GameDay Chatter: Front-office changes around town
by Jon Marthaler on Jun 1, 2009 6:04 AM EDT
in GameDay Appearance
24 comments
If you tuned into Sunday's post-game show and heard the GameDay Chatter segment - otherwise known as "the part of the show where a blogger rails against the establishment" - you heard my dulcet tones ringing across the airwaves. Here's what I said, after noticing that two other teams in town moved towards much more independence in their front offices:
Last week, both the Wild and the Timberwolves hired new general managers, and one thing that both men had in common is that neither was a former player. Both Wild GM Chuck Fletcher, and Timberwolves GM David Kahn, have made their careers entirely in management.
Both men were hired, in part, to help distance front-office decisions from the day-to-day happenings on the court or on the ice. Both Doug Risebrough and Kevin McHale, their predecessors, worked closely with their respective coaching staffs to build teams - but neither one could put together a team that could QUITE make it over the top.
This makes me wonder: maybe it’s time for the Twins front office to spend a little less time listening to the views of the on-field staff.
After all, it was the manager who expressed continuous frustration with Matt Garza. It was the field staff who questioned the leadership of Jason Bartlett. Both were traded, in part, to satisfy the coaching staff - but now Garza is in the midst of a second successful season on the mound for Tampa Bay at the young age of 25, and Bartlett has been one of the most valuable position players in the league this year.
This isn't to say that the manager should have NO input into front-office decisions, but it might be better for the team - in the long run - if the front office was more independent, and if the general manager could focus on the long-term success of the team, rather than satisfying the field manager.
It took a wave of firings for the Wild and the Timberwolves to move in this direction - and, like those two teams, the Twins just can’t seem to quite get over the top. Let’s hope it won’t take another wave of firings for the Twins to try to get there.
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Good stuff
I believe that on any team, you need balance. Between the front office and manager, between scouts and “stats” guys, pitching and hitting, etc. Having the different perspectives helps with checks and balances. This, in addition to the sheer workload, is one reason you don’t see NFL coaches with full control over personnel decisions have much success, IMO.
by Adam Peterson on Jun 1, 2009 9:09 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
A little overblown
Other than Mauer, I can’t think of a single prospect that came up that the coaching staff did not have some issues with. But in those cases, along with Garza and Bartlett, I dont recall any statements that indicated those players should be traded.
Also, I am certain if you ask the staff and the front office whether they believed Garza could pitch the way he has, they will certainly tell you yes. The error was trading him for a player who stinks.
I know Gardenhire is the default punching bag for the team. But he does not sign or trade players.
by guinness junky on Jun 1, 2009 10:00 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Agree on Garza
I suspect many of the issues have to do with buying into the “Twins Way” of playing baseball. Our core coaching staff has remained so consistent since the 80’s, that we have one of the most established approaches to playing the game of any team I know.
by Adam Peterson on Jun 1, 2009 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
coaching staff never
had any difficulties with Justin Morneau. No qualms or anything.
by 33MorneauMVP on Jun 1, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're forgetting the meeting in 2006
In which Gardy said, “I’ve got to fend off some guys in the front office who are calling for your demotion. Are you going to start taking your gift more seriously, or are you going to get sent down. It’s your call.”
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 1, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you're forgetting we use to have pierzynski AND mientkiewicz
give them credit for cutting dougie fresh in the least interesting part of a 4 team trade at the deadline.
they knew exactly who their first baseman of the future was.
"I don't care about feelings." - Lou Piniella
by natetheskate on Jun 2, 2009 1:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To me, it isn't so much the inflience that the field staff has
or doesn’t have in decision-making this is the problem. I’m not sure we can know what really goes on (though I agree that sometimes the manager expresses what seems to me misplaced frustration with certain guys). I will say this: I think the field staff generally does a good job, but I also think it’s their responsibility to figure out how to get the best out of their players, and sometimes they seem to let their pre-conceived notions of how things should be get in the way of that.
Still, I think the real problem might be this: I think sometimes the Twins are too committed to promoting from within. I fear this leads to group think, a lack of fresh ideas, etc.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 1, 2009 10:25 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Good stuff, Jon.
I like the take, and it’s certainly something worth considering. Congrats and getting the nod this week, now we just need James and the Adams to complete the full Twinkie Town circle!
by Jesse on Jun 1, 2009 4:42 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I just flew in from Vegas and boy are my arms tired
>>After all, it was the manager who expressed continuous frustration with Matt Garza. It was the field staff who questioned the leadership of Jason Bartlett.
Reportedly.
There’s no way to know the full story.
In comedy, the theory is if they buy the premise, they buy the bit.
I don’t buy the premise that the on-field staff ignited those trades, let alone the rest of the supposiitons.
Bloggin' the bloggers since 1938.
by Johnny Safron on Jun 1, 2009 7:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Pioneer Press 5/30/09
http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/yb/130712712
You repeatedly stress that you want bloggers to source their work. But even when you acknowledge that points are sourced you type a sarcastic sentence like, “Reportedly.”
I don’t get it. Either you want people to base their arguments on sources and not their gut feelings, or else you don’t trust sources and just want to go with your gut. You can’t have your cake and eat it too… unless of course you’re in a Vegas buffet line.
"I don't care about feelings." - Lou Piniella
by natetheskate on Jun 2, 2009 1:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Our resident troll
Consider the source. He also has tried to discredit many of the sources we cite, including both PiPress beat reporters and two Strib writers. I only respond to his comments when he makes a positive contribution to the discussion, which has steadily increased, believe it or not. Otherwise, I just ignore him. I recommend that approach.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 2, 2009 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
Nothing wrong with dissenting opinions, but when that is all someone has to offer there is just no sense in engaging that individual.
by montanatwinsfan on Jun 2, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know you don't get it
You never do.
Neither Marthaler nor anyone else here has any idea how often Gardenhire expressed frustration with Garza, or if Gardenhire was more frustrated with Garza than he was with half of his other pitchers.
Bloggin' the bloggers since 1938.
by Johnny Safron on Jun 2, 2009 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've been warned about you.
Sorry, bud, no sense engaging you.
"I don't care about feelings." - Lou Piniella
by natetheskate on Jun 3, 2009 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yet you keep doing it
Bloggin' the bloggers since 1938.
by Johnny Safron on Jun 3, 2009 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Delmon Young trade
could be the worst in MN sports history, excluding Herschel Walker. I feel for him, but I honestly think he is the worst player in all of baseball. Is he out of options? Why can’t they send him down to Rochester? He is a rally killer at the plate and isn’t even able to make contact on a lot of plate appearances. at least Gomez plays great D and has the potentential to do good things on the base paths.
JT
by STLVikesFAN on Jun 2, 2009 8:20 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Herschel Walker says hi
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 2, 2009 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Out of options
Like Philip Humber, he signed a major league contract when he was drafted, which required adding him to the 40-man roster and starting the clock when he was 18 years old. He ran out of option years last year.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 2, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I almost feel like its some kind of karmic re-balancing
for the fleecing TR pulled in the AJ to San Fran deal.
Either that or the Twins just don’t have enough resources put into statistical/sabermetric analysis and the Rays do. Nah, that can’t be it. Must be karma.
by JopeX37 on Jun 2, 2009 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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