The Hosken Powell Memorial Offseason/Hot Stove Linkdump III
by RandBall's Stu on Dec 11, 2009 12:47 PM EST
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Print- Metro-area Old Country Buffets are wrapping their steam trays in black ribbons this weekend in observance of Boof Bonser, who was traded to Boston for a PTBNL on Thursday. Sources for the glutton-tastic restaurant chain say that they're hoping to recoup their projected losses by setting up a sausage-and-gravy buffet line in CC Sabathia's hotel room when the Yankees are in town.
- Curtis Granderson killed the Twins while with Tigers. The New York Yankees kill the Twins with an agonizing efficiency. Curtis Granderson now plays for the New York Yankees. I no longer wish to discuss this. (Silver lining: fewer regular season games against him!)
- LaVelle says that, despite the Mark DeRosa-shaped hole at third base (as noted by Jesse via Ken Rosenthal, they may be waiting until January), the Twins came out of the winter meetings relatively fine compared to their Central counterparts.
- Speaking of which, Detroit really did shake things up, did they not?
- For the comments: who is your fifth starter right now? Be realistic, anyone who is planning to type "Roy Halladay." I cast my vote for Brian Duensing, based on zero statistical research and the fact that he essentially saved Minnesota's bacon last September. FIP-pers, Reusses, and everyone in between, what say you?
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I still think Liriano
but I would be fine with Duensing. It is way too early to give up on Liriano as far as I’m concerned. If they want to start him in the pen with the thought of him regaining confidence and stepping in if/when someone gets injured/sucks then that’s fine. But I think the longterm plan should give him a few more shots in the rotation before making him a reliever.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 1:08 PM EST reply actions
Ben Sheets???
I would have said him before I found out he’s asking for 12 million. I don’t think he’ll see that much but I think it pretty much erases any hope of him signing a deal on the cheap for 4-5 million.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
LIriano
should be in the rotation, I think. He still misses bats and to me, has the best chance of all the possiblities to be an above average starting pitcher.
by Eric in Madison on Dec 11, 2009 1:34 PM EST reply actions
I like Liriano, But
I don’t think he can go 5 innings with out getting into a big inning or two. Duensing!!!
by b1 on Dec 11, 2009 2:47 PM EST up reply actions
He has shown the ability to do that in the past. Was '08 so long ago?
He pitched very well for a half season after rehabbing. I think he had a bad year and let his brain get in the way of pitching a little bit, but there’s no reason to assume that that will continue. He absolutely has more upside than Duensing.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 3:09 PM EST up reply actions
it feels like it was so long ago
that sometimes it sounds like we are talking about two different players… Lights out Liriano and Knocked out Liriano
Yes but he's got alot to prove. I'd start him relief
till he can put together some strong inning. This will never happen because Grady will always give the older player the first shot. Give it 2 month for the Duensing, Liriano swap.
by b1 on Dec 11, 2009 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
As far as our #5 starter goes...
I point you to: this.
:)
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
Hasn't the Manship sunk yet?
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
With 4 right-handed starters, I think the Twins should go with a lefty to round out the rotation.
Brian Duensing
I think it'll be a lefty either way
I’d be pretty surprised if it wasn’t Duensing or Liriano.
What I’m wondering is, if if Swarzak or someone blew up, does it really matter if we end up with 5 RH starters? Its obviously important to have a lefty or two in the pen, but why does it matter to have one in the rotation? It’s not like you can leverage your LH starters to throw against the LH batters…
I almost think having all RH starters creates more matchup problems for the other team. If they have a platoon going, they either need to start the lefty each day of the series, or start the righty against a RHP. This is especially true if the platoon is at catcher, where they need to have regular days off.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 2:59 PM EST up reply actions
rotation
I would look at Duensing or Liriano, but both coming north…unless the Twins do sign Jarrod Washburn for the cheap, cheapo, cheap.
Sheets demanding the moon? Go figure. What about Davis, anyone? Is there another lefty vet out there the Twins should consider?
If the Twins do sign a third baseman…wouldn’t you rather see Alexi get anotehr shot at the second job and the second hole than…Punto…who is a reserve for a reason. He CAN come in a fill a hole…but don’t let him keep someone else from progressing, please, who might be better for the team in the long-run.
Waiting to see who the Twins sign to fill out the Rochester roster. Will they get Quinlan on a minor league deal? Any other pitchers out there? Do they move Keppel to minor league free agent status and actually sign a free agent?
Will Harris and Crain go to arbitration?
Picture a few roster moves for msot teams happening in the next 24-hours as teams try to trade arbitration guys before making the hard decision of catch or release.
Visit www.TwinsCards.com and check out "rosters" to see my collection!
I gotta think they'd at least be able to trade him for a prospect
I think he has value over the 3 mil or whatever he’ll get, if not on the Twins, then on some team.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
Lavelle thinks the White Sox have the best rotation in the division...
I’m not so sure. People look at Peavy as this #1 ace type guy, but forget that he’s spent his whole career pitching in the absolute best situation possible. The extremely spacious Petco, in the weaker league. I think its a tossup who ends up with a better ERA between him and Scott Baker. Anyway, here’s how I see our rotations stacking up, according to FIP.
WHITE SOX
Jake Peavy 3.90
Mark Buerle 4.20
Gavin Floyd 4.30
John Danks 4.40
Carlos Torres? 4.60
TWINS
Baker 3.90
Slowey 4.00
Pavano 4.20
Blackburn 4.40
Duensing 4.60
Liriano 4.50
I list six because, really, no team goes through the season with 5 starting pitchers. But where am I wrong here? Even if we’re just looking at the top 5, I would give the edge to the twins, although it is close. But the Sox don’t have a glut of back end starters waiting to step in if and when someone gets hurt. I think our rotation is solid but unspectacular, and will be above average for the season. That should be good enough for a team with the offense we have. The White sox have a lot more holes to plug to compete.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 2:54 PM EST reply actions
u forgot about Freddy Garcia for the sox
Vikings 4 the superbowl
Our rotation is built really well for the regular season
Baker and Slowey are both above average (and I think if Slowey comes back 100% healthy he’ll end up being the better pitcher) and then we have a glut of guys who can come in and do reasonably well. We should be able to win a lot of games when our #4 goes up against another team’s #4.
I really have no idea what to make of John Danks. At all.
http://twinkietalk.com
http://thecollegehockeyblog.com
Yeah he got about a run worse in FIP while Floyd got a run better
I don’t know exactly what to expect out of either of them.
I guess you can say that their rotation has more upside, as it wouldn’t be that far fetched to see their top 4 under 4.00 FIP. That seems a lot less likely for us.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
We had 4 starters with 10 wins or more
plus Duensings 5 + any of the others Perkin,Liriano, You get over 10 Win in the 5th spot. I feel the offence will be stronger this year. Look for 15 wins from 3 of the 5 if not 4 over 15 wins!
by b1 on Dec 11, 2009 3:05 PM EST up reply actions
If your getting lots of wins (or loses)
your pitching deep into the Game. That’s important. Strong staffs have lots of decisions because they Pitch deep into the game Ask Bert!! What good is a 3.90 era if you come out after 5 innings? Pitching deep into a game is part of evaluation of staters.
by b1 on Dec 11, 2009 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
darn right it is, but you can use better stuff than wins
http://twinkietalk.com
http://thecollegehockeyblog.com
Eh........
If your starters give up an average of 3-4 runs in their number of innings pitched, you get the win if you manage to score 4-5 runs against the other team’s starters.
You can have the best staretrs around (remember all those games Johann struggled thru while a Twin, and recently with the Mets, that were decided by a single run…and they were low-scoring to boot).
The hometeam pitchers have to get the outs. The hometeam batters have to score the runs. Quite simple. If you use a starter 5 innings and they give up 2-3 runs, you better have a great bullpen so you only have to score four to get a win…probably out of the bullpen at that stage.
Have to also look at starters and the 100 pitch-count…ow many walks, how many K’s. It seems the era of the majority of a rotation reaching 200 innings is slowly slipping away.
Visit www.TwinsCards.com and check out "rosters" to see my collection!
Sox are better
Mostly because they have more history of being good.
Of course if Slowey comes back strong this year & Baker doesn’t stink at the start of the year it might change.
by clutterheart on Dec 11, 2009 3:16 PM EST up reply actions
Is it really between the Twins and White Sox?
Doesn’t Detroit’s rotation have to be part of the discussion?
After all they do have Porcello, Zoolander, and Scherzer…and Porcello…even after game 163 I hear he’s still only 20 years old!
Yeah they may have it,
I was more just showing that I think the WS rotation is overrated
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
What's with the Hosken Powell bit?
I liked him on the fact that I got one of his broken bat in spring training as a Kid.
#5 Rotation Spot
At this point, I’m happy with a healthy competition involving Liriano, Duensing, Swarzak and Manship, perhaps Perkins if he’s somehow still around. Liriano and Duensing are probably the front runners, and I’d prefer to see Liriano earn the spot as he has the greatest upside. But that’s the key…he has to earn the spot.
Perk
Don’t forget about him.
He is a lefty who did very well before coming down with an injury.
I would guess Liriano will be in the pen no matter what happens.
by clutterheart on Dec 11, 2009 3:10 PM EST up reply actions
he did
mention Perkins:
perhaps Perkins if he’s somehow still around.
Personally, I think Perkins will be long gone by February. He has angered the Twins staff in multiple things: Hiding the injury, filing the grievance, and just being a head case.
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
Not to mention not being one of our 5 best pitchers.
There is no reason that he or someone else doesn’t get traded when we have so many other holes to fill. At worst he should bring back a decent 4th outfielder.
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 3:15 PM EST up reply actions
I vote for Duensing
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
In the pic of CC
it looks like the baseball in the grass, due to the perspective, is actually flying right at CC and will hit him right on his big fat nose!
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
In one last effort
to sign a low risk high reward pitcher, do any of you think the Twins might look at acquiring Ching-Ming Wang who will be non tendered? Injury risks the past few years should lower his value, but when healthy, he can be a pill! Anybody think they will at least look at him?
Also, what about Kelly Johnson? He might be willing to take a $2 million contract with an option and incentives. If the Twins could sign him (non tendering Crain) and trading Perkins + Casilla/Pridie/Butera to the Padres for Kouzmanoff, it would be a pretty good offseason. Or am I just being to optimistic?
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
I'm sure you enjoy writing about Wang.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
just like
purple row (colorado rockies sb nation)
i was just starting to enjoy this place (long time twins fan).
sad.
goodness
…really?!? really?!?
hoping to work in taiwan in 2011
..and thinking twice about coming back to read the comments here…
by holidayelsie on Dec 12, 2009 12:13 AM EST up reply actions
oh come on
We spend more time making fun of Keppel’s last name than we ever have of Wang
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 12, 2009 11:21 AM EST up reply actions
I'm so inappropriate :(
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
by fischean on Dec 12, 2009 3:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It's only a matter of time before you're all banned
I hope you enjoy the Rockies’ blog, foul-mouthed hooligans!
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?" -Joe Kapp
by less cowbell, more 'neau on Dec 12, 2009 4:28 PM EST up reply actions
Ahahaha.
don’t ban me Jesse, oh pls pls!
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
by fischean on Dec 12, 2009 4:55 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
hahaha
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 12, 2009 6:25 PM EST up reply actions
That's why they call you Foul-Mouth Fischean
Whoever “they” are
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 12, 2009 6:24 PM EST up reply actions
"they"=all of you people, I'm sure.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
I also wanted to bring up Dickey Time here but couldn't think of a clever way to do it
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 12, 2009 6:28 PM EST up reply actions
haha
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 11, 2009 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
Zing!
"Is it normal to wake up in the morning in a sweat because you can't wait to beat another human's guts out?" -Joe Kapp
by less cowbell, more 'neau on Dec 11, 2009 4:33 PM EST up reply actions
and we're sure you enjoy 'reading' about Wang
by montanatwinsfan on Dec 11, 2009 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
I may not write about Wang, but I do talk about it a lot
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
they're just so interesting!
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
Kelly Johnson and Kouzmanoff are the two guys I'd like to get
If only the Braves were in need of a back of the rotation starter
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
Do you think Johnson will be non-tendered?
It would surprise me if they weren’t able to trade him
by lookatthosetwins on Dec 11, 2009 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
they were trying
to, but now I believe they just want to get rid of him.
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
Can you imagine Bert
if the Twins had a pitcher named Wang… “It’s going to be hard for Detroit to beat Wang tonight!”
he'll be a set up guy in the pen for Jenks
If he stays healthy and doesn’t blow up he’ll be a solid bargain most likely
Taking Dotel's place, most likely.
And a potential closer after Jenks is injured again next year.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -Earl Weaver
ugh didn't finish that last part
and I think that Thorton guy they have would be considered Jenks’ successor instead of Putz
Just saw that myself and posted a link to the ESPN story, along with a gratuitous shot at the Twins’ former catcher.
by RandBall's Stu on Dec 11, 2009 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
5th starter
Git R Duensing all the way man, if he cant do it then its all lost cuz liriano cant start, i think hed be great in the pen, and boof is gone, perk is about to be gone, and whats the latest with orlando caberera i havent heard about him for awhile
Want Railings got tohttp:// www.Kassonconcrete.com
Duensing
At this point, Duensing has to be the favorite, but if Liriano outperforms him in Spring Training then you’d have to go with him. Honestly, think about Liriano in a role like Mijares’ at the end of a game….with that stuff it could be downright scary. He usually starts games fine. A perfect example is LaTroy Hawkins. Even Boof improved his K/9 and could throw harder when he knew he only had to pitch one inning. If he excels and the rotation is fine, leave him there. Otherwise, send him to AAA to start. Duensing is the most consistent, and will be a better than average fifth starter.
Totally agree.
Also, Duensing is cute and I want him to have things, like the 5th rotation spot and homemade chicken soup.
http://www.realityfish.com
by Robin G on Dec 12, 2009 8:29 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
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