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Target Offseason

With the Twins headed to Target Field in 2010, they should focus on fixing and filling the glaring holes that they have on their team.  With the burden of the dome off their backs, Target Field will bring in additional revenue for the Twins to use in the upcoming years, but for this offseason, why not spend a little more then your payroll?  The Twins managed to sneak away with the Central Division in Game 163, but they lacked fire power in the NY series (again!), going 3 and out.  The Twins must fix their needs this offseason in order to bring October Baseball into Target Field in its opening year.

Star-divide

The Twins need quite a number of factors to fit in with their already strongly built foundation.  All of these factors may not have to be filled this offseason, but certainly I expect and hope for a few of them to be filled.

Twins Needs:  SP (Ace type), 2B, SS, 3B, RP

Twins Excess:  LF/RF, Utility, 2B, Minor League (AAAA)

  • Starting Pitchers:  Before the Trade Deadline, the Twins acquired Carl Pavano, who did quite well for the Twins down the stretch in helping securing a post season berth.  I would not at all be averse to the Twins bringing back Pavs for another season, but I would like them to look at a few names before deciding to bring him back.

Erik Bedard, Ben Sheets, Rich Harden, Chris Capuano, Doug Davis, Justin Duchscherer, Jon Garland, Brandon Webb, Jarrod Washburn, Brad Penny...

All of the above pitchers have their ups and downs, but all are pitchers who I would approve in a Twins uniform.  Of the above pitchers that I see joining the Twins, Doug Davis, Jon Garland and Jarrod Washburn are the only pitchers that I can reasonably see in the Twins uniform for the right money.

Pretend for a minute that the Twins did sign Doug Davis.  The Twins starting rotation would then look like this:  Baker, Slowey, Duensing, Blackburn, and Davis.

Seth Stoh's presents an argument for the Twins to attempt to sign Florida Marlins ace Josh Johnson.  Do I think that this is a good idea?  For the right money, I do.  If the Twins could get Josh Johnson for Delmon Young + Philip Humber + Tolbert/Casilla/Buscher, I would think that it was a very good deal for the Twins.

  • Second Base:  At second base this year, the Twins ran into multiple problems.  Casilla started off the year at 2B, batting second in the order.  Due to mental issues on defense, and his inability to advance Span or be the second leadoff hitter, Casilla was quickly demoted.  Then, Gardenhire tried Tolbert, whose first round with the Twins was a disaster.  Then, Gardy stuck Punto there, who he seemed to like in that spot, and Punto held 2B for the remainder of the year, despite hitting .212 prior to September.

The Twins must find a way to finally solve the roller coaster ride at 2B.  Since Luis Castillo, the Twins have had troubles finding the perfect 2B -  a high OBP, low SLG, above average defender.  Who is available for the Twins on the FA market?

Akinori Iwamura, Orlando Hudson, Felipe Lopez, Mark DeRosa, Placido Polanco

Those are the 2B that I could stomach seeing in the blue and red of the Minnesota uniform next season.  Polanco is a Type A, Central Division foe, 2B.  Twins are leery of offering deals to type A players, let alone from the Central Division.  An exemption to that was made this past season when the Twins obtained Joe Crede from the White Sox.  However, would the Twins be willing to give up a draft pick to the Tigers for Polanco?  I do not think so.  Polanco certainly fits the Twins idea of a 2B and Gardy would love his production in the lineup.  However, his type A status especially, will be the downfall of Polanco.

I personally would like to see Akinori Iwamura (only because Hudson will most probably be out of our price range).  Iwamura is the prototypical Twins 2B and would fit nicely in the 2/8 spot in the order.  Iwamura provides solid defense and a steady bat and would be a great addition for the Twins at 2 years/8 million (Punto money).

  • Shortstop:  While the Twins went out at the Trade Deadline and signed Orlando Cabrera, who helped the Twins win the Central Division, I do not believe that he will be back in the Twins uniform.  Cabrera certainly helped develop some of the young latin Twins players and provided his normal last minute heroics in game 163.  Shorstop has been another gaping hole for the Twins since they traded away Bartlett, but especially moreso since the days of Cristian Guzman.  Gardy has tried Punto, Harris, Tolbert, Castro, and others at SS but has found nobody (at least to Twins fans liking) in any of his experiments.

Once again, this roller coaster must be solved quickly as Twins fans get impatient for the coming of a new SS with no prospects on the immediate horizon.  Who is available?

Orlando Cabrera, Marco Scutaro, Miguel Tejada, John McDonald, and J.J. Hardy (via trade)

The Twins could always bring back Cabrera, but I hope they do not try him out again unless they sign a decent 2B.  Scutaro and Tejada will be out of the Twins price range.  McDonald is a Punto type player but with better defense; if he can be had for 1 year/2 million, I would like him over Punto at SS, but again this must come with the condition of a decent 2B, as I would not like a middle infield of Punto/McDonald - entire defense, zip for offense.

Personally, I would love it if the Twins would chase and obtain J.J. Hardy from the Brewers.  Hardy had a bad season in 2009, and was sent down in August to AAA, while Escobar was brought up.  The Brewers appear set to trade Hardy as the management really likes Escobar's potential.  With Hardy's bad season and his demotion, the common idea is that Hardy could be had for a middle rotation pitcher plus a low ball prospect.  A trade that I would propose to the Brewers would be Perkins plus Bromberg.  Bromberg is high on the Twins list, but a low ball pitcher and certainly with the Twins ability to gauge players potential, they will quickly be able to fill in his vacancy.'

If Perkins plus Bromberg, or Perkins + McCardell/Fox/Mullins/Waldrop, I would hope that the Twins would obtain Hardy.  With the addition of Hardy, they would solidify SS for a couple years and possibly more, if the Hardy is open to an extension.

  • Third Base:  The Twins signed Joe Crede for 3B in 2009 and Crede did an admirable job in his year.  Would the Twins possibly be open to bringing Crede back for another year while Valencia develops some more in the minors?  Maybe, and Crede looks to be the only option on the market.

Personally, I see the Twins standing pat at 3B this offseason, or possibly bringing back Crede, again on an incentive based contract.  I see the Twins starting the year with Crede or Harris/Tolbert/Punto at 3B, then bringing Valencia up at the end of May/beginning of June.  The Twins appear comfortable with Valencia, and I do not see any reason to cheat Valencia of his opportunity to prove his worth.

  • Relief Pitchers:  Twins management signed Jon Rauch and Ron Mahay in August to complete their midseason trades.  Twins bullpen improved greatly with these signings and I see no reason for the Twins not to bring these pitchers back this next year.  Still, its always good to see what is available among the RP FA Market.

The only names I am really interested in on the free agent market are Chad Cordero and Brandon Lyon, and I see the Twins bringing back Ron Mahay, who will also be in his FA year.  Lyon is a type B, former Detroit Tiger.  I see the Twins pursuing Lyon, though with several pitchers coming off the DL in 2010, I cannot see an aggressive pursuit of the Lyon.  Twins will have Pat Neshek and Boof Bonser back in 2010.  Neshek and Bonser provide the Twins with two missing pieces and allow the Twins to cut some fat (i.e. Bobby Keppel).

If the Twins go with their traditional 12 man staff, 7 of which will be relief pitchers, here is who I envision in the Twins bullpen in 2010.

  1. Nathan - CL
  2. Rauch - SU
  3. Mijares - SU
  4. Guerrier - SU
  5. Neshek - MR
  6. Mahay - LOOGY
  7. Bonser/Liriano - LR

Who do I hope to see out of Minnesota come 2010?:

Delmon Young, Matt Tolbert/Alexi Casilla, Brian Buscher, Bobby Keppel, Glen Perkins, Jesse Crain

Of all the above positions that I have outlined, who do I want the most from every position?:

Doug Davis/Josh Johnson - SP, Akinori Iwamuri - 2B, J.J. Hardy - SS, Joe Crede - 3B, Brandon Lyon - RP

In the above Q&A, Who do I see in a Twins uniform next season?

Doug Davis, J.J. Hardy

Ideal Twins Staff:

  1. Johnson - SP
  2. Baker  - SP
  3. Slowey  - SP
  4. Blackburn - SP
  5. Duensing - SP
  1. Span - LF
  2. Hardy - SS
  3. Mauer - C
  4. Morneau - 1B
  5. Kubel - DH
  6. Cuddyer - RF
  7. Crede - 3B
  8. Iwamura - 2B
  9. Gomez - CF
  1. Redmond/Morales - backup C
  2. Tolbert - Utility
  3. Valencia - 3B
  4. Strong Bench Bat
  1. Nathan - CL
  2. Rauch - SU
  3. Guerrier - SU
  4. Mijares - SU
  5. Lyon - SU
  6. Mahay - LOOGY
  7. Bonser/Liriano - LR

Realistic 2010 Twins Staff:

  1. Baker - SP
  2. Slowey - SP
  3. Davis - SP
  4. Blackburn - SP
  5. Duensing - SP
  1. Span - LF
  2. Hardy - SS
  3. Mauer - C
  4. Morneau - 1B
  5. Kubel - DH
  6. Cuddyer - RF
  7. Valencia - 3B
  8. Punto - 2B
  9. Gomez - CF
  1. Morales/Redmond - backup C
  2. Tolbert - Utility
  3. Harris - backup 3B
  4. ???/Huber - strong bench bat
  1. Nathan - CL
  2. Rauch - SU
  3. Mijares - SU
  4. Guerrier - SU
  5. Neshek - MR
  6. Mahay - LOOGY
  7. Bonser/Liriano - LR

Even those two changes has really given the Twins a new look.  I would be perfectly content with only those two players on our beloved Twins.  I think they would provide significant improvements to an already strong core unit.

Poll
What is the important position/s to fill?
SP
92 votes
2B
53 votes
3B
46 votes
SS
90 votes
RP
7 votes
For Positions - please comment
2 votes

290 votes | Poll has closed

1 recs  |  Comment 94 comments

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Comments

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I could actually

see the Twins re-signing Mike Redmond. They would give Redmond the 4th spot on the bench. Why? Gardy likes to be able to DH Mauer when he has an off day (of catching) and ensuring 3 catchers on the roster, while one may hardly ever play (Redmond), will give Gardy that opportunity.

Mauer DHs
Morales Cs
Redmond – backup in event of injury/poor performance

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 26, 2009 6:05 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

why not resign

my grandpa. He moves about as well.

by wcooley on Oct 27, 2009 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Unnecessary

The Twins DH’ed Mauer once or twice a week all season with only Redmond on the roster as a backup catcher most of the time, even forfeiting the DH to bring Mauer for defense at the end of some of those games. Gardy is pretty much over that phobia.

I love Red Dog, but the Twins should not re-sign him. If he wants to play, I hope he catches on somewhere and gets a huge ovation when he comes to Target Field.

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Oct 27, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I still hope

That we hire him to manage somewhere in the system and give him a shot at the big club someday.

by Neil on Oct 27, 2009 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Twins could get Josh Johnson for Delmon Young + Philip Humber + Tolbert/Casilla/Buscher

bahaha.

Realistically though, I’d give up probably Tosoni (or if the Marlins preferred Morales) + a minor piece for him. Im too lazy to look up his numbers right now but him being in the NL and a huge pitchers park semi-worries me.

http://twinkietalk.com
http://thecollegehockeyblog.com

by fetch9 on Oct 26, 2009 6:11 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

We get Rauch for next year

He has a 2 year deal. So we’ll have him till at least the end of next year. Barring any trades.

When Im in a jam......... I ask myself "WWPD?" (What Would Porcello Do)

by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Oct 26, 2009 6:18 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

People

I’m confident Iwamura is NOT available in FA. For trade, yes. But TB would be very stupid not picking up his option.

by Milt on Tilt on Oct 26, 2009 6:58 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Iwamura

Is viewed as a likely decline of option in Tampa. You can look at their fan pages. While it makes sense to renew his option and then trade him, it is not that easy. Getting something for Iwamura with his contract will be difficiult. However, if he is a FA, he will be much sought after.

by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Oct 26, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

if they don't

I completely change my mind on their front office. It’s such a no-brainer move. If they fail to do so, I hope their entire model collapses.

by Milt on Tilt on Oct 26, 2009 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Iwamura was worth his option this year

and he played 69 games. I understand that they’re stacked in the infield, but I can’t imagine they wouldn’t be able to trade him with only a 4 mil salary.

by lookatthosetwins on Oct 26, 2009 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

one thing with Tampa

is they have a very tight payroll and might not be willing to take on the 4-5 million Iwamura option, even if they are going to trade him. That is four-five million that they could use on something that they need. Tight payroll inflicts a lot of damage as many Twins fans should know.

I do think that the Rays would be stupid not to pick up Iwamura’s option, but based on the fact that they have a plethora of infielders and their tight payroll, I don’t see them picking it up.

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 26, 2009 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think he's worth more than that on the open market

So they’ll pick it up and trade him.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 28, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nice column

I have said for over a month that the price for Hardy will be one major league pitcher (Perkins qualifies) plus a very good to top prospect. I think Wilson Ramos + Glen Perkins + good hitting prospect for Hardy plus good pitching prospect. That way the Twins get pitching back when they trade a pitcher.

Regarding who should be gone, I agree that Delmon should be gone, but I doubt it will happen. One of Punto/Casilla/Tolbert should exit as well, but I doubt it will happen right away. I expect that Tolbert will be the starting third baseman with Valencia spending a month or two more at Rochester. If Tolbert is better than Harris this spring, I expect Harris to be released or traded. He might even be non-tendered.

by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Oct 26, 2009 7:30 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I doubt that Perkins will get it done as the starter

involved in a Hardy trade; I think there will be significant competition for him. Blackburn might be more likely, which I would do, mostly because I have little faith in Blackburn, but I’m not sure the Twins would do that.

This is a nice piece, and it brings up a question that I have been thinking about: what are reasonable expectations for fans to have? It seems to me that we sometimes get lulled into the idea that the Twins do the mostest and bestest they can in their itty bitty market. But I think we can reasonably have higher expectations; not Yankee expectations, obviously, but acquire some average infielders expectations.

Why not Hudson on a 2 year deal? The world won’t end if they sign a type A once a decade.

by Eric in Madison on Oct 26, 2009 8:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Perkins

Do you really see him being a #3 or so starter next season? If Ramos is ready to play in the majors next season, then there is a chance he would be valuable, but they have Salome in AAA and Lucroy in AA.

There are also some nice minor league infielders who could be part of a trade, but I don’t think anything gets done unless the pitchers offered are players that Melvin has had an eye on and believes in.

by Salty on Oct 26, 2009 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Perkins

a left handed pitcher, throws mid 90s, has control up and in, changes speeds

Those are all things Perkins has…Perkins is a very good pitcher but he tends to get out of his mindset of pitching hard up and in and changing speeds. If the Twins can sell that line to the Brewers, the Brewers will bite. Even if the Brewers don’t bite on the line, they can see his potential – Brewers have scouts too!

Perkins plus a high pitching prospect, i.e. Bromberg, McCardell will get the Brewers salivating, I believe. Brewers have no need for Hardy, so why not get rid of him for something they need and something of “high” value?

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 26, 2009 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Glen Perkins?

The same Glen Perkins who can’t strike out hitters, is already 27 (in 2010), and will be non-tendered by the Twins?

by Milt on Tilt on Oct 27, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not arbitration eligible

That’s why they sent him to AAA, to avoid Super 2 status.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well...

That was their public explanation. But other guys who were no better than Perkins (and not left-handed) got September call-ups, so I find it hard to believe that his service time didn’t play a part in his sticking in the minors for the rest of the year.

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Oct 28, 2009 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's why he filed a grievance with the MLBPA

And he has a case. If they had kept him on the major league DL, he’d be a Super 2. Instead they sent him to AAA, where he finished the year on the AAA DL.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 28, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

By the way, his ERA was a 1.25 higher than his FIP

Both took a nose dive when he got hurt and tried to pitch through it. He was the ace of the staff in April. But Gardy and Andy overused him and he got hurt. Then he came back and pitched decently before getting hurt again and pitching horribly.

The real issue is health. Will teams want to take a chance on a guy with his injury history? I think some teams will. He’s 18-11 with a 4.75 ERA in his career and he’s entering his prime years.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 28, 2009 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How did they overuse him?

Didn’t he just make his regular starts or did I miss something? It just seems like the Twins overusing a starter doesn’t happen with their 100 pitch count limit on just about everyone. It seemed like Perkins got hurt and didn’t say anything (twice) until after he pitched a horrible game or two.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Oct 28, 2009 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

His first three starts of the year were complete games

His last three starts of spring training went four, five and six innings. It’s not just pitch counts, it’s warming up for eight or nine innings.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 28, 2009 12:25 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

They need starters

Forgive me, but you sound like you’re hoping the Twins can BS the Brewers. If he can’t start games and pitch, he lacks the value they are seeking.

by Salty on Oct 27, 2009 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He can pitch

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

2009 FIPs for the pitchers you mentioned and who they'd replace

Doug Davis – 4.84
Jarrod Washburn – 4.58
Jon Garland – 4.48
Francisco Liriano – 4.87
Brian Duensing – 3.21 AAA, 4.13 MLB

Tell me why, exactly, we’d want to pick one of these guys up? We have cheaper options that performed about as well as them last year, and are entering their prime years, while these guys are entering twilight. Unless we get someone better, its just a waste of money that we could use to improve our infield.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m all for signing a pitcher, but if not if its someone that doesn’t project to be much of an upgrade, and not if it means Tolbert/Harris/Buscher are starters.

by lookatthosetwins on Oct 26, 2009 11:55 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree completely

There’s really no need to pick up a veteran starter unless they’re as good as Pavano or better (such as high risk/high reward guys like Harden, Bedard, Sheets, etc.). The Twins have a plethora of #4/5 starters. Why pay someone $5 million to do the same job as Perkins/Duensing/Swarzark/Manship/… ?

by Mike I on Oct 27, 2009 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

If they can’t get Pavano or better, they should save their money for more middle infield help or front loading Mauer’s contract.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 1:23 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm saying, he's the minimum. If they can't get something at least as good as him, they shouldn't bother

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Thank you

reason. People have fallen in love with Pavano way too much. Same with Cabrera. Pavano for a repeat of last years contract where he earned $4.35M? Sure, sign me up. $6M, we’ll talk about it. Other wise, thank you for your services.

by Milt on Tilt on Oct 27, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

No

His FIP was 4.00 this year. xFIP is 4.18.

He strikes out a fair amount, limits walks very well, and doesn’t give up too many homers. A good #3 starter IF he can stay healthy again.

by Mike I on Oct 27, 2009 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, I was going to say

His FIP was much better with Minnesota than Cleveland. It was under 4 i nthe last two months of the season.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Did you look at IP?

FIP independent of innings doesn’t make much sense. Liriano’s FIP looks similar to Doug Davis but Davis was able to do that over a much larger sample of innings (didn’t need protection from his bullpen and a quick hook). I’d be thrilled if Liriano could be as good as Doug Davis or Jarrod Washburn at this point. The Twins need someone to eat innings in the rotation.

I like Baker, Blackburn, Duensing and Slowey so making the 5th spot up for grabs among Bonser, Liriano and Swarzak isn’t a bad bet. The downside is Duensing regresses, Slowey doesn’t bounce back from injury and Bonser, Liriano and Swarzak all suck.

by DJL44 on Oct 27, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

FIP versus ERA

The best way to get more innings from the starters is to solidify the up the middle defense. They’ll all outperform FIP with a good defense behind them.

by DJL44 on Oct 27, 2009 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think...

The price on Tejada is going to be lower than some may view…He’s still a good player, but his age is going to concern a lot of people. I could be extremely wrong, but I see Tejada going for cheaper than a Type A FA

by SouthSotaPop on Oct 27, 2009 2:39 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Iwamura
Iwamura is the prototypical Twins 2B

That’s not very nice, Iwamura is actually good.

by DJL44 on Oct 27, 2009 10:40 AM EDT reply actions   2 recs

+1

:-)

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well done.

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Oct 27, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Good point there!

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 27, 2009 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Both your "wishful thinking" and "realistic" scenarios are probably not fiscally possible.

Unless, that is, you don’t want to bring back that Mauer guy.

Formerly known as "Andersklasen."
Check out the best Twins' blog on the web: TwinsTarget.com.

by TwinsTarget on Oct 27, 2009 10:57 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Mauer WILL come

back if he sees the Twins improving themselves! Pohlads have said that they will open their wallets to bring back Mauer. They know that if Mauer leaves, the Twins revenue will drop.

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 27, 2009 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

What I'm saying is that there will be no money for Mauer if you sign...

Johnson long-term, Iwamura, Lyon, Hardy, and whomever else you said. Even Mauer won’t take a 500K/year contract.

Formerly known as "Andersklasen."
Check out the best Twins' blog on the web: TwinsTarget.com.

by TwinsTarget on Oct 27, 2009 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Twins have three

rotation spots guaranteed.

1. Baker
2. Slowey
3. Blackburn
4. Open
5. Open

Perkins, Liriano, and Duensing could fill one or both of those spots. My guess is that they go with Duensing, based on his performance down the stretch. This leaves one spot open to fill via trade or free agency. This is assuming that Slowey comes back healthy along with Baker and Blackburn.

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 27, 2009 12:08 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I would add Duensing to that

He did enough to earn a slot going into next season.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hardy Trade

I don’t see Ramos being in the trade for Hardy mostly because it would be a bad time to trade him as he was injured much of last year. I think it’ pretty well documented that the Brewers are pitching starved and the Twins could offer them multiple guys who are either ready or close to ready for major league pitching. Hardy won’t be free but after his year he shouldn’t command a top prospect like Ramos.

I think the Twins need to be smart and capitalize on the market, there are a lot of quality 2B options out there and the Twins need one, perfect match. I’d be happy with many of the guys you mentioned. I don’t think the Twins would be stupid to offer a contract to Joe Crede that’s similar but even cheaper than his 09 contract. I’m very skeptical that Valencia is ready immediately to step up and play plus if they end up both on the team at some point maybe Crede could teach him a thing or two.

As far as starting pitching goes If the Twins do anything I’d like to see them take a flier on one of the oft-injured Aces and hope it turns out well for them . Bedard, Sheets, Harden, and Duchscherer should all be affordable and hopefully the Twins can pick one that will stay healthy.

So if I had to put a ‘realistic’ wish list out there it would likely be

1. Iwamura/Lopez – based on age and decent OBP

2. re-sign Crede – he’s worth one more chance I think

3. sign a SP – I can’t even pick a favorite they all have positives and negatives

My one wish that might not be quite as realistic is to trade for either Hardy or Yunel Escobar as well.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Oct 27, 2009 12:44 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Pitching for Hardy

I think the Brewers would be more interested in one of Burnett, Delaney or Slama along with a 40 man roster decision guy like Van Mil.

Disagree on Crede. Didn’t we play that game already when it was called Rondell White?

by DJL44 on Oct 27, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

not exactly

Yah those guys would be perfect options to ship in a trade for Hardy along with a guy like Swarzak, Perkins, Manship, or even Duensing.

I can’t really put White and Crede in the same box. White was older when we got him and didn’t play good defense at an area of need like Crede does. If Crede stays healthy this year he probably puts up 25 homers and I assume his overall hitting line would have gone up. I’m saying if the price is right it wouldn’t be a bad option. A low risk deal like he signed this year, only even cheaper, is a great idea. Maybe give him a base of 2 million with the ability to earn up to 5 or 6 depending on # of at bats. I like the idea of giving him another chance better than giving the spot to Tolbert/Harris/Buscher/Punto.

Or instead of Crede, Adrian Beltre would be worth giving a shot as well. He had a bad year and could be cheap. He was a guy looking for one more big contract before he had a rough year. He’d be looking to prove himself and might sign a decent one year deal to do that.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Oct 27, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sure!
If Crede stays healthy this year he probably puts up 25 homers and I assume his overall hitting line would have gone up.

And if I find a unicorn in my backyard, I can sell it and make millions!

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Oct 27, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

How did you think Nick Punto got such an expensive contract?

And if I find a unicorn in my backyard, I can sell it and make millions!

You might be laughing now, but the Twins management also laughed when Nick Punto put a clause saying the same thing into his contract. And look at him now – the Twins owe him $4 MM for the year after his contract’s unicorn clause kicked in.

by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Oct 27, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

lmao. +100

Beef totally set you up for that one. :)

When Im in a jam......... I ask myself "WWPD?" (What Would Porcello Do)

by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Oct 27, 2009 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That picture might be the greatest thing on the internet

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Oct 28, 2009 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Crede will never stay healthy… this is his 3rd consecutive back surgery. Guy needs to hang up his cleats or have a 100% incentive based contract. $0 guaranteed.

by sox1844 on Oct 29, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

Crede has stated that the Twins were a pretty good fit. He might take a minor league deal with the Twins, partly because he isn’t getting a guaranteed deal anywhere else. I would guarantee $1M if he makes the team, the rest in incentives.

Also saw that they need to decide on Cuddyer’s 2011 option in November.

by DJL44 on Oct 29, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

2010

Except Burnett, who probably won’t come until 2011.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

So what's the point?

From a cursory look, it seems possible that they may never pitch in the majors for any extended period.

by Salty on Oct 28, 2009 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

There's no way those guys are enough

I don’t know a ton about the Brewers but from what I understand they want starters. Right now the Twins bullpen looks good so if we can throw in one of those up and coming relievers along with a current starter and a starter who’s close to ML ready (AA or AAA) I would think they could get it done. It’s not a bad option to use one of those relievers in a trade as they all have a lot of potential but haven’t proved anything quite yet.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Oct 28, 2009 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Possible, but highly unlikely

These guys will likely be dependable relievers for a lot of years. Is it enough? Probably not. But one of these guys would make a nice chip to add to a package.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 28, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Must be misunderstood

I was thinking Perkins + one of Slama, Delaney, Burnett + one of VanMil, Gabino, Morillo, Waldrop for JJ Hardy. That’s a decent opening offer at least.

by DJL44 on Oct 28, 2009 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes

I’d offer Gomez straight up ‘cause they might want to let Cameron walk for the draft compensation. But if they want pitching instead, I’d say Perkins, Delaney and Waldrop would do.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 28, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gomez looks like a bust. I’d guess his trade value is near zero. Maybe they view Perkins as a project that can be turned around. Delaney, no value. Waldrop hasn’t started a game since ’07 and finished the year in AA after major surgery the year before.

by Salty on Oct 29, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You have no idea about trade value

There aren’t too many 23 year old centerfielders with Gomez’s tools.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 29, 2009 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He can't hit for power or average

They could just sign someone like Corey Paterson if they wanted defense.

by Salty on Oct 29, 2009 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

BS

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 29, 2009 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

You don't give up a 23 year old with his tools

He probably should have goe straight to AA in 2008 and AAA in 2009. Instead, they developed him at the majors. His numbers don’t tell the whole story either. When he played regularly, he played well. But it’s tough getting hits when you come in for one at bat a night.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 29, 2009 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1000

Whenever Gomez played consistently, he played well. Gomez is the best defensive CF in the league, which more than makes up for his low avg/obp. However, if he can get consistent ABs, Gomez will produce on the offensive side of the ball. Sure, he wont be a Denard Span or Andrew McCutchen, but he will do a very decent job especially with his defensive skills.

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 29, 2009 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Almost like........

Gomez was almost like a Rule 5 guy, placed on the roster and he got more expensive and didn’t get the work and what do you now do.

I think sending him to the minors for half-a-season at the msot would be a godsend for him. Really, truly, and would hope he would undrestand.

He needs to play everyday. He needs to go somewhere (how about the winter leagues for this) and be told to bunt 1-2-3 times up to bat. He needs to work on slap hitting. He needs to work on base-stealing. Wish Ricky Henderson would talk to him.

The interesting thing is that Gomez does have the potential for some punch. He does.

Visit www.TwinsCards.com and check out "rosters" to see my collection!

by rosterman on Oct 30, 2009 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gomez is strong

no doubt about it. Gomez could eventually be a middle of the order, 20 homer guy. All of the homers that he has hit, have been absolutely crushed…Morneau style!!! The trouble is, is that Gomez thinks that each time he goes up to the plate, he can hit a homer – which he could. However, in order to hit a homer, you have to have two things: contact (something Gomez lacks at the moment) and power (something Gomez has a ton of!)

He does need to play everyday, I agree. Rodney Carew really needs to sit down with this boy and have a talk. Gomez should stay in extended Spring Training this next year so that way he can get into the groove and be by Carew every day. That would be really good for him!

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 30, 2009 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The way he played last year

is that what you’re talking about?

by Salty on Oct 30, 2009 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Wait!

Hold your horses! I would just like to know why EVERYONE is riding JJ Hardy. He had 1 good year and 1 ok year. Then last year he was not so good. I mean yea he’d be a good fit but so are a ton of other people. I mean hes 27 years old which would make him our SS of the future but that would mean Miguel Sano (who is very quickly becoming one of my favorite players) will be stuck in the Minors till we get rid of Hardy. So then you would have a Jim Thome-Ryan Howard situation. Im sure other people have pointed this out before but I’ll just throw it out here again. Maybe I’m not seeing what you guys are. So lemme know what you think.

When Im in a jam......... I ask myself "WWPD?" (What Would Porcello Do)

by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Oct 27, 2009 6:04 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Why Hardy

He’s had 2 adequate years, one injured year, one very good year and one all-star Jeter equivalent year. He has a great glove. He’s coming into his prime years. He can probably be had for surplus pitching. It’s a great fit.

Miguel Sano’s ETA is 2015. I doubt Hardy would be here that long (that would be a 4 year contract extension.

by DJL44 on Oct 27, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I've said it before...

…and if I’m beating a dead horse I apologize, but from everything that I’ve read about Sano, right now he’s a shortstop, but by the time he is ready, his structure and body, based on his growth thus far, would project him to be a better fit at third base. I don’t know how that will go with Valencia, if he’s still around, but that would be a bridge to cross at the time, but even still we are looking at 2015 more than likely. Nobody really knows that far into the future.

by SouthSotaPop on Oct 28, 2009 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Priorities

1) Extend Mauer’s contract
2) Get a SS (Hardy preferred, Jack Wilson consolation prize?)
4) Get another infielder in trade or via free agency (Iwamura, Beltre, Carroll, etc) with 2B a priority over 3B
5) Bargain hunt for pitching
6) Sign another infielder if they drop into your lap like Crede

by DJL44 on Oct 27, 2009 6:05 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Again, that's unrealistic.

I hate to be a party-pooper, but the increase in revenue that Target Field will bring seems to be viewed as an unlimited money tree. In reality, the Twins’ would have at most $19 million, and $7.5 of that will go to Mauer if he re-structures. For us non-math majors, that leaves 11.5 million.

Hardy will cost around $5 million for 2010. Iwamura would be about the same: $5 million. Doug Davis (for example) could cost upwards of $10 million per season. Crede will probably cost $2 or $3 million.

At most two of (2B, SS, SP, IF) can be filled, but certainly not all.

Formerly known as "Andersklasen."
Check out the best Twins' blog on the web: TwinsTarget.com.

by TwinsTarget on Oct 27, 2009 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

He said "bargain hunt" for pitching

and Doug Davis at $10 million would a terrible rip-off. Pavano would probably cost like $6/7 million a year for 2 years (and a few other decent options might fall into that range). It’s do-able, especially if they get rid of some of the dead weight arb-eligible players, like Crain, Delmon, Harris.

by Mike I on Oct 27, 2009 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd argue that all three of Harris, Young, and Crain should be kept...

But that’s a topic for another time.

Formerly known as "Andersklasen."
Check out the best Twins' blog on the web: TwinsTarget.com.

by TwinsTarget on Oct 27, 2009 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not sure about Harris

They’ll probably keep him. But he’s marginally useful and expensive.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2009 9:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed.

Plouffe could be a poor man’s Harris next year, for a fraction of the cost. I wouldn’t mind going that route.

Formerly known as "Andersklasen."
Check out the best Twins' blog on the web: TwinsTarget.com.

by TwinsTarget on Oct 27, 2009 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

1/2 is a fraction

Harris isn’t going to be that expensive and he has a proven bat. Plouffe is a big question mark. Harris is a decent stopgap for 3B until Valencia is ready.

by DJL44 on Oct 28, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, bargain hunt

I was thinking more like Kenny Rogers when he ran out of options.

by DJL44 on Oct 28, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

1) Extend Mauer’s contract
2) Get a SS (Hardy preferred, Jack Wilson consolation prize?)
4) Get another infielder in trade or via free agency (Iwamura, Beltre, Carroll, etc) with 2B a priority over 3B
5) Bargain hunt for pitching
6) Sign another infielder if they drop into your lap like Crede

by DJL44 on Nov 6, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I would like...

to keep Crain, I think he’s still a decent bullpen option, Young and Harris I could do without, but I’d rather lose Punto. Harris at least has some bat, I’m tired of the same Nick Punto show. A year of horrid at bats that gets salvaged by a month of good ones. We overspent on him significantly and I am tired of seeing him in a Twins uniform

by SouthSotaPop on Oct 28, 2009 12:21 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree

unfortunately for Twins fans, I do not think that Gardy will ever get over his infatuation with Nick Punto. I do expect Punto to be gone after this year however…Tolbert will just take his place, which, at least, is an upgrade – sorta.

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett

by 33MorneauMVP on Oct 28, 2009 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I never thought I'd say it

But I would go with Punto over Harris on this one. Punto was an awful bat, true, but at least he had a positive defensive value last season. Harris, on the other hand, was a slightly less awful bat with awful defense. If I thought that Punto’s defense would fall next year and Harris’s offense would rise, I might go for Harris, but that’s not something that I think we can easily predict.

For comparison, Harris had a .672 OPS last season, while Punto had a .621. However, defensively, Harris was worth -8.2 runs, while Punto was worth +5.1 runs, per Fangraphs. Punto was also worth more than Harris in 2008, though Harris had a better value in 2007, where Punto had an even worse offensive year and Harris’s offenses was actually good.

by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Oct 28, 2009 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

make trade

twins should sign freddy sanchez to play 2nd and bat 2nd resign crede to play 3rd and if he doesnt work out bring up the kid and the crede moves to bench which would be great because our bench needs some pop..let punto play SS let gomez play center everyday with span in left and trade young, perkins, liriano, and harris to Florida for josh johson..

Rotation

blackburn
baker
slowey
duensing/pavano
josh johnson

lineup

span
sanchez
mauer
morneau
kubel
cuddyer
crede
gomez
punto

by bighead306 on Oct 28, 2009 3:32 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

This would be a very nice looking team

However, I have to disagree on a couple of points. Of all the 2nd baseman avaliable I’m not super pumped about Sanchez. He hits for average and his OBP is decent but I think the Twins can get a younger player like Iwamura or Felipe Lopez for less money. So yah I like the lineup as long as the Twins go out and get one of the various free agent 2B that are available this off season.

As far as your trade is concerned I don’t see that getting it done. Harris is not worth much as he’s going to be getting more expensive for what he does, Perkins and Liriano have values that have gone down and while could be a part of a trade they aren’t going to be enough to get a young Ace pitcher like Johnson. Delmon still has potential but probably not enough to pull away a guy like Johnson.

When dealing with the Marlins I think you’ve gotta figure younger guys so they’re gonna want cheap prospect type players. Guys like Singleton, Swarzak, Duensing, and Valencia are more the type of players you’d be looking to headline a trade. I could see someone like Perkins being part of it as well. I don’t really know how available Johnson is, I think it was Twinscentric book that it came up and now I’ve seen his name mentioned on here multiple times but I haven’t seen a report of him actually being on the trade market.

Also I don’t know how great Johnson really is, and not because of his home park but because he’s in the NL. He gives up fewer homers and strikes out about one more per 9 than Baker but Baker walks less and as a result has a lower WHIP over the last two seasons. Slowey has similar numbers to Baker giving up fewer walks but more hits and about 1 less K/9 than Johnson. The point is, is Johnson really that much better than these two when you consider NL vs. AL?

I’d gladly take Johnson for the package listed above but I just don’t see them being interested in that set of players based on years of control left more than anything else.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Oct 28, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Off season

Well for Johnson the marlins look to need a 2b to replace Uggla who is likely available, a closer, starter to replace Johnson, and an OF if he has a higher ceiling then Hermida.

So Johnson for Perkins\ Swarzak, Crain or Burnett, and Probably one of Hicks/Revere/Morales. Maybe more…. But if they could pull a move off like this then I would be all for it. This would be my first priority and Yes I would include Hicks in a trade for him. I am going to doubt it unless Florida really wants to unload payroll then we can offer other prosepects as well. I was just looking at their needs for next year.

Next best/ likely option Pavano or Doug Davis/Washburn/ other

I see the Twins bringing back Pavano or signing Washburn.

To solve their IF problems I see the Twins bringing back Cabrera, If they go outside of that, Iwarma if available. The Dark horse candidate who I think will be available for around 5-7 million is Miguel Tejada who can move over to 3b.

Team for 2010

Baker
Pavano
Blackburn
Slowey
Duensing

Nathan
Guerrier
Rauch
Mijares
Crain (we keep him)
Slama/ Delaney/ Keppel
Liriano/ Neshek/ Bonser (competition is good for the last 2 bp spots)

LF Span
SS O Cab
C Mauer
1B Morneau
RF Cuddyer
DH Kubel
3B Tejada
LF Young
2B Punto/Casilla/ Harris/Tolbert (quantity over quality) also we can afford a hole in the lineup if there is no hole on defense.

Morales
Gomez (maximizing his defense and Delmons offense potentials)
Harris/ Tolbert
Buscher/ Tolbert/ Harris

If Casilla doesn’t beat out Punto for starting 2B then he will be in minors. Twins will want 2 IFs on bench Buscher and Tolbert looks to be the 25/26th men on the team. We’ll see.

I think Harris will be on this team for 1 or 2 more seasons as long as he hits better than this year. as he wont cost too much and if he is with the team for 3 or 4 years he looks like a bigger piece of the Delmon Young trade than he really is.

Doofenschmirtz Evil, INC.
Phineas and Ferb

by doofus on Oct 28, 2009 8:53 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

also

Should The above team gives us another ss option in Tejada and Valencia is ready to come up. Keeping Cabrera shouldn’t cost more than 4-5 million at the high side.

Doofenschmirtz Evil, INC.
Phineas and Ferb

by doofus on Oct 28, 2009 8:55 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

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