendous as well. As others have mentioned in this discussion, there were better pinch-hit options than Monroe, if you must pinch-hit for Kubel.

http://noblingblings.blogspot.com/

by Aaron Fix on Jul 8, 2008 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't trust anyone not named Nathan in that situation

Going with Bass was weak, but I cringe if it’s Crain or Guerrier too. I know you’re getting sick of me saying it but Neshek’s injury really hurt this team because there’s no one dominant in the pen besides Nathan.

Seriously how expensive would it be to get Heath Bell or Mike Adams from San Diego? Would Boof or Tolbert do the trick?

by TMW on Jul 8, 2008 10:55 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No,

I’d say move Perkins back to the ‘Pen and bring Liriano up.

Twins Fix
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Bleacher Report Senior Writer:
http://bleacherreport.com/users/4918-Andrew_Kneeland

Check them out!

by Andersklasen on Jul 8, 2008 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Are you joking?

You know he hasn’t allowed more than 3 ER in an outing since 6/4 right?

by TMW on Jul 8, 2008 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

And also

His WHIP is 1.48. I want a reliever not named Nathan or Reyes that’s going to have a WHIP under 1.15. The White Sox have 4, we have 2 with 1 of them being the 1-out situational guy. We’re really vulnerable in tight games, the White Sox are not.

by TMW on Jul 8, 2008 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah...

Plus, the Twins would have to send a guy through waivers to make that move, and I seriously doubt any of the demotion candidates (Bass, Boof, Breslow) would make it through unclaimed. The upside is a potential, albeit not anything close to guaranteed, upgrade to the starting rotation and a small upgrade in the back end of the bullpen (Perkins wouldn’t displace Crain, Guerrier, or Reyes from their 7th/8th/LOOGY roles, so he’d just replace Bass as the long man); the downside is that you are basically giving away a guy who could potentially be a useful player at some point – I’m not convinced that Boof can’t be salvaged, and while Bass isn’t any great shakes, he also isn’t outright bad.

Besides, if I were going to release a guy to shore up the bullpen, I’d bring up Korecky – I think it’s more likely that he improves the ‘pen than that Liriano improves the rotation.

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Jul 8, 2008 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs