Minor League Report...June 13, 2009
by roger13 on Jun 13, 2009 9:59 AM EDT
58 comments
Good morning, hopefully I will be able to get the entire report posted this week. The DSL Twins began play while I was gone a week ago. With a 4-2 record by the DSL Twins this week, the organization posted one of their best records of the year with 20 wins versus 13 losses.
Although there was lots of activity related to the annual draft, there wasn't a lot of player movement. Nick Punto was activated by the Twins who sent Alexi Casilla back to Rochester for the second time this season. Rochester placed Luke Hughes, who hadn't played in over a week, on the DL with a obligue muscle strain. Of note in this week's draft is that the Twins selected David Gutierrez (the younger brother of Carlos Gutierrez) out of the U of Miami in the 37th round. They also selected Aaron Senne (a Rochester, MN native) out of the U of Missouri in the 32nd round. They had previously drafted Senne in the 13th round of the 2006 draft.
Rochester Red Wings (AAA) (3-3, 29-30, 4th place, -6.0 games)
The Wings held their position behind Scranton/WB.
Bobby Keppel has pitched very well since joining the starting rotation. He was the loser in last Saturday's 3-2 loss, pitching 7.0 innings with 6 hits, 3 runs (2 earned) and 5K/0BB.........Keppel was again the loser last night, 2-1, pitching a complete game (8.0 innings) with 5 hits, 2 runs and 4K/1BB to drop his record to 2-3.........Philip Humber picked up his third loss in five decisions in Sunday's 11-4 loss. Humber pitched 5.0 innings with 5 hits, 6 runs and 5K/5BB.........Brian Duensing was sharp in Monday's 4-3, eleven inning win. Duensing pitched 8.0 innings with 4 hits, 3 runs and 5K/3BB. Rob Delaney picked up his first AAA win (1-1), pitching 3.0 shutout innings with no hits and 3K/0BB.........Jason Jones pitched 5.0 innings in Tuesday's 9-8, ten inning win. Jones allowed 10 hits, 7 runs (5 earned) with 0K/2BB. Juan Morillo picked up his third win in five decisions, pitching 2.0 perfect innings with 2 strikeouts.........I expect Kevin Mulvey is a leading candidate to be Jim Rantz' Player of the Week with his performance Thursday. Mulvey pitched a complete game shutout with 7 hits and 7K/1BB as he evened his record at 3-3.
Mulvey leads the Wings with 72.1 innings with a 3.61ERA, 1.31WHIP and 59K/28BB. Bobby Keppel has an excellent 2.36ERA with a 1.11WHIP in 22 games (2 starts) with 23K/13BB in 49.2 innings. Armando Gabino has been excellent out of the Wings pen with a 3.16ERA, 1.08WHIP and 22K/14BB in 37.0 innings. Juan Morillo has a very good 3.22ERA, 1.21WHIP and 31K/15BB in 22.1 innings.
Steve Tolleson has an excellent .340/.456/.489 in 47 at bats since his recent promotion. David Winfree is hitting .333Average in his last ten games as his average is up to .279/.303/.495 in 208 at bats with a team high 9 home runs and 14 doubles. Trevor Plouffe is hitting .245/.299/.377 in 204 at bats while catcher Drew Butera is hitting .236/.312/.268 in 123 at bats.
New Britain Rock Cats (AA) (4-2, 32-28, 2nd place, -2.5 games)
The Cats remain 2.5 games behind Connecticut, however, moved up a spot to second place. They continue to battle back from their slow start behind a solid starting rotation.
Cole DeVries wasn't as sharp in last Saturday's 8-3 loss, pitching 5.0 innings with 8 hits, 5 runs (4 earned) and 5K/4BB. DeVries picked up his fifth loss against four wins.........DeVries pitched only 4.0 innings in Thursday's 7-3 win with 9 hits, 3 runs and 3K/1BB. Yohan Pino got his first win in two decisions, pitching 3.0 perfect innings with 2K/0BB. Jose Lugo also pitched 2.0 shutout innings with 1 hit and 2K/1BB to earn his second save.........Carlos Gutierrez made his first start, getting his first win last Sunday, 11-7. Gutierrez pitched 5.0 innings with 7 hits, 5 runs and 3K/2BB. Frank Mata pitched 0.1 perfect inning to earn his second save.........Jeff Manship had another excellent start in Tuesday's 7-2 win. Manship improved his record to 5-4, pitching 7.0 innings with 5 hits, 2 runs and 4K/2BB.........Jay Rainville was even better in Wednesday's 3-2 win, pitching 5.2 innings with 5 hits, 1 run and 3K/2BB as he picked up his third win in five decisions.........Matt Fox was excellent in last night's 2-1 loss, pitching 7.0 innings with 4 hits, 1 run and 6K/1BB. Alex Burnett picked up his first AA loss, pitching 2.0 innings with 3 hits, 1 run and 0K/1BB.
Jeff Manship leads the staff with 69.0 innings. Manship has a 4.70ERA with 42K/18BB. Matt Fox leads the starters with a 2.64ERA, 1.22WHIP and 51K/24BB in 64.2 innings for a team best 5-2 record. Cole DeVries has an excellent 3.27ERA with a 4-5 record and 41K/20BB in 66.0 innings. Yohan Pino has a 4.67ERA in 24 games (34.2 innings) with 36K/10BB. Anthony Slama has a 2.73ERA, 3-1 record, 13 saves and 48K/18BB in 33.0 innings.
Wilson Ramos is back with the Cats, hitting .400 in his last ten games with two home runs. With his hot return, he has his average up to .308/.326/.444 in 133 at bats with 9 doubles, 3 home runs and 18 RBI. Ramos was 10 for 22 (.454Average) this week and is another leading candidate for the Twins Player of the Week. Whit Robbins continues to make a statement that he has a future with the Twins, hitting .340/.417/.536 in 194 at bats with 7 home runs and 29 RBI. Danny Valencia has been in a slump of late as his average dropped to .276/.376/.481 in 185 at bats. Juan Portes has also made a statement following his promotion this season, hitting .323/.386/.476 in 124 at bats. Brian Dinkelman is hitting .313/.408/.455 with 15 doubles and a team high 34 RBI in 198 at bats.
Ft. Myers Miracle (Hi-A) (4-3, 38-22, 1st place, +5.5 games)
The Miracle remained in first place, losing one game of their lead over Charlotte.
Tyler Robertson reminded us of the pitcher he was last year in Saturday's 1-0 win, pitching 7.0 shutout innings with 8 hits and 4K/2BB. Henry Arias picked up the win (1-1), pitching 2.0 shutout innings with 2 hits and 4K/0BB.........Robertson returned in Thursday's 6-4 loss, pitching 5.0 innings with 10 hits, 6 runs (5 earned) and 4K/1BB to even his record at 3-3.........Michael McCardell was also very good in Sunday's 2-1 win, pitching 6.0 innings with 4 hits, 1 run and 3K/2BB to get his seventh win against three losses. Kyle Waldrop pitched a perfect inning with 1K/0BB to earn his second save.........Glen Perkins made a rehab start in Tuesday's 4-0 win, pitching 7.0 shutout innings with 2 hits and 4K/1BB.........David Bromberg was solid on Wednesday, pitching 6.0 innings with 10 hits, 4 runs and 7K/0BB. Henry Arias picked up his second loss as the Miracle lost 5-4. Arias pitched 2.0 innings with 1 hit, 1 run and 1K/0BB.........Deolis Guerra got his sixth loss in ten decisions in last night's 6-1 loss. Guerra pitched only 4.0 innings with 6 hits, 6 runs (3 earned) and 7K/3BB.
David Bromberg leads the staff with a 2.44ERA in 62.2 innings with 57K/29BB. Delois Guerra leads the staff with 63.1 innings with a 4.41ERA. Michael McCardell has a 3.73ERA, 1.05WHIP and 50K/11BB in 62.2 innings. Steven Hirschfield has a 1-1 record in 17 games (2 starts) with a 1.99ERA, 0.88WHIP and 22K/8BB in 31.2 innings. Blair Erickson has 7 saves in 14 games (18.1 innings) with a 2.95ERA and 26K/9BB. Loek Van Mil has appeared in 5 games (8.0 innings) with a 0.00ERA, 0.75WHIP and 5K/2BB.
Ben Revere is hitting .317/.381/.371 with 25 RBI, 34 runs scored and 26 stolen bases in 36 attempts. Rene Leveret is hitting .315/.404/.425 in 127 at bats. Chris Parmalee had two home runs this week as he leads the Miracle with 8 home runs and 32 RBI while hitting .258/.342/.446. All-Star catcher Danny Lehmann is hitting .299/.364/.388 in 67 at bats.
Beloit Snappers (A) (5-2, 23-37, 8th place, -14.0 games)
Following their best week of the season, the Snappers remained in last place behind Kane County. Hopefully a couple of the college pitchers the Twins drafted this week will quickly make their way to Beloit to give them a chance to compete for the second half title.
Danny Berlind picked up his sixth loss in seven decisions in the first game of Sunday's doubleheader that Beloit lost, 2-1. Berlind pitched 6.0 innings with 4 hits, 2 runs and 5K/3BB.........Berlind earned his second win last night, 10-5. He pitched 7.0 innings with 4 hits, 5 runs (3 earned) and 2K/2BB.........Danny Osterbrock earned his third win against five losses in the second half of Sunday's double header, as Beloit won 4-1. Osterbrock pitched a 7.0 inning complete game with 4 hits, 1 run and 6K/0BB.........Bobby Lanigan pitched 4.2 innings with 4 hits, 2 runs and 6K/1BB in Monday's 7-5 win. Michael Tarsi pitched 1.1 inning with 2 hits, 2 runs and 1K/0BB to earn the win.........Brad Tippett was very good, however, got his third loss in Tuesday's 3-1 loss. Tippett pitched 6.0 innings with 5 hits, only 2 runs and 9K/1BB.........Michael Allen was solid in Wednesday's 4-2 win, pitching 4.1 innings with 6 hits, 1 unearned run and 5K/2BB. Blake Martin pitched 2.0 shutout innings of relief with 1K/2BB to earn his first win. Joe Testa pitched 2.2 innings with 2 hits, 1 run and 3K/1BB to pick up his fifth save.........Michael Tarsi made his first start in Thursday's 4-1 loss. Tarsi pitched 5.1 shutout innings with 3 hits and 7K/1BB. Danny Rondon got his fourth loss in six decisions, pitching 1.0 inning with 6 hits, 3 runs and 0K/0BB.........Curtis Leavitt made a spot start in the other half of Thursday's double header that the Snappers won, 4-3. He pitched 3.0 innings with 3 hits, 3 runs and 3K/2BB. Bruce Pugh picked up his second win in three decisions, pitching 2.0 shutout innings with 1 hit and 4K/0BB. Steven Blevins picked up his first save by also pitching 2.0 shutout innings with 1 hit.
Brad Tippett is the Ace of the staff with a 3.17ERA, 1.09WHIP and 5-3 record in 10 games (59.2 innings) with 50K/11BB. Danny Berlind has a very good 3.93ERA in 14 games (7 starts) with 47K/18BB in 52.2 innings. Since moving back to the Snappers, closer Matt Williams has earned 4 saves to go with a 1.52ERA and 20K/11BB in 23.2 innings. Michael Tarsi has a 2.95ERA in 18.1 innings with 22K/9BB.
Ramon Santana continues to lead the Snappers with a .343/.441/.545 in 143 at bats with 5 home runs. Michael Harrington is hitting .242/.289/.407 in 182 at bats with a team high 19 doubles. Angel Morales leads the team with 6 home runs, while hitting .226/.293/.398 in 186 at bats. Hitting .361Average in his last ten games, Ozzie Lewis has his average up to .298/.368/.449 in 178 at bats.
DSL Twins (Dominican Summer League) (4-2, 7-5, 4th place, -4.0 games)
The DSL Twins are back in action with several outstanding young prospects who will move up to the GCL Twins next spring.
Seventeen year old Francisco Nunez is off to an excellent start as he is 2-0 in 3 games (9.2 innings) with a 2.79ERA and 13K/3BB. Pedro Guerra (19 year old) was one of the DSL Twins top starters last year, 8-2, 2.45ERA and 75K/12BB in 84.1 innings. Guerra has started three games with a 0.00ERA in 13.0 innings with an amazing 20K/3BB. Eddy Santana is a 21 year old reliever who has 4 saves in 6 appearances with a 5.79ERA and 11K/1BB in 9.1 innings. Santana missed all of last season following a 2007 season in which he had a 2.27ERA in 47.2 innings with 30K/12BB. Renzo Reverol also has a 0.00ERA in 3 games (1 start) with 7K/1BB in 10.0 innings. Reverol is an 18 year old right hander who had a 4-2 record last year with a 3.00ERA in 30.0 innings with 34K/12BB.
Candido Pimentel (an 18 year old rookie) is hitting .333/.385/.667 with a home run in 12 at bats. Romy Trinidad is also an 18 year old rookie from Santo Domingo. Trinidad is hitting .289/.413/.368 with 3 stolen bases in 3 attempts. A third 18 year old rookie, Kevin Silvania appears to be a left handed power hitting first baseman. Silvania is hitting .278/.366/.528 in 36 at bats with 2 home runs and 8 RBI.
Player of the Week
Last year, Venezuela native Cesar Ciurcina was a right handed starter for the DSL Twins. Ciurcina, who started 8 games in 11 appearances, had a successful season for a 17 year old with a 3-2 record, 3.68ERA, 1.23WHIP and 35K/10BB in 44.0 innings.
This season Ciurcina is off to a nearly perfect start with a 0.00ERA in 14.0 innings with only 4 hits and 12K/0BB. On Wednesday, Ciurcina made his second start of the season against the DSL Orioles. He pitched 7.0 shutout innings with only 1 hit and 10K/0BB. That type of dominating start is worthy of recognition as this week's Player of the Week. If he continues to pitch as he has the first two weeks of the season, Ciurcina will be another player that we will hear a lot about when he moves up to the GCL Twins next season.
5 recs |
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So....
What’s with Joe Benson getting mad and putting his hand thru a wall!
Visit www.TwinsCards.com and check out "rosters" to see my collection!
by rosterman on Jun 13, 2009 11:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That happened over a month ago...
…when he hit the dugout wall after an out even though he had a 2 for 4 night. I recall that they thought he would be out 6-8 weeks, so we should see him back sometime after the first of next month. Is a shame, because he was having a great start to the season. But as Jim Rantz said, the wall always wins!
by roger13 on Jun 13, 2009 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Couple of guys worth highlighting that you mentioned in New Britain
Alex Burnett (21 years old) seems to have found something extra as a multi-inning reliever—he could start pushing hard. Interesting decision to move him to the pen this year since he wasn’t terrible as a starter and most organizations prefer to keep guys as starters as long as they can. Even if they see them ultimately as a reliever, getting the better prospects innings is usually the reasoning.
Kudos to Matt Fox for perseverance. He’s 26 now, and might never have a major league career, but he’s gotten himself back to where he can get guys out. No more than 1 earned run allowed in his last 5 starts. He isn’t exactly blowing people away, but has been effective.
Jeff Manship seems to have found his AA sea legs recently. He’s been pounding the zone and getting quite a few grounders. Guys like this often top out in AA, so we’ll see, but it’s nice that he’s going well.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 13, 2009 11:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I was just thinking...
…if Manship learns to sink the ball, he could take the next step. Otherwise, he looks like a bullpen arm to me (tow above-average pitches).
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 13, 2009 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sleepers
I think Winfree is going to play for the Twins sometime this year. Maybe tomorrow. I also think the Plouffe is going to make it and be a better major leaguer than minor leaguer. Both of those guys are young for their level and have always been.
Ramos is not a sleeper, but if the Twins want to make a move, he has to be the most valuable trade chip they have in their system.
Fox has done a great job, without great peripherals. I suspect he’ll get promoted soon to Rochester, and if he does well there, well he might make it after all, as well.
by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Jun 13, 2009 2:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Why would you want to trade...
…a potential future all-star catcher. Ramos hits very well, would be a perfect match with Mauer with one catching and the other a future DH. These type of catchers are hard to find!
I also see Winfree playing with the Twins, but may not be until September or next year.
by roger13 on Jun 13, 2009 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
You don’t trade your top prospects. Period.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 13, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't trade Ramos either
but he is the most valuable trade chip in our system, and any impact trade we choose to make would likely need to include him.
by Adam Peterson on Jun 13, 2009 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think it's necessary
He’s the sixth best prospect in the system, after Gibson signs (Hicks, Revere, Gutierrez, Gibson and Swarzak are ahead of him). He’s a big chip we could use, I suppose. But it would have to bring a hefty return. In two years, this kid will be a star. They won’t likely get even equal value back in return, which is why you don’t trade guys like Ramos.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 13, 2009 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Your comment that Ramos is the sixth best prospect...
…got me thinking. You know that I value performance over potential and in some cases hype. Thus, I would have Ramos higher than Hicks (who very well could turn out to be the best major league player). But what about Revere? I just went into my program and plugged in the numbers to see how Revere and Ramos grade out as of today…..Revere graded out about 10 points higher, some of which was due to Ramos missing a month on the DL. But that difference accounted for only 4 points.
Ramos is an excellent defensive catcher which is a premium position which may offset the difference. With Gibson dealing with a physical problem and yet to throw his first inning as a professional, I cannot rank him higher than Ramos. I see Swarzak or Gutierrez having solid major league careers, but doubt they will equal what Ramos will do as a big leaguer. So the bottom line to me is that Ramos is likely the second best prospect in the organization behind Revere.
by roger13 on Jun 14, 2009 9:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
Pitching is very volatile, so I wouldn’t bet on it, but if I had to choose today, I’d think Swarzak was the much better bet than Ramos. Injury could derail Swarzak, no doubt, but that doesn’t seem to be what you are saying.
Of course “solid major league career” means different things to different people, but if Swarzak has what I think of as a solid major league career, I’d guess it will be better than Ramos.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
One player who may surprise everyone...
…is Whit Robbins, who grades out a couple points higher than Ramos. That is offset by Ramos missing a month but Robbins is having a great season, one that must cause the Twins to begin thinking of him as a future role player/backup first baseman/DH.
by roger13 on Jun 14, 2009 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Robbins, actually
but it’s hard to see a role for him as a major leaguer. He isn’t going to hit enough to be a regular, and he completely lacks any defensive versatility to be a useful bench player. In these days of 12 and 13 man pitching staffs, it’s tough to have a guy on the bench who can only play first base.
Also it’s worth noting he wasn’t very good over 2 seasons in the FSL. This might be a breakout or it might be an aberration.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Role for Robbins
2011
Backup to Morneau at 1st base
Backup to Cuddyer (final contract year) at Right Field
Backup to Kubel at DH
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Jun 15, 2009 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, I don't think he's capable of playing the outfield
which really limits him. I hope he makes it, but as a first baseman only, it’s going to be tough, especially because he’s going to be at best a marginal power guy.
He’s the type of guy who would have been more likely to have a job in 1975 then he is now. With 9 or 10 man pitching staffs, you could have a hitter like him on the bench. Now it’s much tougher.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 15, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
+1
I don’t recall Robbins ever playing outfield. Coming out of college, he was a 3B/1B, so maybe could be an emergency third baseman. But as Eric said, really is limited to 1B and DH. On the other hand, a backup first baseman, half of the games as DH and pinch hitter the rest of the time could be a good value for the Twins. Appears his bat is for real.
by roger13 on Jun 16, 2009 9:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's an upgrade over Buscher right now
By spring, he will be a real option for Buscher’s roster spot, assuming we have an everyday third baseman, as opposed to the guy we’ve got there now, who needs at least a day off a week.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 16, 2009 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I really hope it is only...
…one day a week CMath. I still like Buscher, with the limited at bats he is getting I cannot fault him for not hitting well. Perhaps a veteran can get by with only a handful of at bats a week, I don’t think a young, inexperienced player can. I still think that Buscher can be a solid major league hitter, .280+ with some doubles and a few home runs, although he is marginal as a third/first baseman. You may be correct that Robbins could be his replacement in 2010.
by roger13 on Jun 16, 2009 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How real is the bat, though?
Look, I feel like I’ve become the jerk of this thread, which I don’t like.
His career line is .277/.384/.405. I think he’ll hit, but I don’t think there’s going to be much power there, which makes him a not great fit for DH. I certainly don’t see him being enough of a hitter to be a regular DH. Plus, I feel like if they really thought he could at least play 3B if he had to, they would be getting him some time there. He hasn’t seen 3B all year.
He could replace Buscher, sure, and my feeling is he would probably be a somewhat better hitter. But you are trading that for a guy who won’t even really be able to stand around at 3B, apparently. I mean, Buscher was playing 3B in Rochester, and he’s pretty bad at it.
Robbins and Eric Lis are sort of the same type of guy—hitters who can only play first but can’t hit enough to play regularly.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 16, 2009 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Robbins is better than Lis
Robbins was a consensus All-American at Georgia Tech. He was considered a steal in the fourth round when we drafted. The first year, he put up eye-popping numbers until he developed a stress fracture in his back, something that is just healed for the first time this year. So he’s putting up the numbers we expected from him all along. He has a big-league bat with a lot of upside and he’s on the ascent.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 16, 2009 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lets look closer at Robbins...
…As CMath said, he has battled back problems since shortly after his great start for Beloit right after the draft in 2006. At 24, he isn’t young but certainly a typical age for AA.
How does he compare about half way into his first season in the IL? He is third in the league in hitting (.345Ave) and OPS (.955). He is tied for third with a .418OBP and hits (70). In 203 at bats he has taken 26 walks compared with only 34 strikeouts. That tells me that he is a very good prospect and one of the best in a league where some players make the move directly to the major leagues.
by roger13 on Jun 16, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So back problems that affected him for almost 3 years
are a good thing?
I would say he’s a little old for a real prospect in AA, though I agree that he’s better than Lis—that was more a stylistic comparison than anything.
What kind of line do you see him putting up in the majors? i mean, he could put up a season or two where he looks like Adam LaRoche, I guess, but that’s the best he’s ever going to be, and even that’s a stretch in my opinion. Do you see a guy capable of 25 homers in a season?
if he could play a passable 3B, he’d be more of a prospect. Heck, if he could play a corner OF spot, he’d possibly be a good 4th outfielder. Since he can’t do either of those things, I still have trouble seeing a real role for him.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 16, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I could see something like
.300/.370/.450 with 15 homers and 35 doubles in a full season of play. The problem is getting him a full season of play. But I could see him as the primary DH if you move Kubel to the outfield.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 16, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Some back problems can have a good outcome
First of all, he had the problem for parts of three seasons—at the very end of his first season, throughout his second season and at the beginning of his third season. His numbers were only really hampered in his second season. In his first season (Beloit), his OPS was .903. In his second (Fort Myers), it was .582. In his third (Fort Myers), it was .788, which is not bad for a league in which league average is .750. Now that he’s all the way healthy, his OPS is back where it was before the injury .955.
Unlike disc problems, stress fractures do heal (slowly) without lasting effects. When they heal, there is no reason to believe they will recur. In Robbins case, it actually reduces his chance of injuring it again because the stress fracture caused a level of discipline with his back exercises that did not exist before. So he’s stronger and more likely to stay healthy now than when he was drafted.
As to his age, 24 is the average age in AA. He’s not old for a prospect. Neither is he young. But, in the Twins system, it’s almost impossible to be young for your level as a college position player. He’s the same age as Danny Valencia despite repeating High A because Valencia started in Elizabethton whereas Robbins made the unusual jump to Beloit after being signed.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 16, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ok, are we talking.....
Robbins can potentially replace Buscher for next season?
(if not right away in 2010 sometime that season)
-is that in the left-handed option off of the bench / backup for Morneau / backup for Kubel at DH option?
or
Is that actually as the backup 3rd basemen option?
I say it is the ‘lefty’ Bat option because Brendon Harris can play 3rd base marginally well, or just well enough.
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Jun 18, 2009 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Robbins isn't an option...
…at third base. Although he played there part-time in college and I think a little at Beloit three years ago, he has been strictly a first baseman/DH the last few years. If he continues to hit like he has this season, I see him making it up to the Twins some time in 2010.
by roger13 on Jun 18, 2009 7:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's restrain ourselves a little bit
In two years, he almost certainly won’t be a star—he’ll probably be a Rochester Redwing.
I like the guy. A lot. He also has 3 walks on the season. Now, he’s only 21 years old, so he has time to develop his plate discipline and other parts of his game. But frankly, most guys peter out. I think we tend to overrate our prospects pretty significantly. He has a very good chance to wind up a decent average, good defense backup catcher. Like Mike Redmond. I wouldn’t view that as a failure.
Think of it like this: in the Twins minor leagues right now, how many future average or better major league starting position players do you think there are? My offhand line would put the over/under at 2.5. I’m thinking one of the young outfielders (Hicks would be my guess, but it’s just a guess), maybe Ramos, and maybe one other guy somewhere. Or maybe it’s the under, and there are none. Or 1.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Considering that the Twins have been averaging...
…more than one average or better than average player from each draft (Morneau’99, Kubel’00, Mauer & Blackburn’01, Span, Neshek & Crain’02, Baker’03, Perkins and probably Swarzak’04, Garza and Slowey’05), one has to assume that there are more than 2-3 average plus players in the minor leagues. We just don’t know who they all are as of yet.
And that doesn’t include Latin & foreign players of which Ramos is part of. So I will take the over and expect that it is substantially over 2.5.
by roger13 on Jun 14, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was specifically talking about position players
not pitchers, which are a) more plentiful, and b) less predictable.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
actually, let's think about that
Take late 2002, I think that was the recent position player highpoint for the Twins minor leaguers.
At that time, Cuddyer was still in the minors, I guess he’s more or less established as an average player.
Kubel was in the minors—he’s probably about average, maybe turning into something more than average right now.
Span has turned into an average player—he was drafted that year, but actually doesn’t count because he didn’t play until 2003. Maybe in early 2003, after Cuddyer’s silly demotion, they were all in the minors.
And Mauer and Morneau, of course, were minor leaguers then.
OK, that was absolutely the high point—say June, 2003. 5 guys, which is really impressive. Anyone I’m missing? Oh, Jason Bartlett I guess qualifies sort of.
That’s 6, that’s a lot of guys. But the truth is, by June 2003, we could identify some of these guys. Cuddyer had gotten a taste of the majors and should have still been there, Mauer was clearly a monster, as was Morneau.
Are we anywhere close to that level with position players now? i thnk the answer is obviously no. I’ll stick with 2.5 as the over/under. Maybe I’m too pessimistic, but I’m not ready to call Wilson Ramos a future star.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll take the over...
…and as you would expect, believe that Ramos will be an all-star at some point in his career.
by roger13 on Jun 14, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Me too
Here are the position players I expect to be average or above major leaguers i the next four years (in order of their ascendancy:
1. Steven Tolleson: He’ll be an average second baseman.
2. Danny Valencia: He’ll be about at Crede’s level with fewer homers but a better OBP.
3. Ben Revere: He’ll be an average or above left fielder.
4. Wilson Ramos: The only thing keeping him from stardom will be playing time.
5. Angel Morales: He’ll be at least as good as Cuddyer in right.
6. Ramon Santana: He’ll be an average or above shortstop.
7. Aaron Hicks: He’ll be like Torii Hunter with a better batting eye.
There are others who could get there, like Whit Robbins. But those seven are about as good of a collection of position players as we’ve had since 2003.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 14, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow. I guess we'll have to agree
to disagree. I think you are just radically over-rating these guys. If two of those guys reach the levels you predict for them I’ll be happy. It’s more likely that at least one of these guys doesn’t even reach the majors than they all get where you have them going.
And I think it’s impossible to compare this group to 2003. Totally unfair to these guys.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I will add the following to the above list...
8. Dustin Martin: better than 50/50 that he will be a starting outfielder somewhere.
9. David Winfree: I believe he will be a reserve of/dh for someone.
10. Brian Dinkelman: As good of prospect as Tolleson.
11. Rene Tosoni: I believe he is the best of prospect in the organization other than Hicks.
12. D.J. Romero: The Twins are very high on this young man who missed much of last year.
13. Joe Benson: Has all the tools, just needs experience.
14. Chris Parmalee: Still has time to be big banger.
15. James Beresford: Another young middle infield prospect with a good future.
Now I am not saying that all of these will become major league regulars, but I believe that at least a third of these 15, plus a couple others who will blossom as they move up the ladder will. So my guess is that we have about 5 or 6 major league regulars currently playing in the organization.
by roger13 on Jun 14, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Winfree? Really?
I have to say, I don’t see it. He’s had to move to a corner outfield spot, which hurts his value. He’s never been an on base guy—career OBP .316. It’s hard to see him with enough power to overcome that. He strikes me as vaguely similar to Garrett Jones. Maybe a little less power, a little fewer strikeouts.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 13, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't he
Young for his level? Power could come and he had a vacation a year or two ago.
I think he will find more power and he seems to the ball in play.
by clutterheart on Jun 14, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not particularly young, no
He’s 23 now, turning 24 in August. Not really young for a prospect in AAA. Not really old, but not really young. And his strikeout rate isn’t particularly notable either way. Not super high, not particularly low.
Frankly, he’s kind of just a guy. Good power, no walks. OK average (.270 career), not a line drive machine. No positional advantage, no real flexibility. I wish him luck, but I have trouble seeing more than an occasional role as a major leaguer for him.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Winfree
is 3 steps above minor league Fill-In at the AAA level
but only 2 steps below every day Major League Player at either LF / RF/ DH
so he is a GOOD solid, future #4 OF and a good secondary DH option to Kubel.
I agree mostly with Cmathewson, [and kinda Roger] except for saying Angel Morales will be as good as or Better than Michael Cuddyer I say he won’t ever make the majors. (at least not with us)
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Jun 15, 2009 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ramon Santana SS or no?
So I’ve noticed that Ramon Santana has moved around a lot when I check box scores. In fact, since returning from injury I don’t know if I’ve seen him at SS once. Given, I don’t religiously check the box scores for minor leaguers but I do glance at them a few times a week at least. So I checked it out and here’s how his playing time has been divided up defensively.
DH 12
SS 9
2B 15
3B 4
LF 4
He split evenly between SS and 2B last season as well. So is he decent defensively? Is he just very versatile ala Nick Punto in that they use him wherever they need him? I like what he’s doing this year but when I look and see that he’s going to be 24 in a week and is still in Low A ball for the 2nd year should expectations be tempered quite a bit? He’d have to move pretty rapidly through the system even to see the majors by 26, even then it would likely be and end of the year September call up.
I guess my main reason for posting this was to ask what the reports on him defensively are. Is he so good they move him around or are they starting to think he’s overmatched at SS? I also thought it may have something to do with his injury and maybe SS being a bit too demanding if he’s still a bit hampered.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
by halfchest on Jun 14, 2009 9:47 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes, expectations should be very tempered
He’s way too old for that league. At some point, you have to acknowledge that if a guy is that age at that low a level, it shows what the organization thinks of him.
by Eric in Madison on Jun 14, 2009 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Santana
I agree with cmat’s list above with the exception of Santana. He’s having a nice year, but he’s like 5-8, 150, and this is his third year in Beloit. I’m not ready to get too excited about him yet, not until he does something at Ft. Myers (not that that is his choice or timeline.)
by SethSpeaks on Jun 15, 2009 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're right
You see an OPS about 1.000 in Beloit and you get a little giddy.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 15, 2009 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also
I can’t remember where I saw it, but Paul Molitor singled him out as a very good hitter recently.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 15, 2009 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Humber
How long is he to be in the organization?
With Fox and DeVries waiting, I just can’t see him staying.
by clutterheart on Jun 14, 2009 10:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'd say at least remove him from the rotation
At AAA alone he falling out of the depth charts quickly. The only reason I can think of to keep him in the rotation is to keep his value up for a trade down the line.
"I couldn't do that. Could you do that? Why can they do it? Who are those guys?"
by maxisagod on Jun 14, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
With Swarzak returning...
…Cliburn will need to move someone out of the rotation. With Bobby Keppel pitching very real good, the starter that has had the touhest outings and should be moved to the pen is Jason Jones. As for trade value, Humber cleared waivers. Having a second half like last year would imrove his trade value.
by roger13 on Jun 14, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he's a releiver
He has two good pitches and that’s it.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 14, 2009 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Swarzak, Keppel, Humber or Jones is a reliever?
by roger13 on Jun 14, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Humber
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 14, 2009 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
its between Humber and Jones
but with Cmath’s note above how Humber has only two good pitches that petters him into a reliever. Although Jones is no starter either.
Humber needs a change of scenery I think. He still has high potential but just needs to be in the NL or just a change of scenery.
by 33MorneauMVP on Jun 14, 2009 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hicks is finally headed to Beloit
now there is finally someone to see in Beloit. I have seen this team play many games this year. They are awful. But hopefully help is on the way
by NorthDakotaTwinsFan on Jun 18, 2009 1:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah!
I was worried they would send him to E-Ton.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 18, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its a little confusing to me...
If we were committed to holding Hicks back this long, I think he should have gotten some AB’s in the Appy League and then get promoted to Beloit.
But I guess, they think he is ready.
Ok, I’ll go with it – Go Aaron!
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Jun 18, 2009 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He must have had something to work on
Hopefully it was plate discipline, though his BB/K numbers were good last year (28/32) maybe they just wanted him to take more pitches instead of slashing balls off the plate into the gaps all the time.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Jun 18, 2009 8:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think this is the Twins SOP with high school #1 picks...
…and in a way it makes a lot of sense. 1) You have very young players who return to spring training and stay in a place that they are familiar with and warm; 2) All young players have something to work on, which they can really focus on in EST; 3) Then when all the draft picks begin reporting, they send the player to Beloit; 4) The player can gain the same experience in Beloit in 80 games as they would in 130 games and as Revere has demonstrated, is certainly ready to take their next step to Ft. Myers the following year.
by roger13 on Jun 18, 2009 8:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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