Nathan blew the game. Cut and dry. Not only did he give up two dingers, but he also walked two batters none of which was Redmonds fault. It was a good throw and a bang bang play. He could have caught it just as easily as he dropeed it, but either way that doesn’t erase what Nathan had done.

Castro was the starting SS you are takling about the BACKUP CATCHER!!! the two situations aren’t comparable. Remember Gardy isn’t the one who signs players the FO does. THey signed Castro he played him, they were both responsible for that screwup.

Morales is a good player and maybe a decent catcher, and he will be an upgrade to Redmond next year. But in the middle of a pennet race I would take the veteran over the rookie especially when there is a rookie on the mound.

Again I say THIS IS THE BACKUP CATCHER we are talking about! The 25th man on the roster! Get over it!

P.S. What happens when the shine wears off of Morales?

If Nathan doesn’t walk two guys they are he is in no position to make that play.

You are also assuming that if he caught it Wise would have been out. It looked to me that the slide would have been under the tag. Either way this lose is not Redmonds fault, if it is anyones fault it is Nathan’s.

The Gardy griping prevelant throughout parts of the blogosphere and Twitter has become such an inordinate amount of noise that I’m getting to the point where I unconsciously tune it out. The expansion of incredibly minor criticisms into a call for dismissal is silly. I’m glad you didn’t carry it that far.

So before this turns into another blind Gardy bashfest….

First, TC Brent is right: we’re talking about a preference for a backup catcher here. But I’ll go further. Morales was HORRIBLE defensively in April. I’m not saying he can’t handle the role of backup catcher (though I did say as much in April), but he was really, really bad, passed balls or no. Plus, it is more than acceptable to prefer a veteran to a raw rookie in a pennant race in a critical defensive position, especially when you rely on that veteran to help lead the team. Especially when it leaves the kids available to pinch-hit in high-leverage late-inning situations where he might be needed. (Which, by the way, happened yesterday, too.)

Now, I feel your pain on Bartlett. For whatever reason, I don’t think Gardy warmed to him, though he did defend him publicly quite a bit. But I don’t think you can pin him leaving on Gardy’s influence and it’s also worth noting that Bartlett had over 1200 plate appearances as a Twin (and hit just .271 in his career here). It’s not like he was buried on the bench for his career here.

Oh, and let’s not forget he did commit 26 errors his last year here.

Listen, I’m not slamming on Bartlett. I wish he was here. I wouldn’t trade him straight up for D Young by himself right now. But that falls on Smith, not Gardy.

Assuming you aren’t starting Mauer (which I think is the real management question here) w/ a rookie pitcher on the mound you start the veteran catcher. There is MUCH more to catching than defense once the ball is in play, and the fact that Duensing threw a gorgeous game shows that starting Redmond was the right move.

But I was under the impression that the reason Mauer sat afternoon games was so that he wouldn’t be worn down by the end of the season if we needed him for something like, gee I don’t know, a pennant race. IMO although 90% of the blame goes to Joe Nathan, Gardenhire is more at fault than Redmond for losing that game by playing a backup catcher in a key game down the home stretch in a pennant race.

“If they resign him, which I’m sure Gardy will argue for…”

This is so true. And so scary. I’m just going to say it. If Cabrera is our starting shortstop next year for more than 30 games, the Twins will not win the division.

Nice post Cmath. I agree with your general sentiment, but you’ve made a few exaggerations and omissions which really detract from your argument, I think.

First, it’s appropriate to note that UZR has not been kind to Bartlett this year. He’s currently sitting at -7.0, the worst figure of his career (Brendan Harris is at -4.7 as a SS this year). He’s also got a .966 fielding percentage, which ain’t very good for a guy who’s not showing much range. For him to win a GG over, say, Elvis Andrus this year would be criminal.

Second, this has been touched on already but claiming that Redmond’s inability to catch a tough hop at the plate “cost the Twins the game” is pretty outrageous. Joe Nathan’s inability to slam the door with two outs and two strikes and a two-run lead, combined with the team’s inability to scrape together more than two runs against a Mark Buehrle who could barely hit 80 mph, are far larger culprits.

Third, this is the wrong day to be complaining about Gardenhire ignoring statistics when choosing between vets and youngsters. Mike Redmond entered yesterday’s game with a .457 career average against Buehrle — he has always hit the ball well. And while his misplay at the end of the game was frustrating, you said yourself that everyone — young and old — makes mistakes. Redmond might not be the defensive player he once was but that’s a play he makes most of the time. If anything, Morales and Red are probably close to equal at this point on the defensive end, so playing Redmond against a pitcher he has owned over the course of his career was the right move.

Redmond should have hung it up last year. I to have always thought Gardy stuck with vets over skill for too long. The whole SS situation is were I really took a negative turn on Gardy. Bartlett was never given much of a chance from were I was watching. If he was still in Twins uniform, I would not be surprised if Gardy continued to march Punto out there more than him. That is the Gardy way. Ron White played much more than he should have just because he was a veteran, it made me sick to see that guy come to the plate. Same with Monroe when he made his short time in Mn. Gardy was reluctant to give Kubel and Bartlett chances. Vets will not get any better with more experience, young players will.

…is that Gardy has a preference for a veteran and what may almost be disrespect for young players. The best example of this is obviously Bartlett. There have been many others over the years, all to lesser extents. Others over the years have included Jason Kubel and anyone in competition with Nick Punto.

The problem with Gardy is that this is a small payroll team that must play with players coming up through the system. If he is unwilling to manage the team the organization puts on the field year after year, he is not the manager for this organization.

of a competetive MLB club that we think DOESN’T play veterans too much? I can’t think of a single example off the top of my head.

I guess he was on a leave of absense in 2008. Go figure.

Regards,

CMath is making. As for Redmond…well, it’s time. I can understand this year—Redmond had been a very good backup catcher, and had signed a 2 year deal. They weren’t going to get rid of him in May just because Morales was hot. But clearly, it’s time to part ways with him and let Morales have the job for 2010. If they don’t, why keep Morales around at all? It’s thoroughly unfair to him. He isn’t 21 years old.

gardenhire’s lineups are not the best guys every night. period.

Our startes stink, our bullpen has been bad and our depth is terrible. We have 3 All stars & 3 OK guys (Cuddy, Span & Kubs)
Besides that we have a flock of AAAA guys.
But this team has not given up.

Gardy has flaws but his teams havn’t taken a shit and plan their summer vacation.
Look at the white sox and see how they have rolled over. We could have but didn’t. That seems directly related to Gardy.

He has flaws, bad line ups and the whole Punto thing…only a fool would defend his lineups. But its not his fault that Bartlett is not on the team. He has said that he was against the D Young trade.

Firing Gardy is not the right move. Dumping Bill Smith is the right move. Then if a new GM wants a new coach, let him decide.

Jose Morales played second base his first two years in the Twins system. If we give him a middle infield glove and tell him to bust his ass in the offseason working on fielding ground balls, do you think that might work? His position is blocked by Mauer and Ramos (in the future), while there is a dearth of middle infielders in our farm system. He’s not going to hit for a lot of power, but his recent history has shown that he’ll hit for average and have decent patience at the plate.

Brendan Harris would be a better short term option defensively, but I’d kind of like to see how he would do, given at-bats on a consistent basis.

He had two Rookie of the year winners.

It’s everything with Gardenhire: the Punto man-crush, the inability to get along with Latins, jumping the gun on young talent, the inability to learn from mistakes, ad nauseum. It’s not just that his ceiling is so low, it’s that he’s just not bright. Tom Kelly had a sixth sense about players, especially pitchers and he knew how to use them brilliantly. Other than being able to appear colorful on a highlight reel – what can Gardenhire do well? Nothing. He’s a baseball media creation., and he’s gotta go. We can all hope Tom Kelly will come back, but in lieu of that – some young, hungry guy would be a vast improvement over Gardy.