Twinkie Town 2010 Top 50...Runoff Voting for Prospect 18!
by roger13 on Dec 22, 2009 4:50 PM EST
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PrintIt is good to be back in Minnesota. Left Denver yesterday morning at 4:45 am and drove non stop to the Twin Cities. Not certain I want to do that again in the near future.
With 184 votes cast for prospect 18, Jeff Manship is the leader with 58 votes (31%) with B. J. Hermsen in a near tie with 56 votes (30%). Thus, there will be a runoff vote for Prospect 18 with the loser taking our 19th slot.
With three players well under the 5% requirement, Brian Dinkelman, Luke Hughes and Matt Bashore, we will need five new prospects for the twentieth spot tomorrow. Your comments will be appreciated.
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I don't even rank Manship in my top 25
I like him fine as a fifth starter. But his numbers in AA and AAA are so-so and I just don’t see much upside. I have Tootle, Bayshore, Hermsen, Stuifbergen, and a couple of others not yet ranked here ahead of Manship.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I disagree...a bit
I don’t have Manship ranked as a top ten prospect or anything, but through 2008 and his first stint in AA, he showed very good SO and BB ratios, about 7.3 to 2.5 respectively, and he kept the ball in the park very well (low HR/9).
Then last year, he regressed a bit, as his SO/9 fell into the low 5’s in AA, AAA and MLB. The question is why…? In 2008, Manship threw 150+ innings between A+ and AA, then a few more in the Arizona Fall League. Did we overdo it last year?
The best path forward for Manship, IMO, would be to start him in AAA and give him a chance to earn his way back to the majors.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 23, 2009 10:35 AM EST up reply actions
I agree - AAA
Manship should be the 7th starter (after Swarzak), available in an emergency. The Twin bullpen is good enough that they don’t need him. Heck, he might be the 8th starter depending on how Duensing/Liriano gets sorted out.
On the contrary
I have Manship ranked around 15. I think proving yourself at the MLB level shows something. Around this level of prospects I think downside means as much as upside. He didn’t crap the bed in the majors – that means a lot. I think his walk rate increase is more disturbing to me than his strikeout rate dropoff but he looks a lot better than Nick Blackburn did at the same ages/levels.
I like Hermsen, and I think the runoff has him pegged at about the right number but he’s still just a teenager who looked good in rookie ball against players who haven’t used a wooden bat before. Manship has passed the AA/AAA test and Hermsen hasn’t even seen Beloit yet.
I wasn't all that impressed with Manship's MLB debut
He had a couple of good games, a couple of so-so outings and a really bad one. He’s a two-pitch pitcher. I wouldn’t put him up there with Blackburn. Blackburn can touch 95. Manship can’t break 91. He’s about on par with Swarzak, except Swarzak can reach back and get something extra when he needs to. Manship has very little margin for error.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Not Blackburn now
But Blackburn at the same age/level. Blackburn couldn’t touch 95 at that age and it was the added velocity that really turned him into a prospect overnight. If Manship had better control (fewer walks) I’d think more highly of him. He has just enough stuff if he has location.
RE:Manship
speaking of Jeff Manship, I thought all along coming out of Notre Dame that he had a plus curveball
-I’m pretty sure there was a year or 2 straight there where BA has said Manship had the best curveball in the system
However, going with what C-Math has said – I didn’t see that plus curveball at all in his MLB debut in 2009.
I was rather unimpressed, and only see Jeff as a Long-reliever or #5 starter……..
I'd rather have Nick Punto playing 3B and Felipe Lopez playing 2B
than Punto playing 2B and Kouzy, Crede, DeRosa or Glaus playing 3B.
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Dec 22, 2009 6:01 PM EST up reply actions
Could just be a bad year
I think he still has the stuff, he just lost some location of the curve last year. Kinda like how Gutierrez had the nasty sinker, he just couldn’t find home plate with it. Higher levels are going to punish a hanging curveball.
The curve is his best pitch
But it’s tough to get by on two pitches in the bigs unless you have an above average heater. Manship has good control and decent movement on the fastball, but it’s not above average.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Rick Anderson
Time for Manship to learn a changeup?
Who to add
I would bring back Rams and McCardell and add Hirschfeld. We haven’t seen Tootle yet so he’s a good add. Bullock is another arm who ranks in the top 10 of some lists.
I went with Manship
I like Hermson a lot but I think he fits in somewhere between #20-22
for next rounds vote, I think some candidates should be considered as:
Rob Delaney
Michael McCardell
Matthew Bashore
and Yes Billy Bullock
maybe its time to start thinking about Jorge Polanco?
I'd rather have Nick Punto playing 3B and Felipe Lopez playing 2B
than Punto playing 2B and Kouzy, Crede, DeRosa or Glaus playing 3B.
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Dec 22, 2009 5:50 PM EST reply actions
Delaney's already on the list
>5% in the last round
Who can quibble
about either player making the top 20? Robertson, Bashore, Bullock, McCardell, Weller among pitchers. Plouffe, Guillen, Hughes, Polanco, and Rams among hitters?
Tyler Robertson should definately be a candidate for next round
+1
sometimes I almost forget about him.
If I voted for Round #20 right now Robertson would get my vote, Hermsen probably next……
I'd rather have Nick Punto playing 3B and Felipe Lopez playing 2B
than Punto playing 2B and Kouzy, Crede, DeRosa or Glaus playing 3B.
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Dec 22, 2009 5:57 PM EST up reply actions
He finished 3rd
Take a look at the #18 results, dude.
yeah I know
just confirming that he’s still there I guess.
I'd rather have Nick Punto playing 3B and Felipe Lopez playing 2B
than Punto playing 2B and Kouzy, Crede, DeRosa or Glaus playing 3B.
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Dec 22, 2009 6:02 PM EST up reply actions
Next round...
…..Robertson, Delaney and Plouffe all made the cut-off and will be included in the next round (20th prospect). Will need five new prospects to join them!
my votes for new prospects
Bullock
Bashore
McCardell
Tootle
Polanco
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 22, 2009 7:52 PM EST up reply actions
Bashore is off for a round
He didn’t get 5% last round
missed that
My vote is to put in Rams instead of Bashore then
"So [Kouzmanoff]’s going to make decent monkey, but he’d be affordable." - Jesse
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Dec 23, 2009 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
Manship
I have a hard time voting for players who haven’t played A ball yet. Its hard to know where exactly to peg them. I said it earlier and I’ll say it again now….I can’t wait to see this list in about 2 years…..
Doofenschmirtz Evil, INC.
Phineas and Ferb
How about the Crazy Russian and the Flying Dutchman?
Throw in one of the Crafty Aussie’s as well.
Stuifbergen belongs up there
He was great in the WBC and then he dominated at E-Town.
5-2 3,28 ERA 2.89 FIP 79 IP 69 K 6 BB
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Projectable? How about Potentialable?
He’s still young enough to be a decent prospect, IMO. But not this high, I suppose, despite crazy numbers last year.
The Russian gets by on deception and control
I don’t like his chances at the higher levels.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Loek Van Mil
is he Russian?
He is a good quality reliever, in AA and on the 40 man roster…
(just an FYI, I wouldn’t include Van Mil until about #30-35 or so….)
I'd rather have Nick Punto playing 3B and Felipe Lopez playing 2B
than Punto playing 2B and Kouzy, Crede, DeRosa or Glaus playing 3B.
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Dec 23, 2009 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
His numbers were unbelievable at the GCL...
…but a short reliever there pitches so few innings. I for one is looking forward to see how he does in ETon this summer. Does he belong in the Top 50, I believe so. But also agree that it is too soon to have him included.
I agree but
I would add all of the GCL Pitcher, Salcedo,Weller,Tonkinsand Hermsen. 50% of the batters they face will never see the next level. That also goes for the DSL as well.
by b1 on Dec 23, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
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