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Orlando Cabrera "Could go to Twins"...Do we want him?

Buster Olney has reported that the A's and Twins are "making steady progress" toward a trade for A's shortstop Orlando Cabrera.Ken Rosenthal has also reported that "The teams continued their discussions on Thursday and plan to continue talking Friday."

No specific Twins prospects are noted in either report, but previous reports have indicated that Billy Beane has asked for Danny Valencia in a deal. It is not clear whether Beane has reduced his asking price or if he's standing firm. What I can say is that the Twins open affection for Cabrera (from Gardy to Mauer and Morneau - allegedly) hasn't helped our bargaining position.

LEN III and many others have noted that Cabrera's OPS is pretty much the same as Brendan Harris and that he's not really worth pursuing. I disagree. While Cabrera is NOT worth the price of a Danny Valencia or other top 10 minor league prospect, I do think he's worth a lower tier prospect such as Trevor Plouffe or Luke Hughes just to get Alexi Casilla off the field (though his performance Wednesday was promising).

The real question regarding Cabrera (or Marco Scutaro, who the Twins are also pursuing) is the degree to which they would upgrade the ballclub. In an attempt to answer this, I did a quick and dirty analysis of the two players, plus a number of additional alleged targets (including Freddy Sanchez for comparison) and our current trio of Nick Punto, Alexi Casilla and Brendan Harris. Using fangraphs batting and fielding runs above average, weighted 50% / 30% / 20% over the last three years. Since we're only talking about middle infielders, and since we're comparing only to each other, I disregarded replacement and defensive position value for the purposes of this analysis.

Player Batting Fielding Total
Marco Scutaro 3.15 5.32 8.47
Freddy Sanchez (2.20) 3.40 1.20
Adam Kennedy (3.29) 2.28 (1.01)
Nick Punto (12.09) 7.13 (4.96)
Orlando Cabrera (7.17) 1.85 (5.32)
Brendan Harris (3.56) (5.76) (9.32)
David Eckstein (3.82) (5.60) (9.42)
Alexi Casilla (10.17) (4.48) (14.65)

 

According to these numbers, we should be all over Marco Scutaro, as he's nearly 10 full runs (assuming a full season) better than any other available player on the "shopping list". Plug him in at shortstop, move Punto to second and you end up with an astounding +23.2 runs. Accounting for the fact we're roughly 2/3 of the way through the season, and we're still talking about a more than 7 run improvement. Do the same with Orlando Cabrera and we're talking about a 3 run improvement from here on out. Not a whole lot in either case, but an improvement like this can mean an extra win or two. Obviously, players can over or under-perform these numbers, but at least they give us a baseline we can work with to evaluate options.

Regarding Valencia, there is absolutely no way I give him up one for one, even for Scutaro. However, I would at least listen if it meant the Twins getting not only a middle infielder, but also a solid bullpen arm we would keep beyond this season. Valencia + lower level prospect for Scutaro and Scott Downs? Perhaps...

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Yeah, I can't see it helping

because, although I don’t question your numbers, and I have little faith in Casilla, the truth is, he isn’t THIS bad. He almost can’t help but be better the rest of the year. The real issue is that Cabrera is not measurably better than Punto.

I don’t think I’m asking for much to say I would like them to acquire a middle infielder who’s better than Nick Punto.

by Eric in Madison on Jul 31, 2009 9:06 AM EDT reply actions  

I agree Casilla isn't -this- bad

but he’s, at best, on the order of where Punto is. I think we saw his upside (at least as far as this year is concerned) last year, and that was still about 12 runs below where Scutaro would grade out. Of course, Scutaro will probably drop off a bit as well…

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 9:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Summit EPA

It’s a little closer to the color of coffee. I save the Premium for the working lunch.

by Geno_P on Jul 31, 2009 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice

Makes me miss Minnesota.

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

And Minnesota

misses you. Come back and I’ll treat you to some Mantorville beer. Truly unique.

by Geno_P on Jul 31, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oops.

That post ended up in the wrong spot. Better cut back to a 6 pack before 1200

by Geno_P on Jul 31, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Scutaro would be a monster...

hitting in front of Mauer. He is ALWAYS on base. With a man that makes contact every single at bat, he would score just about every game. It is obvious he would be better than Cabrera, but just the idea of him hitting at he top of the order here… DAMN, I just don’t have the words this early in the morning.

by Geno_P on Jul 31, 2009 9:13 AM EDT reply actions  

Definitely better than Cabrera

I’d love to plug his right handed bat and solid OBP (.385 this year) in between Span and Mauer.

This early in the morning, don’t you need a Grain Belt Premium, Geno? ;)

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 9:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

Summit EPA

It’s a little closer to the color of coffee. I save the Premium for the working lunch.

by Geno_P on Jul 31, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

On Base

He is always on base, THIS YEAR. Isn’t his career OBP like .335, and this year it is .385. I wouldn’t bet on that continuing.

by snolls on Jul 31, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm surprised Punto gets such high marks defensively

His UZR/150 numbers are under water

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Jul 31, 2009 9:27 AM EDT reply actions  

Three year weighted average

+17.6, +10.2, +1.1 in 2007, 2008, 2009, respectively, comes out to +7.13 total.

This year from a UZR/150 perspective, he’s really dropped off at SS (-2.4), but he’s posted good numbers to make up for it at second (+15.4)

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 9:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would have rather had Scutaro

But I like Cabrera’s batting average a lot better than our other two middle infielders. And let’s face it, if you have two guys with similar on-base percentages (OCab and Punto), you want the guy with the better batting average (OCab).

What I really like about Cabrera is that he has postseason experience, which never hurts, and he has come up big in the past when the spotlight gets big down the stretch. In other words, he has a knack for coming up with clutch hits in key spots.

by Sheldon on Jul 31, 2009 9:30 AM EDT reply actions  

Scutaro

Not to be a downer, but who even knows if Scutaro is available. Toronto is being nonsensical on whether or not they are going to trade players and they don’t appear to be an agreeable organization to make deals with. The Twins are probably doing the best they can given the situation.

by WITwinsfan on Jul 31, 2009 9:33 AM EDT reply actions  

JP

seems to like all the attention he is getting.

by wcooley on Jul 31, 2009 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

Cabrera is an upgrade over Casilla at least

So if you move Punto to second, where his UZR numbers and arm don’t hurt you that much, we’d upgrade offensively and defensively at two positions. It’s not as good as getting Scutaro or Sanchez, but it’s something.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Jul 31, 2009 9:47 AM EDT reply actions  

Agree, but would rather acquire a 2nd baseman like Kennedy/Scutaro

That way we can replace Casilla and put Harris at short. The offense would much improved, I believe. We’d be okay defensively too.

by Sheldon on Jul 31, 2009 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

If we get Cabrera

then I will be alright with it. I would rather have Scutaro though. But frankly, any move that gets Casilla/Punto out of the lineup is a great move.

Cabrera takes over shortstop with Punto moving to second until Grudz is ready to go. Grudz comes up and plays second pushing Punto to the bench. New infield Morneau – 1B, Grudz – 2B, Cabrera – SS, Crede – 3B…I could live with that.

*Try to unload Delmon Young as well.

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Punto is a better SS than Cabrera right now.

www.twinkietalk.com
www.olympicsportsblog.wordpress.com

by fetch9 on Jul 31, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, but

Cabrera – Punto at SS – 2B is better than Punto – Casilla. That’s the point cmath was trying to make. One I agree with.

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

gotcha

I agree with that too.

Honestly I still think we need a reliever more than a middle infielder.

www.twinkietalk.com
www.olympicsportsblog.wordpress.com

by fetch9 on Jul 31, 2009 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

It's similar to the Gomez Span deal

Gomez isn’t that much better than Span in center but the combo of Gomez over Span in CF and Span over Young/Kubel in LF makes a huge upgrade overall.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Actually

Gomez is much, much better in center than Span.

by DK on Jul 31, 2009 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1

Span UZR/150 in CF -12.1
Gomez UZR/150 in CF 5.4

In short, Gomez is WAY better than Span in center. On the plus side for Span, he’s a much better LF than Delmon Young.

Span UZR/150 in LF: 16
Young UZR/150 in LF: -20.4

When you upgrade Young for Span and Span for Gomez, you end up with a UZR differential of 54.2. Young would have to hit a home run every night to make up for that.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Jul 31, 2009 9:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

3B

Valencia will most likely be our starting 3B in 2010. If we trade him for Scutaro/Downs combo, then we lose the only real 3B prospect in the system. Once again, it puts pressure on the Twins FO to make a trade or signing in the offseason..and we all know how great they are at getting a power hitting 3B (aside from their excellent signing of Crede).

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 10:10 AM EDT reply actions  

Yes, we do

It would mean we’d have to be high enough on Scutaro to sign him to an extension and address another position of need.

Would I prefer it? No. I’d rather trade one of our outfield prospects, we’ve got a glut there. Problem is, what’s Toronto going to do with another outfielder?

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Worst case scenario

They trade Valencia for Cabrera and sign Cabrera to an extension. That would be about as bad as the Pat Meares contract extension.

by DJL44 on Jul 31, 2009 10:19 AM EDT reply actions  

Valencia for Cabrera is a terrible deal

Son, when you participate in sporting events, it's not whether you win or lose: it's how drunk you get. ~Homer Simpson

by thewild_viking_twins on Jul 31, 2009 10:34 AM EDT reply actions  

+1

If we do that trade, then I am going to start questioning how faithful to the Twins I am. Valencia is the 3B of the future, which is now or next year. There is a reason why we rated Valencia the top prospect in the Twins system. Cabrera is worth a Trevor Plouffe or Luke Hughes, but not Valencia!

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

Any idea...

What a Cabrera / Grudzialanek middle infield would look like based on these metrics…

I’m guessing that’s what we end up with.

"I'm gonna make you cry...I'm gonna make you cry and dip my cookie in your tears!!!"

by mutleyil on Jul 31, 2009 10:43 AM EDT reply actions  

Well Cabrera has been worth half a win so far this year, but I assume he’s going to get better defensively, so maybe another half a win, maybe more considering he’s been hitting better lately.

Grudz could do just about anything seeing as he’s missed a lot of time, but I’m pretty excited about him actually. Hes a lot better with the glove than I thought and he doesn’t have a lot of power but has a decent OBP.

www.twinkietalk.com
www.olympicsportsblog.wordpress.com

by fetch9 on Jul 31, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

Grudz has always been a solid player...

Not a great player, but very solid. Based on his time with the Cubs, Cards, and Royals, he seemed like a good #2 hitter, not much range at 2B (but catches what he gets to).

This is all just based on personal observation though. I’m wondering what the numbers from his last couple of years say.

"I'm gonna make you cry...I'm gonna make you cry and dip my cookie in your tears!!!"

by mutleyil on Jul 31, 2009 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

Grudz has missed to much time

for me to have any idea what he would do. The problem with applying these metrics to him is that he hasn’t played yet this year. Thus he’s a 0.0, which is misleading since it’s relative to average. Perhaps I should have assessed relative to replacement anyway…

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would rather have Scutaro, but...

at least Mauer and Morneau will be somewhat happy. They were the one’s rumored to be talking to him on the base paths in Oakland. And it’s still way better than Eckstein!!!!!!!!!!!

by NYCisTwinsTerritory on Jul 31, 2009 10:55 AM EDT reply actions  

+1

As long as the Twins don’t give up too much (Revere, Swarzak, Valencia, Hicks) to acquire him, the trade could be the good faith move that keeps Mauer happy enough to continue his career with the Twins whether the trade “works” or not.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

Arrgh.......

Would Cabrera and Grudzielanek be better than Casilla/Punto/Harris? At least for this season?

What about next year. Punto will be back. Will Harris (arbitration). Harris seems to thrive when he plays, but not best at being a back-up. Yet if the Twins choose to give Valencia the looksee at third, Hrris is the viable back-up across the baord.

So it leaves Casilla in the wings. Assuming Cabrera would still be around in2010, what do the Twins look like in 2011.

Is Plouffe still a candidate? Is Tolleson/Singleton/Dinkelman the repalcement for Tolbert. Where does Luke Hughes fit in? (We can already scratch out such folks as Buscher, Macri, Machado). I’m sure Toby Gardenhire will join the mix at some point. And there’s otehr names…Debinson…why did the Twins 40-man him?

I see a double problem. How much time to do you give Alexi (he is still below his average from his latest call-up, although he ash walked more). Why did the Twins throw money at Punto. You know they won’t throw that away, as excuses can be found for keeping him on the field. Why was Tolbert some…bad. Why Buscher is Harris can be the back-up for Crede. Do the Twins still have anyone anywhere that can play first base if soemthing (heaven forbid) happens to Morneau?

Visit www.TwinsCards.com and check out "rosters" to see my collection!

by rosterman on Jul 31, 2009 11:57 AM EDT reply actions  

Wow.

Two lefties. A twins offer of Duensing and Winston Marquez, for example, wouldn’t have been enough. Could they have done better (dangling Plouffe, for example?).

Visit www.TwinsCards.com and check out "rosters" to see my collection!

by rosterman on Jul 31, 2009 11:59 AM EDT reply actions  

"Wow" to what?

Are you talking about Detroit and the Washburn trade?

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hicks for Scutaro???

I know it sounds crazy and I think we could honestly get him for less but what if we said Revere (and maybe more) for Scutaro and a reliever from the Blue Jays. Scutaro projects solidly as a Type A free agent. He’d be worth two high draft picks next year and I would rather see us trade a young high potential guy like Revere and even God forbid Hicks than Valencia. The Twins are a team that needs to make a move now while we have two of the top ten players in the whole game right now (Mauer, Morneau), great potential in our young starters, the best closer in baseball, and great complimentary pieces (Span, Cuddy, Kubel, Guerrier, Mijares). I point this out because there is no way we should trade a guy that is so close to helping us at the major league level. We’ve seen guys like Hicks and Revere burn out in the past and never pan out. Tools doesn’t mean sure thing and those guys are a long way from the majors, the future is or at least should be now.

So as much as I know it wouldn’t happen I think Bill Smith should be open to a trade of Hicks for Sctuaro and a reliever. Depending on who signs Scutaro we’d be sitting with some nice picks to find a new top prospect to replace Hicks and Valencia (as Valencia won’t be a prospect at this time next year).

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 11:59 AM EDT reply actions  

Crap, Crap, Crap.

'Right now, I am going to urinate' -Tom Kelly

by sw mn guy on Jul 31, 2009 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry-meant to reply to the Tigers/Washburn report.

You’re not full of crap at all, Mr. halfchest. Sorry again.

'Right now, I am going to urinate' -Tom Kelly

by sw mn guy on Jul 31, 2009 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha, that's cool.

I was just wanting a rebuttal instead of crap crap crap.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would do Hicks for Scutaro

Hicks is Carlos Gomez in four years. He has a lot of talent, but it’s a long way off. And we have a lot of outfield depth. So I would have bit the bullet on that one. I doubt I would send Hicks to the Pirates for Sanchez, though.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Jul 31, 2009 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

how about Angel Morales for Scutaro

plus a few pitching prospects: Humber and Fox.

Morales looks like he can succeed against Major League pitching but he is hardly a Hicks. I would trade Revere/Benson before Hicks.

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Humber

is not really a prospect any more. Every team in baseball had a chance at him this year and passed. He has minimal value.

by DK on Jul 31, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't know

I would have thought about it at least. If they could have gotten Sanchez and a reliever from the Pirates it would have been worth considering. However because Sanchez is only a type B he’s only worth the one pick. Plus you have to wait another year for that. Sanchez could easily put together a good year and vault himself up to a Type A though. The only reason he’s a type B is because he had a poor year last year.

I know Scutaro is a better defender but if you look at career numbers Sanchez is a better hitter and is a couple years younger. Scutaro is in middle of a career year and the main reason I would want to trade a high pick is because you’d get two first round shots at replacing his value in next summers draft. I think this is also why the Jays aren’t likely to let him go. Even if they decide to rebuild, the 2 first round picks would go a long way towards helping rebuild.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Scutaro is a FA after this year

I’d be willing to give up Hicks only if it resolved 2B/SS beyond this season. I’d have to guess considering how he’s played this year, Scutaro wants to test the FA market.

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

French = Swarak?

I’m not great at breaking down minor leaguers but I would think our best comparable to French would be Swarzak. Both are fairly young guys who did very well in AAA this year and decent so far in the majors. The other guy I’m not really sure about though.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 12:04 PM EDT reply actions  

Yep

I was just about to post that French is similar in quality and development to Swarzak (I prefer Swarzak because he’s had better peripherals throughout his minor league career, but they are similar). The other guy is comparable to Guerra, without the massive stumbles of the last year. Young in high A, big K numbers. The difference is, Guerra is a big guy, this guy is tiny. Probably destined for the pen.

It’s a good deal for Seattle, IMO. French could be a league average innings guy starting about right now. He’s been an innings guy in the minors, actually. Threw 170 innings last year in the minors, which is a lot. 150+ each year 2006-2008 which is very unusual for a minor leaguer.

I would not have traded Swarzak for Washburn.

by Eric in Madison on Jul 31, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1

I was going to say the same thing about not wanting to give up Swarzak for him. However how nice would it have been if the Twins would have gotten him last year on the cheap last year if Washburn would have pitched this well for us all year. hindsight’s always 20 20

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Neither would I

Swarzak for Washburn, that is. Especially considering it sounds like Detroit is eating the remainder of Washburn’s contract…

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Less than four hours to go...

I’m looking forward to this being over with… or at least the discussion shifting into the “post-mortem” debate.

by DavidRF on Jul 31, 2009 12:11 PM EDT reply actions  

Lavelle says no deal Susan disagrees

Link

She says Mr. Valencia is not part of the deal. There are other players I’d be upset about losing but he’s no. 1 in my mind so thank God for that.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:02 PM EDT reply actions  

oh yah and here's what Lavelle says

Link

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Deal is done...

..the Twins get Orlando Cabrera, the A’s get minor leaguer shortstop Tyler Ladendorf.

by Twins Territory on Jul 31, 2009 1:07 PM EDT reply actions  

link??

I’d accept that trade, Ladendorf is interesting but other than a good month in rookie ball hasn’t done anything too exciting.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks

Yah I just found it before checking back here. So reactions anyone????

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I like it...

..mainly because they didn’t give much up. He has similar numbers to Harris, but there is hope with his month of July that he’ll be an upgrade.

by Twins Territory on Jul 31, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

If this is true

it works for me. Cabrera is an upgrade over Casilla, M&M wanted him.

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not in that A's trade.

They wanted Wuertz, but he is not on the block as teams hoped.

by Twins Territory on Jul 31, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cabrera is a roster upgrade

However, you have to wonder if Gardy will use the roster well or just bury Harris on the bench.

by DJL44 on Jul 31, 2009 1:17 PM EDT reply actions  

As the roster stands right now...

…Harris would still get plenty of playing time. Crede and Punto aren’t going to play every day.

I vote we go out and get Scutaro + reliever as well. Send Casilla and Buscher down.

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

now the big question

Who gets dumped off the roster? My vote is for Buscher personally.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:19 PM EDT reply actions  

It'll be interesting to see.

Harris is most likely safe and I don’t see them dumping Punto.

by Twins Territory on Jul 31, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

whoops

yah I didn’t think about Punto, sadly he’ll never leave us no matter how much we want him to.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Punto is safe

When Grudz is ready to go, Buscher/Casilla gets let go.

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gotta be Casilla

Buscher is still useful as a LH bat (decent OBP). Casilla has been awful and is going to get buried on the bench. Better to give him playing time in AAA.

by DJL44 on Jul 31, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

not a bad point

If nothing else it could make him better off season trade bait if he goes down and “battles his tail off” in AAA

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

No, they won't

they will option him to Rochester, if anything. I sort of hope they keep him around and DFA Buscher.

Frankly, I have next to no reaction to this trade. i don’t think it improves the team

by Eric in Madison on Jul 31, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

it improves the team

by putting Punto at his best defensive position (if you can call anything his best position) and takes Casilla out of the lineup by subbing in Cabrera, who is a whole lot better than Casilla at this point and a little bit better than Punto.

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

why would they ever do that?

He has options why dump a guy, that makes no sense at all

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

they have said that this last callup

was Casilla’s last chance. Doesnt that mean that he will be traded/dfa???

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

traded maybe

but DFA means they HAVE to trade him right away. Casilla is young enough he could be a nice part of a deal to get us something in the offseason. He’s done well enough in AAA for teams to consider him to have upside.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very true, there is a CHANCE our whole MI will look upgraded soon.

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Jul 31, 2009 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Now, before 3 oclock

we have to add one more arm to the pen or rotation.

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:22 PM EDT reply actions  

+ 1

I don’t want to get greedy but yah it’s nice that they now have some extra time to work on getting an arm.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

I want to get greedy

Gordon Gekko style.

Get me an arm. Starter or a reliever.

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

LaVelle E Neil

Reports the front office is “wheeling and dealing.” More to come? This team could sure use an arm somewhere…

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Jul 31, 2009 1:24 PM EDT reply actions  

You beat me to it!

I’d love to get a starter like Davis or Jon Garland or something.

by Twins Territory on Jul 31, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

this could be very good

for the first time the Twins pull off a trade since 2003. Nobody can beat that trade though as that was possibly one of the best pre deadline deals ever pulled off by the Twins.

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm liking this deal

What’s the deal can we resign him?

by TonyO on Jul 31, 2009 1:26 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

The ball will probably be in our court

the way Cabrera has played this year. Suddenly I like him more… any more ex White Sox we can get?

by Adam Peterson on Jul 31, 2009 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can't see it

He probably flew back to Oakland last night with the team from Boston. No way he gets to MN in time.

by Eric in Madison on Jul 31, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe...

Buster Olney: Twins have told Cabrera they want him in the lineup tonight. He’s “running” to get there.

by Twins Territory on Jul 31, 2009 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

beat me to it

Yep just heard that on ESPN.

Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?

by halfchest on Jul 31, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cabrera to Twins

you can ride the O-Cab all the way to game 162… I mean the playoffs.

I worry about him batting 2nd but the Twins did what Mauer, Morneau, and Nathan wanted so we’ll see what happens.

by caluofmn on Jul 31, 2009 1:34 PM EDT reply actions  

plus more maybe

if the rumors are true about the front office still working hard, we could have a pitcher here soon as well.

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

We might all have to eat some crow if the FO actually does improve the ballclub

and I’ll be just fine with that. All i want is to see the Twins win.

by caluofmn on Jul 31, 2009 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

nice of the As to back off on Valencia

no way were we going to trade Valencia for Cabrera. Thats like trading Morneau for the As first baseman…Bailey?

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:34 PM EDT reply actions  

There was no reason to keep him. His deal is done at the end of the year and he does them no good.

by Twins Territory on Jul 31, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

That doesn't help either

because his contract restricts the team from offering him arbitration if he’s type A.

by Eric in Madison on Jul 31, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

oh really?

I wonder why that is…are the Twins allowed to offer arbitration?

by BCTwins on Jul 31, 2009 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's a clause in his contract that teams can't offer arbitration

So the only way they would get compensation is if he signs early, which isn’t likely.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Jul 31, 2009 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why

The reason for that clause is that some free agents have a hard time getting a contract if they’re Type A, because the teams signing them don’t want to give up their first-round draft pick. If his team can’t offer arbitration, then they’re not entitled to compensation picks, so anyone can sign him as a free agent without penalty. Cabrera is not all that valuable, but he’d be Type A because the crop at his position is pretty weak, so he’s especially vulnerable to a situation like that.

I’d assume the Twins can’t offer arbitration either; I’m pretty sure contract terms don’t change when a player is traded.

"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein

by BeefMaster on Jul 31, 2009 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

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