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Twins 40-Man Roster Decisions

As we head into the winter and beging to think about who the Twins can or cannot add, it will be good to know how many spots we have to work with.  Or don't have to work with, as the case may be.

Pitchers:  17

Scott Baker
Nick Blackburn
Alex Burnett
Matt Capps
Clay Condrey
Rob Delaney
Brian Duensing
Deolis Guerra
Francisco Liriano
Jeff Manship
Jose Mijares
Joe Nathan
Pat Neshek
Glen Perkins
Anthony Slama
Kevin Slowey
Anthony Swarzak

Catchers:  3

Drew Butera
Joe Mauer
Jose Morales

Infielders:  8

Alexi Casilla
Estarlin De Los Santos
J.J. Hardy
Luke Hughes
Justin Morneau
Trevor Plouffe
Matt Tolbert
Danny Valencia

Outfielders:  4

Michael Cuddyer
Ben Revere
Denard Span
Delmon Young

Total:  32

Notes, and we'll also see which minor leaguers could become get taken in the rule 5 draft if they aren't added to the 40-man roster.

Star-divide

  • The 32 total does not include options for Jason Kubel and Nick Punto.
  • The total doesn't include impending free agents.
  • The total DOES include every arbitration-eligible player, so if somone is non-tendered then we can obviously take that into consideration.

Potential minor league free agents

Thanks to Seth Stohs, who kindly pointed out some not-so-subtle differences in how players can be lost off while in the minor leagues.

Minor league players become available for the rule 5 draft if they have spent four years in the minors without being added to the 40-man roster, if they were signed when they were 19 years of age or older.  If they were 18 years of age or younger, they can become free agents after five years.  As an example, Aaron Hicks was drafted in 2008 as an 18-year old.  This means the Twins must add him to the 40-man roster after the 2012 season, or risk losing him in the rule 5 draft.  Players who have been in the organization for six years without being added can become minor league free agents, like Brock Peterson.  Again.

So, which minor leaguers are eligible for the rule 5 draft this season?  Quite a few.  And it's a testament to the strength of the Twins system that so many of those players could make an impact.

David Bromberg, RHP:  Bromberg is a no-brainer--he'll be added.  He's seen as one of the "next batch" of starting pitchers coming through the system, and along with guys like Kyle Gibson and Alex Wimmers are expected to contribute sooner rather than later.  In 52 innings at Rochester this summer, Bromberg started nine games and pitched 52 innings following his promotion from double-A.  His base runners and strikeout rates were actually better after his promotion, when he struck out 47 while allowing 47 hits and 13 walks.  The nine homers allowed isn't pretty, but he still posted a very good 3.98 ERA.

Cole DeVries, RHP:  DeVries was an undrafted free agent, but even so, he's just completed his fourth season after signing with the Twins at age 22.  He's an interesting case, as his strikeout rates have gone through the roof since spending more of his time in the bullpen.

Ryan Mullins, LHP:  He doesn't profile as an impact arm, but along with Jose Lugo might be worth the Twins trying to keep around because they're left handed.  Are either Mullins or Lugo worth adding to the 40-man roster?  Probably not.

Kyle Waldrop, RHP:  Waldrop, like Bromberg, is as close to a sure bet to be added to the 40-man roster as you can get.  He induces ground balls, and while he pitches to contact he does what the Twins love and avoids walks.  At his best he only allows a hit per inning, which isn't bad.  Waldrop could be a part of the bullpen next season.

Tyler Robertson, LHP:  Robertson had a tough year, but he'd been a guy flying under the radar for a couple of seasons prior to 2010.  In spite of his number this season, largely in double-A, he's the best southpaw starter that's closest to the Majors, and there's a legitimate shot he'll be added.

Erik Lis, 1B:  After flashing some wicked power potential early in his career with the Twins, Lis has become a bit of an afterthought.  He couldn't adjust to triple-A this season, hitting just .205/.256/.355 in his first stint at Rochester as a 26-year old.  The Twins will need a place for Chris Parmelee in Rochester next season, so we might see Lis move on.

Brock Peterson, 1B*:  Like Lis, Peterson is blocked by Justin Morneau.  While Brock wasn't as impressive as he was in 2009, he still hit 19 home runs.  He's had a chance to leave the organization before, and this season I think he takes that opportunity.

Brandon Roberts, OF:  Unlike Brian Dinkleman or Dustin Martin, whose time might be short with a glut of outfielders on the rise, Roberts had a pretty good season in Rochester.  In 38 games he raked, hitting .333/.386/.425 while playing a good center field.  He turns 26 early next month, and no doubt the Twins will do what they can to keep him around.  Roberts will likely compete with Ben Revere for the fourth outfielder spot next spring.

Mike McCardell, RHP:  McCardell spent all of 2010 in double-A, where after a promising partial season there in '09, his numbers fell off the table.  The strikeout rates went through the floor, while hits and home runs spiked in a big way.  You can blame a lot of that on a terrible June and July, but there were a lot of people hoping for more out of McCardell.  That promise might see him added to the 40-man roster.

Chris Parmelee, 1B:  After starting the season in double-A, Parmelee was struggling so bad he was sent back to Fort Myers.  He murdered pitching there, was brought back, and responded with an amazing July and a good August before a bad month of September.  Parmelee turns 23 in February, and he's shown that he can kill the ball when he hits it and take a few walks along the way, so Parmelee is probably a lock to be added.

Juan Portes, UT*:  Portes raked back in spring training, if you remember.  At least he did right away.  There's pop in his bat and he can play a couple different positions, but I think he'd probably make it back to the Twins if he isn't added to the 40-man.

Steve Singleton, IF:  This will depend a lot on how the Twins plan to put together their Major League roster for next season.  Singleton doesn't hit well and doesn't walk a lot, but he plays good defense and can play the middle infield.  I doubt he gets added.

Rene Tosoni, OF:  He was hurt this season, but along with Roberts I expect Tosoni to be added to the 40-man roster...or traded to someone who will add him.  Tosoni is a .284/.381/.440 minor league hitter who isn't limited to one outfield position, and will be in his age-24 season in 2011.

Joe Benson, OF:  More of a sure-shot to be added than Tosoni or Roberts, Benson isn't 23 until March, and is seen to have more upside than either of the other two.  He's often described as a guy with tools.  While he's displayed occasional contact-hitting skills, he's definitely an outfielder with power--23 home runs and a .527 slugging percentage in 2010.

* denotes player who will become a minor league free agent if not added to the 40-man roster

Conclusions

We've already said that the Twins will have some difficult decisions to make this winter, and here are a few more.  How many players do the Twins add?  They don't want to lose Bromberg, Benson, Waldrop or Robertson, surely.  There are additional players who are eligible to be added, not to mention the possibility of the Twins adding a player who doesn't need to be added in order to avoid being lost.

Even with the recent news that the Twins will likely decline Punto's option, if Minnesota adds five players that brings their roster total to 37.  If they pick up Kubel's option, that's 38.  We've seen the Twins operate with just two spots open over a winter in the past, and they could viably do it again as long as they're especially selective about potential free agents.  Non-tendering Condrey, which seems to be all but gauaranteed, and any other arbitration-eligible player would give them a little more room to maneuver.

Which of these players do you add?  If you're Bill Smith, how much room do you want to leave yourself to make moves?

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They still have over a month until these decisions need to be made...

…with them making their additions last year on November 20. I see that there are four sure additions…Rene Tosoni, David Bromberg, Joe Benson, and Chris Parmelee. You can probably add Kyle Waldrop to that group to make it five.

Another group who will get some consideration is probably led by Tyler Robertson, who I understand is being moved to the bullpen. They will probably also give some thought to Brad Tippett, Miguel Munoz, Michael McCardell and a few others. Singleton, Dinkelman and Roberts have all been exposed to the draft in previous years, thus will probably pass through again. If you are looking for a surprise like De Los Santos last year, take a look at Yangervis Solarte. As for De Los Santos, he is probably most likely to be removed if they believe someone is a better prospect and likely to get drafted. Expect the Twins have a good feel which of their players are at risk to be taken by someone else and which aren’t and don’t need to be protected.

by roger13 on Oct 14, 2010 5:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Did they cut Repko already?

He should still be under team control.

by DJL44 on Oct 14, 2010 6:46 PM EDT reply actions  

I'm not so sure.

The Twins signed him as a minor league free agent back in April, and he’d gone through aribtration three times already.

He might be eligible for arbitration a fourth time, based service time.

by Jesse on Oct 15, 2010 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

From what I can tell

He’s arbitration eligible and still has a minor league option available.

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

Fun comparison

According to Fangraphs Franklin Gutierrez was only about 1 win better than Repko last year.

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jason Repko

Going into ‘10, Repko had 3.067 yrs. of service. He would be short of four years since he was called up more than 67 days into the season. I don’t know if he has options remaining, but he should be on the 40-man at this point.

by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Oct 15, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

Roster cleanup

Cut or trade:
Delaney
Slama
Swarzak
De Los Santos
Tolbert (there will be dozens of equivalent players available)
Hughes
Perkins
Neshek

If they can swap those guys for one decent cheap bullpen arm and/or utility infielder they will be ahead. I wouldn’t be upset if they swapped Manship, Guerra, Butera or Morales either.

by DJL44 on Oct 14, 2010 6:52 PM EDT reply actions  

There's really no need to be so aggressive

With all the free agents plus Condrey, Neshek, Slama and Delaney, we would have room to add 12 players to the roster. Only five or six minor leaguers are at risk for the Rule 5. That leaves seven slots for acquisitions, more than I have seen in all my years of following the Twins.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 14, 2010 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Only dump them when necessary

Still, I would rather see the dead wood moved for something useful.

by DJL44 on Oct 14, 2010 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think Tolbert or Hughes are dead wood

Tolbert is better and cheaper than Punto, for example. So if he’s the default util guy, I’d be OK with that. When you say there are dozens of players available, it’s a bit of an overstatement. Very few are available for the major league minimum. I have made the case that Punto is way overpaid for a util guy. But when I did the research, I found that good veteran util guys cost from $2 to $4 million. I just don’t see the value in that when you have Tolbert at the minimum.

Hughes has a lot of upside. He might be one of these late bloomers who contributes off the bench for a few years. At any rate, he’s the closest thing to a right-handed hitting prospect in the system who can contribute now. It was a noticeable hole on our bench this year: Someone who could PH for Kubel against lefty relievers. Harris was supposed to be that guy, but he never really was. Hughes can be if he can finally stay healthy.

De Los Santos is the best defensive shortstop in the system. He’s no great shakes with the bat, but he could become a useful utility guy if he just improves a little with the bat. As I said, the ultimate value of that is $2 to $4 million a year.

I would expect the Twins to hold onto half of those pitchers. None of them will have major roles. But pitchers get hurt. You just don’t toss them away when it costs you so little to keep them.

The problem with removing guys from the 40 man is teams can claim them for free. In many cases, it’s not worth the risk.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not really

Hughes hits right handed, can play more than one position and has upside.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed

Hughes is head and shoulders ahead of that comparison. Would love to see Hughes as a RHB off the bench, platoon DH/RF/2B. Would also like to see him be healthy for once!

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's a Plan D

He can’t outhit or outfield a free agent utility infielder. MLE of .230/.288/.379 based on his AAA batting. His glove is rated below average at 2B and 3B; he is definitely unable to play SS. There may be upside because he’s Australian and only 25 but let’s see it first.

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Any projections based on his last two years...

…are worthless. The kid hasn’t been healthy. We don’t really know how he would hit when/if he is ever healthy. There have been indications from the past that he just might be pretty good. I for one am looking forward to seeing what he can do.

by roger13 on Oct 15, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right

When he was healthy, he hit better than Danny Valencia. He is no great defender—somewhere between Harris and Tolbert imo—but he’s good enough to be a bench bat.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

RH doesn't help much

We need a RH outfield/1B bench bat – a BIG bat. We need a LH platoon guy for Hardy, Valencia and Casilla who plays great defense. I would be shocked if Hughes was a 120 OPS+ RH bat next season.

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Me too

Very few bench bats do better than 100 OPS+. But that’s an upgrade over what we had in 2010:

Harris: 23
Punto: 65 (as a right handed batter)

We might need a big bat, but I doubt we can afford one. If we’re debating whether to tender Hardy a contract (which some reports indicate), we obviously can’t go out and get a “big bat”. We will have to content ourselves with a a minor upgrade.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

available RH bats

Pat Burrell
Jeff Francouer
Jonny Gomes
Austin Kearns
Jose Guillen
Magglio Ordonez (ooh, I like this one)
Andruw Jones
Manny Ramirez

I keep thinking what they need is a good glove, good speed, decent OBP guy for LF. Dare I say we need another Dan Gladden?

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

More bats

Lance Berkman
Jorge Cantu
Troy Glaus
Ty Wigginton (good fit)

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Non-tenders

Ryan Ludwick
Edwin Encarnacion
Conor Jackson

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

These guys are worth considering

But most of them will get better than minimum deals. Some of them will get multi-year deals for tens of millions per year. Berkman for example.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

My Roster

Here is how I see the 40 man roster for 2011

  • Notes Addition to roster

Pitchers: 17
Starting Pitching
Scott Baker
Nick Blackburn
*David Bromberg
Brian Dunesing
*Kyle Gibson
Francisco Liriano
*Tyler Robertson
I believe that we will have a spirited battle for the fifth starting spot in spring training. The only way it will not happen is if we find a veteran starting pitcher through free agency, a trade, and Carl Pavano comes back. Scott Baker’s elbow issues are also a concern.

Bullpen
Alex Burnett
Matt Capps (Closer or setup)
Clay Condrey
Rob Delaney
*Cole DeVries
Deolis Guerra
Joe Nathan (Closer)
Pat Neshek
Anthony Slama
*Kyle Waldrop
Here we are looking at 10 people battling for six or seven spots at the most.

Catchers: 3
No Change
Drew Butera
Joe Mauer (Starter)
Jose Morales

Infielders: 11
*Brock Peterson, 1B
Alexi Casilla, 2B
Michael Cuddyer, 2B
Estarlin De Los Santos, SS
J.J. Hardy, SS
Luke Hughes, IF
Justin Morneau, 1B
Trevor Plouffe, IF
Jim Thome, DH
Matt Tolbert, IF
Danny Valencia, 3B
Not much changes here. I added Jim Thome because he wants to be back and I believe the Twins will let him return. The main addition will likely be Brock Peterson with a possible Platoon with Justin Morneau. At this point, I don’t see Chris Parmelee being added to the roster though he will likely get a invite to spring training. His numbers show that he needs more seasoning. The Twins will likely go with six infielders for the season.

Outfielders: 7
*Joe Benson
Jason Kubel
Ben Revere
*Brandon Robertson
Denard Span
*Rene Tosoni
Delmon Young
I can see the Twins going with four or five outfielders to start the season with Michael Cuddyer as a possible outfielder. The only way a starting outfielder position opens is if Delmon Young is traded.

by Jessy S on Oct 14, 2010 7:39 PM EDT reply actions  

I think Kyle Gibson will be added sometime during the season.

I could see the Twins DFA 2 of the following pitchers: Swarzak, Condrey, and Delaney.

by benhertz on Oct 14, 2010 8:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Singleton doesn't hit well?

But he had 54 extra base hits, with 57 strikeouts.

Only 4 GIDP in 564 plate appearances.

Of course, I’ve never seen him play, so I don’t know if his doubles/triples are bloopers or solidly hit.

.267 / .325 / .410, age 24 in AA.

by benhertz on Oct 14, 2010 9:00 PM EDT reply actions  

I have...

seen him play a few times, including a couple games down in Arizona. The pop in his bat his legit. And the numbers you point out are all noteworthy. Defensively, he can play 2B, SS and 3B. Is he a future all-star? Probably not. But could he contribute as more than a utility player? I definitely think so.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 14, 2010 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sing could have a future role with this team...

…He is solid defensively and may be a better hitter (average) than his season at New Britain shows. I doubt that the Twins will protect him as they likely don’t think he will be selected in the draft as he wasn’t last year.

Also, no need to put Gibson on the 40-man roster now. Add him next summer when they are ready to bring him up.

by roger13 on Oct 15, 2010 7:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

He does have some power.

And a .735 OPS isn’t terrible for a middle infielder, so it’s all relative.

I could have been more clear—he’s more like Portes in the fact that he does offer some power, and is probably a better contact hitter than Portes, but by “hit well” I meant “put up a decent line”. 24 isn’t young for AA.

by Jesse on Oct 15, 2010 3:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not a prediction, more what I'd do.

Roster going into the Rule 5 draft:

Baker
Blackburn
Bromberg
Burnett
Delaney
Duensing
Guerra
Liriano
Manship
Mijares
Neshek
Perkins
Robertson
Slama
Slowey
Swarzak
Waldrop

Butera
Mauer
Morales
Casilla
Hardy
Hughes
Plouffe
Tolbert
Valencia
Benson
Cuddyer
Kubel
Revere
Roberts
Span
Tosoni
Young

(Nathan and Morneau on the 60)

That’s 34. We’ll need a few spots for FAs, and I don’t want to get into the roadblock spot we did this year with de Los Santos having to remain on the roster. Whether I put Parmelee on the roster depends a lot on how Justin is feeling in a month and whether I feel I have any money to spend on a backup plan. I don’t think there’s a big risk of someone carrying him all year, so I’m willing to gamble a bit by leaving him off if the situation is appropriate.

I wouldn’t have a problem with keeping Mullins instead of Perkins or DeVries instead of Neshek or Singleton instead of Tolbert; would want information that I don’t have and presumably the real Twins do to make those choices.

I’d also probably be looking to trade Morales since he’s clearly not going to play here and should have plenty of value.

by timprov on Oct 14, 2010 9:20 PM EDT reply actions  

Not until they get a real backup catcher

I’d love to see the Twins grab a veteran backup and put Butera back in AAA.

by DJL44 on Oct 14, 2010 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Givens

I agree with Roger… Benson, Bromberg, Parmelee, Tosoni, Waldrop are givens. I also think that Robertson will be added. Singleton is next in line for me. Then there are some eligibles that I just don’t think would be able to stay with a big league club, guys like Beresford and Munoz.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 14, 2010 10:40 PM EDT reply actions  

This is where I am as well

Benson, Bromberg, Parmelee, Tosoni, Waldrop and probably Robertson are all adds. That six guys right there. Of the initial 32 already on the roster, I see Condrey as the most likely drop. Then picking up Kubel’s option brings us up to 38 to start off the hot stove league.

by Adam Peterson on Oct 15, 2010 7:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

Good question

but I don’t see Condrey as a key part of the bullpen next year. Nathan and Capps will anchor the back of the pen, with perhaps Crain or Guerrier re-signed as well. Mijares and Perkins from the left side, leaving a couple spots for Burnett, Slama, Delaney, Manship, Neshek and Waldrop to compete. Perhaps Robertson as well from the left side.

Frankly, the pen is going to hinge on Nathan and Neshek’s health and what we can bring from the left side. Is Robertson ready to contribute? Who else do we have who can get lefties out? If Neshek can be effective, I may even be inclined to re-sign Fuentes before Crain or Guerrier to give Mijares a second tough lefty.

by Adam Peterson on Oct 15, 2010 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

So if I’m rephrasing correctly, your plan is to use one slot for a FA and fill the rest from within? I think that’s reasonable and fits with your roster construction. Though I suppose you could waive de los Santos if you need an extra spot later.

by timprov on Oct 15, 2010 9:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

Bullpen

If they start the winter meetings at 38, they can make a Rule 5 pick or two. Also, at that time, bullpen F/A won’t have signed. The Twins can always sign bullpen guys right through the start of spring training, if they feel they need it.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

You mean MFAs, right?

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes

Like Mahay… or maybe even a guy who thought he could get $3 million and ends up signing for $850,000.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 16, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

Pretty much, yes

Losing Rauch, Fuentes, Crain and Guerrier would be tough, especially with Nathan and Neshek question marks. Pick the best of the four and go with it. Crain or Guerrier would be the best values, as we wouldn’t be paying for saves.

by Adam Peterson on Oct 17, 2010 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

Givens

I don’t think Parmelee would be able to stay with a big league club all year either. He’s not going to be a fourth outfielder for anybody and few teams are going to use a roster spot on a position player that doesn’t contribute. The chances of losing an outfielder via the Rule 5 draft are remote (none lost in the last two years) so why use a 40 man roster spot for Parmelee?

by East Coast Twin on Oct 15, 2010 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

Because he can hit.

Guys have to be added every year, and he deserves to be. He just needs to show that he can hit at AAA next season.

by Jesse on Oct 15, 2010 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

If you're another team

Why would you spend a roster spot on a 1B/corner OF with a minor league OPS under 800 who has half a season in AA?

by timprov on Oct 15, 2010 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Who knows.

Teams out there need hitters, and he’d be cheap.

I’m not saying he’d be taken, but he’s good enough to be worth protecting.

by Jesse on Oct 15, 2010 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

He'd be taken...

No question about it. There is a reason guys like him never get selected in the Rule 5… because they are always protected. Let’s also not forget the role that Parmelee could have with the Twins as early as next year as insurance for Morneau.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s a conclusion without basis in fact.

In 2009 Jamie Hoffmann had better stats in AA-AAA than Parmelee had in 2010 in A-AA. The Dodgers didn’t protected Hoffmann and he was selected in the 2009 Rule 5 draft. By the end of spring training he cleared waivers and was back in the Dodgers organization.

Player League AVG OBP SLG OPS
Hoffmann AA-AAA 0.291 0.39 0.466 0.856
Parmelee A-AA 0.285 0.356 0.401 0.757

Guys like Parmelee never get selected in the Rule 5 because teams realize that guys like Parmelee have very little chance of sticking on the major league roster for a full year.

by East Coast Twin on Oct 15, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not a meaningful comparison...

…Jamie Hoffman was a 25 year old outfielder who was signed as a free agent out of New Ulm. Chris Parmelee was a 21 year old former first round pick. Besides the age differance making the comparison of the two difficult, whether it is fair or not…teams do put a lot of value in a player having been a first round pick. Especially when they are still young and moving up.

by roger13 on Oct 15, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1

Huge difference between Hoffmann and Parmelee.

by Jesse on Oct 15, 2010 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

You used an example that supports Seth's point

The kid was taken. Whether he ended up on the big league roster for the year is another matter. But you don’t risk a former number 1 that way.

Besides, the Twins have plenty of room to add Parmelee and a half a dozen other guys and still acquire a hand full of free agents. This is the easiest 40-man roster to fill out in years.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

You're right...

easiest to fill out, the only decision will be how full to make it…

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

What's our organization's (arguable) biggest weakness?

Right handed power. If Parmelee “gets it” this season, I could see him being a solid bench bat over the second half. Sometimes guys pick it up once they get the opportunity, see Valencia and Span.

by Adam Peterson on Oct 17, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yep

But as ACAS says, he’s lefthanded. Benson has a shot, though, because he’s defensively ready now, and I can’t see how he’d be worse than Repko from a contact perspective. But he has much more power.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 18, 2010 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oops

I thought he was left handed up until mid season where I (thought I) read that he was right handed.

by Adam Peterson on Oct 20, 2010 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

He deserves to be added to the 40 man roster? What does that mean? If he needs to show that he can hit at AAA, then he’s probably not going to stick on another team’s 25 man roster for a full season. Why protect him?

by East Coast Twin on Oct 15, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1 It makes ZERO sense to put Parmelee, Benson and Tosoni on.

Why start the clock if you don’t have to?

Unless they can crack the 25 man roster there is no need. It would be Stupid for Smith to do this.

by clutterheart on Oct 15, 2010 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Disagree on Benson

His glove is good enough to contribute off the bench. He absolutely has to be protected. Parmelee and Tosoni can probably wait but why risk it with all those roster slots.

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Zero sense?

Why? There’s plenty of room. I don’t know why you even sweat those decisions.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Will the be Eligible if they are not on the 40 man?

There is not an asterisks behind their name, so I was under the impression that they are not available for the Rule V draft.
I also don’t think they will be effected by the Minor Leauge portion of the Rule V draft.

Is that wrong? If so then God yes get them on the 40 man roster. But if the FO does not HAVE to put a minor leaguer on the 40 man roster, all they do is waste a spot by having AAA players on it.

by clutterheart on Oct 15, 2010 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

2006 high school draftees and 2007 college draftees are elligible, roughly

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

for the most part...

Ben Revere was a 2007 high school pick, but he turned 19 before he was drafted, so he would have had to be added too… (I know he was already added, but that was one that stood out to me)

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

The clock will start for all three...

…either as members of the Twins organization or someone else’s. Benson would certainly get selected and be lost. And from what I understand, the Twins are higher on Tosoni than Benson. Granted, Tosoni was injured last year but his surgery wasn’t the type that should be career ending. Parmelee hit very well after his return to New Britain and will also be added or gone. You don’t lose three of the organization’s top prospects when you have space on the 40-man roster.

by roger13 on Oct 15, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

What clock?

The “options clock”? Big league service time only counts if they are on the big league roster.

by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Oct 15, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I preseume he means the options clock

If a kid can’t make the team after three years on the 40 man, he’s probably not worth much. The most regrettable such player was Restovich. But he would have been lost to the Rule 5 if we had not protected him when we did. Same with Benson, Parmelee, Bromberg, Robertson and Waldrop. Not sure about Tosoni or Dinkelman.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Pitching !

The Twins desperately need starting pitchers. The playoff games made it obvious that dominant teams have dominant pitching. It’s the most important ingredient in winning baseball teams.

by Peter Jung on Oct 14, 2010 11:08 PM EDT reply actions  

about that picture

was clay condrey on the twins softball afilliate as part of his rehab because it looks like he is pitching slowpitch.

current resident: ron gardenhire

by gardy's dog house on Oct 15, 2010 1:30 AM EDT reply actions  

Gardy Bunting Gif

This is completely off topic, but does anyone know where I can find that Gardy bunting gif someone posted in a game thread? It’s Gardy with a bat and the screen just keeps flashing ‘Bunt. Bunt. Bunt.’ I have been searching this site and cannot find it. I NEED to send that to my friend…He isn’t the biggest Gardy fan so I like to rile him up when I get the chance.
Thanks!

by Butch Huskey's Breakout Year on Oct 15, 2010 10:55 AM EDT reply actions  

Moves to make

Condrey is a goner. Repko likely will be taken off the 40-man and given another Minor League contract. Delaney, Swarzak, and perhaps Slama might be taken off the 40-man. It wouldn’t stun me if Manship was demoted (I’m probably not as high on him as most, but he doesn’t seem to have much upside beyond lost cause long man). I suspect that the Twins will non-tender one of Perkins and/or Neshek (my guess is Neshek). De Los Santos and /or Hughes could be taken off the list. That would leave +- 28 slots taken, then add Waldrop, Robertson, Benson, Bromberg, Singleton, and Parmalee and there is room to add several players on the 40-man.

by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Oct 15, 2010 11:50 AM EDT reply actions  

Why Remove...

Why would you remove the likes of Manship and Slama and Delaney at this point? They all could help in 2011, and there is plenty of room on the 40 man roster to keep them. De Los and Hughes won’t be removed. Hughes could make the team next year.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Players that the Twins should be thinking of doing something with...

…Glen Perkins and Anthony Swarzak will lead this group. Can the Twins trade them? Probably not, unless they are included in a bigger deal. Expect they will keep Neshek, hoping that in his second year after surgery he will get his velocity back and be what he once was. Personally, I would remove De Los Santos and I suspect if the Twins need a spot he will be a candidate to go. But depending upon how many of their free agents they bring back, appears to be lots of room if they add only 5 or 6 (would include Robertson).

by roger13 on Oct 15, 2010 2:12 PM EDT reply actions  

Perkins

The Twins will likely lose Fuentes, Flores and Mahay (not that the last two are a big deal), and Mijares was less than wonderful in 2010, so I think Perkins stays just cuz he’s left-handed. Swarzak has upside, we’re seen that, and he’s got an option left, so might as well use it.
De Los Santos won’t be removed (or shouldn’t). c-mat wrote recently that he’s their best Defensive SS, and that’s true from a range standpoint… I think you have to stand by him for another year.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree

Perk is the second lefty until they acquire a veteran. SO they need him for insurance if nothing else.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 16, 2010 2:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

This whole discussion is weird

The 40-man roster is easy this year because we have so many free agents and so few players to protect from the Rule 5. Jesse’s list has 32 players and includes Condrey and at least one other pitcher the Twins could easily remove. That’s 10 spots for six new minor leaguers, two major leaguers off the 60-day DL (Morneau and Nathan) and two open spots.

The six minor leaguers include:
Waldrop
Benson
Robertson
Parmelee
Tosoni
Bromberg

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 2:19 PM EDT reply actions  

+Mullins

LHP are always useful. Brandon Roberts will probably compete with Repko for the 4th OF job.

by DJL44 on Oct 15, 2010 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mullins made it through last year

He didn’t do any better in 2010 than 2009. So he probably will make it through in 2010.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mullins

and he tops out at about 85 mph, when healthy, which he wasn’t this year.

by SethSpeaks on Oct 15, 2010 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jesse's list of 32 includes...

…Morneau and Nathan. So they have 8-10 spots for 6 minor leaguers who have earned being added and another 2-4 spots to bring back a free agent or two and sign another.

by roger13 on Oct 15, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is Morales out of options?

If so he’ll need to be traded if the team decides to go with Butera as the backup catcher again. I can’t see him passing through waivers. Butera at AAA would allow them to keep their catching depth, but that doesn’t seem like something the Twins would do.

by Jon Kammerer on Oct 15, 2010 3:54 PM EDT reply actions  

If the Twins don't get a "bench bat" this year

then Morales would be the cheap pinch-hitter/3rd catcher/backup 1B. I can see this…trading him makes sense too, but he probably won’t start at catcher too many places because of his defensive shortcomings, but he’s too good of a hitter to be a “throw-in”.

by bbeeck on Oct 15, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Morales

Wasn’t added to the 40-man until he was promoted for that one game in Chicago (2007?) and an option wasn’t used for that year.

by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Oct 15, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Morales

He was optioned in March 2008, May 2009, and May 2010. That’s all he gets. He’s either on the 25-man roster, the DL, or he’s gone.

by matthew0211 on Oct 15, 2010 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 15, 2010 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agree that the choices are not that painful

However they are still decisions that are going to be made. I think that the guys who have stagnated would be better off in other organizations, unless they have big upsides. That is why I think the Twins should take Swarzak, Manship etc. off their roster. Also, I am not at all high on Hughes. He has done nearly nothing above AA and has been injured more than he’s been healthy. Fourth OFs are also a dime a dozen, so I don’t think the Twins should protect anybody they are thinking of as that type of player.

by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Oct 15, 2010 3:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Hughes projects for 0.8 WAR as a 3B according to CHONE

basically the definition of a bench player. He’s got value at AAA as insurance for 2B/3B. Manship had a 3.60 FIP and 3.90 XFIP this year, I wouldn’t mind seeing him as the 7th reliever. He’s got a major league curveball which may play up in the pen.

Any prospect that projects to a major league role, even long reliever/bench, should probably be kept around. It wasn’t too long ago that Span was considered a bust and I don’t think many people were high on Duensing before the end of 2009. You never know in baseball, so you might as well keep players around untill you need the roster spots.

by Jon Kammerer on Oct 16, 2010 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed

Definitely wouldn’t want to see Manship cut loose yet. I’d much rather cut bait on Swarzak at this point if it came down to that. I’d also rather see them keep any of the extra bullpen guys, other than Condrey, over Perkins, which is why it’s unfortunate that he looks like the second lefty at the moment.

by DK on Oct 17, 2010 5:22 PM EDT reply actions  

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