Fire Gardy

Which isn’t to say it’s the actual comment, but in total this was reported by the Star Tribune, which couched this way means that the reporter interpreted it in this fashion.

That doesn’t mean that’s how Gardenhire intended it. As we see repeatedly on this board, where people WRITE not speak, comments are often misinterpreted.

People see things through their own prisms. I don’t interpret this as “calling out” Span nor do I view it as leaving Punto off the hook.

>>We had the bunt on [for Punto] the whole way," Gardenhire said. “I thought we needed to get those guys over, and it just didn’t work out. But they walked the next guy and loaded the bases anyway. We got him over, we just didn’t get him in.”

Gardenhire seemed more upset at Denard Span, who grounded to third base on the first pitch after Punto’s leadoff double in the third. The Twins were down 4-1, and Punto wound up stranded on third.

“[Span] got the sign to get him over,” Gardenhire said. “That’s not understanding the game, and Span’s a better player than that. We talked to him about it. He’s a good guy at pulling the ball. You can’t chase a sinker away and try to hit it to the third baseman there. I thought that was a huge play.”

“Fire the manager” is easier than ’fire the players" ….

In terms of running the club, my biggest Gardy gripe is Punto. His defense doesn’t begin to make up for the complete suckitude with the bat – with that batting average, his outs have to be productive & they largely aren’t.

Oh, and it’s not like his inability to get a sac bunt down is something new.

Beyond that ….

We have one outfielder too many – “four outfielders for three positions” is one too many for the Twins (we’re in good shape at DH with Kubel). Delmon Young gives no indication that he’s ever going to get it. IMO, we should be sending Gomez out there every day & challenging him to become a leadoff hitter (hit him 9th for now, but that’s not where he should be).

The front office rolled the dice to get Young. It hasn’t worked out – that doesn’t mean the front office should be paralyzed in fear about rolling them again.

Most of us understand we’re not going to be in the market for the Sabathia-type free agent. That shouldn’t mean signing “everyday 8” free agents is out of the question.

Sign Joe. Get some Neshek insurance. Get after it with Frankie – - – too much talent there to let a fragile ego hold him back. Find people to play 3rd, SS & 2nd who don’t cause you to tear your hair out wishing you had SOMEONE else to send out there.

but the poor defense has also been responsible for the bad run prevention this year. And Gardy and the FO haven’t done much to put a better defense out there this year.

…this team really isn’t that good.

And they have absolutely killed themselves with some horrendous base-running this year. Ridiculous for veterans to get picked off and screw up that much. The 2009 Twins are not talented enough to get away with all the boneheaded moves they’ve made.

Some of this “Twins baseball” stuff, doing things right, has become a myth, if in fact the Twins have historically “done things right” more seasons than not.

im sick and tired of watching this fucking team lay down and get there asses handed to them by the yankees, red sox, and teams out of there division that have an “intimadation” factor. That comes down to the manager motivating the team to play like it’s anybody else. The only player that shows up for those games is Joe Mauer. Even Morneau plays like a pussy against the east. Do you see that with the White Sox or Tigers? no. They have a swagger, and they aren’t intimidated because they have the same type of attitude. We have a pussy manager and a bunch of pansies that bow down because they’re the small market boys playing against the big city teams with the big pay rolls. And no matter what the GM has to work with, that totally comes down to the players and manager stepping up.

I know it’s the internet here and all, but you’re putting an awful lot of the Twins’ misfortunes at Gardy’s feet. Sure he does things that annoy me from time to time, but who doesn’t?

Seriously, more calls go against the Twins because…the umpires as a whole dislike Ron Gardenhire personally? Really, dude?

But he seems to be liked by his players, and he seems to be a good motivator (from what I can tell, though that’s a tough thing to judge).

Who are all these players that have bad things to say about Gardy? I remember Mike Lamb left feeling disillusioned, but that’s about it. Provide some sources for the more ridiculous things you have to say.

dakotajim, you are a fool.

have managers to manage. It’s in the job title. And considering the talent Gardy has had, he’s done just fine. Ultimately it’s still the players who need to perform. Management can be ultimately held responsible, sure…hell, it’s why managers are the most common scapegoats and get fired all the time. But you can’t fire a manager because he’s been handed a handful of All-Stars and a bunch of scrubs and they’re a .500 club.

It’s a much more complicated issue than blaming one guy. Trades or signings that haven’t worked out, players having bad years, the fact that some of these guys aren’t even having bad years they’re just not the best players…the list goes on. Making Gardenhire the scapegoat for a team that’s not over-achieving is a mistake.

and Baker, Slowey, and Liriano have shown they can be quite good. Even Gomez is average when you factor in his defense.

Oh no, we only have 2 MVP candidates!!! How can we be expected to compete in this division?!!!

3

no harm no foul.

Ozzie is a love him or hate him guy…I love the quotes he gives us and the trouble he gets himself into sometimes. But love him or hate him, you can’t argue with the results.

This is how one should try to evaluate a manager.

I’ve noticed that this is the first season that the Twins have severely underperformed their Pythagorean record under Gardenhire – they’ve been 1 under a couple of times, and they were way over during each division title season. I know, no one’s been able to find anything statistical that appears to have an affect, but I wonder if it’s possible that some of those little managerial decisions are part of it – they don’t have much impact on overall run differential (save for the occasional massive Crain Wreck), but they lead to a few close losses that might otherwise be wins.

I wonder if Gardy simply had either a better feel or better luck with his early teams, and he’s simply had a harder time making things work with this year’s club. I think the #2 hitter situation is the best example of that – he got into his head what he was looking for in a 2 hitter, and he had a hard time adjusting when it became clear that what he was doing wasn’t working.

Has there been any research on whether there are managers that consistently outperform their Pythagoreans?