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Around SBN: Bob Sapp Denies Throwing Fights

One Thing I know - There's Always the Unknown.

Predicting a Star

One of the toughest things to do in sports is accurately predict a star.  In baseball this process comes to a head during contract negotiations with players still under team control.  The question; is this player worth spending money on when the alternative is a younger/ cheaper player or a more expensive free agent that you have a better idea of his qualities?  When evaluating a talent there are so many factors that go into it.  What will the player do with the opportunity?  Does the player have an Injury history?  How determined is he to improve and will that decline with the new lifestyle big money will bring?  Is the player mature enough to handle the added pressure of new expectations?  Most importantly, what is the player's ability?   To illustrate this better let's compare the Twins organization in 1995 and the Twins in 2011.

Look back at the 1995-2001 Twins teams.  You would think some of those players during the Twins "Dark Ages" would be here making some sort of contribution to Major League Baseball if not to specifically the Twins.  The Twins were playing very young players on some very bad teams giving them tremendous opportunity to develop into regular MLB players.  This would be much like the 1980-1986 Twins.  Play a bunch of young guys and then see where the chips fall.  That group included Kent Hrbek, Greg Gagne & Kirby Puckett.  All 3 won 2 championships, and another (Frank Viola) was traded in 1988 that gave us major pieces (Rick Aguileria and Kevin Tapani) for the second championship in 1991.  Throw in Gary Gaetti, Tom Brunanski & Tim Laudner and you have a core of players that can compete at a high level.  Moving past those great Twins teams into the awful one's of the late 90's and you will see a sharp contrast into the overall talent that was produced.

 

Here are some of the young players that got AB's for the Minnesota Twins each year starting in 1995:

1995

 

Age

G

PA

AB

R

H

2B

3B

HR

RBI

SB

CS

BB

SO

BA

OBP

SLG

OPS

OPS+

C

Matt Walbeck#

25

115

422

393

40

101

18

1

1

44

3

1

25

71

0.257

0.302

0.316

0.617

61

1B

Scott Stahoviak*

25

94

296

263

28

70

19

0

3

23

5

1

30

61

0.266

0.341

0.373

0.714

86

2B

Chuck Knoblauch

26

136

629

538

107

179

34

8

11

63

46

18

78

95

0.333

0.424

0.487

0.911

136

SS

Pat Meares

26

116

425

390

57

105

19

4

12

49

10

4

15

68

0.269

0.311

0.431

0.742

90

LF

Marty Cordova

25

137

579

512

81

142

27

4

24

84

20

7

52

111

0.277

0.352

0.486

0.839

115

CF

Rich Becker*

23

106

438

392

45

93

15

1

2

33

8

9

34

95

0.237

0.303

0.296

0.599

57

DH

Pedro Munoz

26

104

400

376

45

113

17

0

18

58

0

3

19

86

0.301

0.338

0.489

0.827

112

UT

Matt Lawton*

23

21

70

60

11

19

4

1

1

12

1

1

7

11

0.317

0.414

0.467

0.881

129

1B

Dave McCarty

25

25

61

55

10

12

3

1

0

4

0

1

4

18

0.218

0.279

0.309

0.588

53

1996

 

Age

G

PA

AB

R

H

2B

3B

HR

RBI

SB

CS

BB

SO

BA

OBP

SLG

OPS

OPS+

3B

Todd Walker*

23

25

89

82

8

21

6

0

0

6

2

0

4

13

0.256

0.281

0.329

0.61

54

1997

 

Age

G

PA

AB

R

H

2B

3B

HR

RBI

SB

CS

BB

SO

BA

OBP

SLG

OPS

OPS+

UT

David Ortiz*

21

15

51

49

10

16

3

0

1

6

0

0

2

19

0.327

0.353

0.449

0.802

107

C

Javier Valentin#

21

4

7

7

1

2

0

0

0

0

0

0

0

3

0.286

0.286

0.286

0.571

50

1998

 

Age

G

PA

AB

R

H

2B

3B

HR

RBI

SB

CS

BB

SO

BA

OBP

SLG

OPS

OPS+

3B

Corey Koskie*

25

11

31

29

2

4

0

0

1

2

0

0

2

10

0.138

0.194

0.241

0.435

12

C

A.J. Pierzynski*

21

7

13

10

1

3

0

0

0

1

0

0

1

2

0.3

0.385

0.3

0.685

82

 

 

Age

G

PA

AB

R

H

2B

3B

HR

RBI

SB

CS

BB

SO

BA

OBP

SLG

OPS

OPS+

SS

Cristian Guzman#

21

131

456

420

47

95

12

3

1

26

9

7

22

90

0.226

0.267

0.276

0.543

38

LF

Chad Allen

24

137

523

481

69

133

21

3

10

46

14

7

37

89

0.277

0.33

0.395

0.725

82

1B

Doug Mientkiewicz*

25

118

379

327

34

75

21

3

2

32

1

1

43

51

0.229

0.324

0.33

0.655

66

CF

Jacque Jones*

24

95

347

322

54

93

24

2

9

44

3

4

17

63

0.289

0.329

0.46

0.789

97

1995

 

Age

W

L

W-L%

ERA

G

GS

GF

CG

SHO

SV

IP

H

R

ER

HR

BB

IBB

SO

SP

Brad Radke

22

11

14

0.44

5.32

29

28

0

2

1

0

181

195

112

107

32

47

0

75

SP

Frankie Rodriguez

22

5

6

0.455

5.38

16

16

0

0

0

0

90.1

93

64

54

8

47

0

45

RP

Pat Mahomes

24

4

10

0.286

6.37

47

7

16

0

0

3

94.2

100

74

67

22

47

1

67

RP

Eddie Guardado*

24

4

9

0.308

5.12

51

5

10

0

0

2

91.1

99

54

52

13

45

2

71

 

LaTroy Hawkins

22

2

3

0.4

8.67

6

6

0

1

0

0

27

39

29

26

3

12

0

9

1996

 

Age

W

L

W-L%

ERA

G

GS

GF

CG

SHO

SV

IP

H

R

ER

HR

BB

IBB

SO

CL

Dave Stevens

26

3

3

0.5

4.66

49

0

38

0

0

11

58

58

31

30

12

25

2

29

 

Travis Miller*

23

1

2

0.333

9.23

7

7

0

0

0

0

26.1

45

29

27

7

9

0

15

1997

 

Age

W

L

W-L%

ERA

G

GS

GF

CG

SHO

SV

IP

H

R

ER

HR

BB

IBB

SO

 

Dan Serafini*

23

2

1

0.667

3.42

6

4

1

1

0

0

26.1

27

11

10

1

11

0

15

1998

 

Age

W

L

W-L%

ERA

G

GS

GF

CG

SHO

SV

IP

H

R

ER

HR

BB

IBB

SO

SP

Eric Milton*

22

8

14

0.364

5.64

32

32

0

1

0

0

172.1

195

113

108

25

70

0

107

1999

 

Age

W

L

W-L%

ERA

G

GS

GF

CG

SHO

SV

IP

H

R

ER

HR

BB

IBB

SO

SP

Mike Lincoln

24

3

10

0.231

6.84

18

15

0

0

0

0

76.1

102

59

58

11

26

0

27

RP

Joe Mays

23

6

11

0.353

4.37

49

20

8

2

1

0

171

179

92

83

24

67

2

115

 

Mark Redman*

25

1

0

1

8.53

5

1

0

0

0

0

12.2

17

13

12

3

7

0

11

 

J.C. Romero*

23

0

0

 

3.72

5

0

3

0

0

0

9.2

13

4

4

0

0

0

4

 

The Importance of the Core

Looking back at the failures of the late 90's Twins there are only a few players that went on to solid MLB careers.  AJ Pierzynski and David Ortiz have been MLB starters for most of their career with other ball clubs while JC Romero, Christian Guzman & Eddie Guardado have had serviceable careers.  That is a far cry from the great players the Twins have developed more recently.  It isn't any wonder why the Twins struggled so mightily and were nearly contracted after the 2001 season.

Now, let's fast forward to 2011 and beyond.  Looking at the young players on this team over the last few years that may contribute in years to come include Joe Mauer (now 27 years old), Delmon Young (24), Denard Span (26), Justin Morneau (29) Francisco Liriano (27).  These players have been with the club for a while, have gotten great MLB experience and are locked up for a significant amount of time or are under team control for a while.  There is no guarantee that Michael Cuddyer or Jason Kubel will stick around beyond 2011 but they have been additional players that were brought up at a young age, produced and are still producing for the Twins.

 

It Takes Money

Financial improvements have been an obvious asset to the Twins since Target Field was built.  Look at the payroll from the 1998 Twins team (www.thebaseballcube.com)   Attendance:  1,057,667    Payroll:  $24,527,500  

Here is the 2010 attendance and payroll information (www.thebaseballcube.comAttendance:  3,223,640  Payroll:  $97,559,167

When you do some quick math you will see that with an average ticket price at the Metrodome in 1995 being $24.00 (times attendance) you get a payroll equivalent of just over $25M.  With an average ticket increase (up to $34.50) and a larger attendance number you get a payroll equivalent of just over $111M. 

 This illustrates a different issue than our topic though.  There is definitely two cogs to professional sports success.  One is the ability to keep their core players around like the Twins have the ability to do now.  The other is a group of young core players the Twins did not possess in the late 90's.  Two players that we could not keep here for financial reasons were Chuck Knoblauch (who we turned into Christian Guzman and Eric Milton) and Pat Mears (who got his one big MLB contract with the Pirates and disappeared).  Torii Hunter was not resigned for financial reasons but it was only because Anaheim overpaid so much for his services that we really had no choice but to let him go.  Johan Santana was offered $20M per year by the Twins but took a longer contract with the New York Mets along with a slightly higher per year salary.  David Ortiz was almost a project player when he was with the Twins.  He was a high strikeout guy who was having trouble staying healthy.  I don't think anyone was dumbfounded that we didn't keep him at the time.  Some Twins brass wanted to keep him but nobody foresaw what Ortiz was going to become.  And it wasn't until he entered an environment of Manny Ramirez, et al., that he blossomed into the homerun hitter that destroyed teams at the beginning of this decade.  A.J. was turned into Liriano and Joe Nathan and was being pushed out by Mauer anyways so his departure wasn't much to do with finance either.  All in all the Twins just weren't developing players in the late 90's and they were not going to break their financial and developmental model because of this either.

That brings us to the topic that is staring the Twins (and every other organization for that matter) in the face.  Who to invest in, how much to invest in them, who to let go, who to trade for, who fits in & who doesn't.

 

Looking at the Twins roster there are some question marks and some sure things.

C - Joe Mauer, would the Twins sign him to a mammoth contract only to turn him into Wade Boggs? Possibly, but the unusual move of trading a top catching prospect (Wilson Ramos) for a dispatched closer makes it look like either A) they think they can develop a catcher relatively quick or B) they think very highly of Jose Morales.  Most likely it is C) Mauer is the Twins catcher at present and foreseeable future.

162 Game Avg.

G

PA

AB

R

H

2B

3B

HR

RBI

SB

CS

BB

SO

BA

OBP

SLG

OPS

OPS+

TB

GDP

IBB

Wade Boggs

162

713

610

100

200

38

4

8

67

2

2

94

49

0.328

0.415

0.443

0.858

130

270

16

12

Joe Mauer

162

693

599

98

196

39

3

16

91

7

2

84

68

0.327

0.407

0.481

0.888

136

288

19

15

1B - Justin Morneau needs to stay healthy and the Twins have a great first baseman for through the 2013 season.

2B - Assuming the Twins can sign Tsuyoshi Nishioka the Twins will have their #2 hitter and second baseman for some time.

3B - Danny Valencia will get every opportunity to keep that position warm for a couple of years.  But is he the guy that will deserve a post team-control contract?  Time will tell.  He hit great last year and I hope that continues.  Right now I don't see the Twins investing in him unless he develops power.

SS - JJ Hardy, Alexi Casilla & Brendan Harris have all got relatively equal shots with the Twins over the last couple of years.  None of them are jump off the pages types of players.  Are any of them serviceable enough to pay big money for?  I will go ahead and answer that for you now... no.  JJ appears to be the best of the bunch but he doesn't show any dynamic qualities that warrant the type of money he will be asking for.

LF - Delmon Young got in shape last year and blossomed.  He should continue to progress.  If he can become a better outfielder he will demand huge money.  Otherwise, he is a DH playing left field.  That still should get him paid by the Twins.

CF - Denard Span is locked up for 3 more years.  Even though Twins fans didn't think he had a very good year in CF he was still among the best center fielders in overall range.  Spacious Target Field will make a lot of players look average and I think year two out there will be much better for him.  It doesn't help that he had 2 poor outfielders on either side of him for the better part of the season.

RF - Michael Cuddyer is exactly what people say he is and what his stats say he is.  Unfortunately for the Twins he is vastly overpaid at the moment & should start to decline very soon.  Billy Smith and more specifically Ron Gardenhire will try to keep Cuddy around but with the Twins great minor league outfielders & Cuddyer's contract demands there is little to no chance that he will be back after 2011.

DH - Jason Kubel is the DH for now but with the talent in the Twins Minor League system I wonder if this isn't his last year with them.  Moving Delmon to DH and 4th outfielder makes more sense for 2012 and beyond than it does to keep both of them.  Kubel is one of the best fastball hitters in baseball but sitting in the 7 hole in Minnesota doesn't lend him to too many fastball opportunities.  I don't see any scenarios where he hits in front of Morneau or Mauer to get those fastballs either.  Unless the Twins get a steal of a contract long-term for Kubel I don't see him sticking around.

SP - Here is the Twins motto; Get their young pitchers to throw strikes, minimize walks and let their defense do their work.  This philosophy also signals the end to the guys like Kubel & Delmon in the corner outfield spots.  Target Field is just too big for the likes of their defensive ability.  The primary idea behind this low walk philosophy is that pitchers like this are easy to replace and usually inexpensive to keep.  The pitchers that demand huge contracts in MLB are generally low ERA and high K guys.  One highly paid pitcher per Twins staff is the usual norm with a better than average bullpen to support young/ underpaid starters.  Baker, Duensing & Blackburn fit the bill perfectly.  Pavano was perfect too but unfortunately he will get a $36M+ deal this off-season which would keep him off the Twins future plans sheet.  That money will have to go to Liriano instead.  The system is ready to roll with more MLB #3's with the likes of Kyle Gibson, Anthony Swarzak, David Bromberg, et al.  Kevin Slowey and Glen Perkins do not fit the mold in Minnesota.  They are in constant disagreement with Joe Mauer and the Twins management about the style of pitching & the pitch selection.  Perkins may fit better as a long reliever.  Once arbitration comes calling both he and Slowey will have to find work elsewhere.  That isn't necessarily a bad thing for either of them.  A change of scenery may do them good.

RP - Joe Nathan is on his last run with the Twins.  The most effective closer in Twins history will give it one more shot this year.  It is very, very rare for a pitcher to come back from the type of surgery that he did and regain past form immediately.  Jesse Crain is not expected to be back, neither is Matt Guerrier.  That is good news for some Twins fans as both have drawn the ire of some fans over their tenure.  The truth is though that Guerrier is one of the most effective late inning pitchers in baseball the last 3+ years and Crain was one of the best in baseball last year.  The unknown of Nathan and that of Pat Neshek will have the Twins scrambling for the next batch of Twins relief help.  There steps in Rob Delaney, Anthony Slama and Alex Burnett.  Those 3 along with Jose Mijares will have to be huge for the Twins.  If Nathan & Neshek don't return to form there could be huge problems ahead.  The solution might have to come from outside the organization but I don't see the Twins spending money on a relief free agent including former Twin Grant Balfour.

 

The Slow Cycle

It is always a slow cycle up for Twins prospects.  The good news is though it is still a cycle up.  In some clubs it is a perpetual wait.  If you look at some of the teams out there like the White Sox, Yankees, Red Sox & Dodgers, the holes that need to be filled will be done so with free agents.  The Twins cycle players out, rarely in.  They look for bargains.  They look for the ones that have a chip on their shoulder to return to a reputation they once had.  They look for the snarled veteran that wants a chance to win and play for a well run organization.  What do they not look for?  They don't look for a player coming off a career year.  They don't look for the guy that is going to get "paid" this off-season.  They don't look for guys that come with baggage.  They don't look for guys that are looking for their last contract before riding off into the sunset.  Sorry Twins fans, that means no Adrian Beltre, no Cliff Lee & probably no Carl Pavano.  No Adam Dunn, no Carl Crawford & no Jason Werth. 

 

The Importance of Depth

The Major League Baseball season can be a very long one.  The depth chart on day one is rarely the same on day 81 or 162.  Those teams that get enough production out of their starters to avoid any player demotions or stay healthy enough to keep the depth chart as together as possible are the ones that will have the best shot at the best records.  That being said, having serviceable Minor Leaguers that can come up to the big club and fill in for those guys are a huge plus.  This is something the Twins have.  The outfield, as mentioned before, is full of high end talent.  But are they MLB ready?  Aaron Hicks, Ben Revere and Joe Benson are probably not ready.  The Twins saw Revere up last year but he looks like he needs at least another half season to improve defensively and with his plate patience.  Twins fans would love to see Benson and Hicks next year but I don't see that happening.    Look more towards Rene Tosoni and Chris Parmalee for the outfield quick stops.  In the infield look for a Brendan Harris sighting along with Luke Hughes, Trevor Plouffe, Matt Tolbert & Alexi Casilla to fill out the remaining utility spots.

 

Prediction Segment

Here is what I see for the Opening Day 2011 Twins Roster:

Starters:

C- Mauer

1B - Morneau

2B - Nishioka

3B - Valencia

SS - Hardy

LF - Young

CF - Span

RF - Cuddyer

DH - Kubel

 

Bench:

C- Butera

INF: Casilla

INF: Tolbert

OF: Not sure - Repko type?

 

Starting Rotation:

SP: Liriano

SP: Baker

SP: Duensing

SP: Blackburn

SP: Slowey

 

Bullpen:

CL: Nathan

SU: Mijares

SU: Neshek

Mid: Slama

Mid: Delaney

Mid: Burnett

Lefty: Perkins

 

 

Ready And Waiting

Major League rosters usually see about 35 players during any given season.  Of these, usually about half are pitchers.  Here are some additional players Twins fans could see during the 2011 season.  Get to know them if you don't know them already.

C Jose Morales

INF - Brendan Harris

INF - Trevor Plouffe

INF - Luke Hughes

Util - Steve Singleton

Util - Chris Parmalee

OF - Ben Revere

OF - Rene Tosoni

OF - Joe Benson

RP - Spencer Steedley

RP - Yorman Bazardo

RP - Steve Hirschfeld

RP - Jeff Manship

SP - Kyle Gibson

SP - David Bromberg

SP - Anthony Swarzak

 

What To Do, What To Do?

Trying to think fiscally responsibly and evaluate what is best from a talent perspective I see the Twins doing a few things with the current roster.  

Lock up before 2011 season:

Delmon Young, Tsuyoshi Nishioka, Francisco Liriano

Say goodbye to after 2011 season:

Jason Kubel, Michael Cuddyer, JJ Hardy

Essential development:

A closer - The Twins need someone to step up and assume that role like Joe Nathan did in 2004.

Bullpen - Of the young three (Slama, Delaney, Burnett) someone needs to step up and become that reliable 7th/8th inning guy they so desperately need.

Danny Valencia - Must develop power to become the Twins long-term solution at 3B.

Poll
Who has the best chance to be a Minnesota Twin after 2011?
Carl Pavano
3 votes
Michael Cuddyer
47 votes
J.J. Hardy
39 votes
Jason Kubel
22 votes

111 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 43 comments  |  2 recs  | 

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Wow!

I have to say that I agree with idea of who the Twins are and how they get there. In general I agree strongly with who you think is comming and going in the next few years. The only point I would like to make: I like Slowey, and still have faith. I think Capps will be the closer with Nathen to set-up. Also, I would add Manship to the relief role, not Delaney. I see the Twins bringing in another Lefty to compete with Perkins. I think you nailed it with Revere to LF and Delmond to DH in 2012. I’ll say Valencia need to drive in runs, rather its with power or basehits.

by b1 on Dec 1, 2010 3:47 PM EST reply actions  

Slowey & Capps

Slowey was “my guy” coming up. I still remember his first start against Oakland and loved the way he used his fastball. I thought at the time that his 2-seamer reminded me of Tim Hudson. I have lost faith in his ability and his attitude. I hope you are right though.

Capps would be nice to have back but I wonder if he won’t get non-tendered… He will get closer money in arbitration. Who knows, he would give the Twins a lot of protection from Nathan’s injury… you might be right on Capps.

I guess I have always considered Manship a starter but I can see him stepping in to a long relief role with the Twins. I actually had Perkins in that role and being LH gives him the advantage but I can also see a Twins bullpen with both guys in it.

2012 I see Revere in LF, Joe Benson in RF and Delmon as the 4th OF/DH

Good stuff. ~AL

by Al Damlo on Dec 1, 2010 4:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Love the take on "Slow Cycle",

particularly in regards to the types of free agents the Twins do and do not look for. Very accurate.

by Jesse on Dec 1, 2010 3:59 PM EST reply actions  

Slow Cycle

A lot of Twins fans hate the Slow Cycle. Many of them would want us to go out and spend instead of underpaying a marginal AAAA replacement. That just isn’t what the Twins have done … ever.

Thanks for the note. ~AL

by Al Damlo on Dec 1, 2010 4:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Honestly

There is really nothing like the slow cycle. What I believe happened is that the Twins managed to get lazy when it came to scouting. Remember that Kirby Puckett signed a huge contract to remain with the Twins after the 1992 season and the team was likely expecting him to be a veteran of some young teams in the mid to late 1990’s. Compounding that, the main core of those World Series teams started to come up in 1981 and was pretty much together by 1985. Meanwhile, the “slow cycle” Twins started at around 1990 to 1993. Like I said, the Twins were expecting Kirby to be a mentor in the way Al Newman was to Kirby, but that didn’t happen. In the end, the Twins had a dry cycle where the focus was on Cleveland and the Yankees. It was that way from 1994 to 2000 pretty much.

As for the Twins of today, we do have a pretty good core, but life is cycnical in MLB. The White Sux could win 110 games in 2011 while injuries dominate our season and we fail to win 70 games. Of course, I am saying that we could have major injuries like learning that Justin Morneau is forced to retire due to his concussion, then Joe Mauer breaks his arm trying to keep the clubhouse in check the only way he can, and to top it off, we lose three pitchers to Tommy John and J.J. Hardy to a broken wrist earned while trying to open a jar for Linda Cohn of ESPN fame. Following that, the Twins win the World Series in 2012 after a long season that includes stealing game 163 from Kansas City.

by Jessy S on Dec 4, 2010 4:52 AM EST up reply actions  

yikes...

Good stuff Jessy. Please god, don’t let the injuries in your second paragraph happen. I don’t think I could suffer through that summer after the Vikings did what they did this year. Too much fandom pain.

by Al Damlo on Dec 6, 2010 9:43 AM EST up reply actions  

Good Article

How much power are you expecting from Valencia? Are you looking for Morneau-like power or would you be satisfied with Mauer-like power? I think Valencia could be somewhere in the middle, like a 30-35 2B & 15-20 HR guy. Combine that with a solid batting average and average to above average defense, would that be enough?

by Caleb A on Dec 1, 2010 4:18 PM EST reply actions  

Valencia

I will answer that the way you asked the question first. I think it is reasonable to expect a 12 HR year in 2011. He hit one bomb late in the year against Toronto that still hasn’t come down so the power is there. He is generally such a line drive hitter that a 20+ HR outburst just doesn’t seem possible right now. He could develop into a 17-22 HR guy but I think you will see his BA & OPB suffer because of it. The optimal line for him at this point would be .280/.350/.450. Hitting a lot of HR’s would drive that line down to .255/.325/.465. For us OPS fans that is an obvious decline.
The other answer is to a question like “How much power will it take for Valencia to be the long-term answer at 3B for the Twins?”
I feel like the answer to that would be back to the optimal Valencia line from earlier. 280/.350/.450. Included in that line would be 30+ doubles and 15 HR’s. If that is the hitter he becomes the Twins will want him around for years. Throw in a solid glove and you may see him signing with the Yankees in 2016.
~AL

by Al Damlo on Dec 1, 2010 4:39 PM EST up reply actions  

Koskie

Totally agree. If he is the player Koskie was the Twins would be very, very happy. Koskie would have had a tremendous career if not for the head injury.

by Al Damlo on Dec 3, 2010 4:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Corey Koskie put up multiple MVP type seasons

just no one knew it at the time

"Pinch-bunters don't have a ton of value, even with the Twins"

by Steven Ellingson on Dec 3, 2010 5:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Maybe Twins MVP

He never really had MVP-type numbers. But I would be quite pleased if Valencia became a Koskie-like player.

by Caleb A on Dec 3, 2010 8:06 PM EST up reply actions  

2001

If he had been in another market, he would certainly have garnered votes. He was the only Twin in history to hit 25 homers, steal more than 25 bases, score more than 100 runs and drive in more than 100 runs.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 3, 2010 11:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Koskie

Seems like a great guy too. Not too many bad things can be said about Koskie on or off the field. Too bad about his injury.

by Al Damlo on Dec 6, 2010 9:45 AM EST up reply actions  

One nit

Velencia hit 7 homers in his last 100 at bats. He focused on getting on base in his first two months. Once he was comfortable, he swung away.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 1, 2010 5:19 PM EST reply actions  

I just hope he continues to focus on getting on base

His batting average will almost definitely go down some, so hopefully the walk rate stays where it is.

"Pinch-bunters don't have a ton of value, even with the Twins"

by Steven Ellingson on Dec 3, 2010 5:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Danny V & the power stroke.

CM – You could be right. That just isn’t what I see. I don’t disagree that he has the ability to hit 20+ HR’s but his swing doesn’t equate to that type of hitter. That is suppose to be a good thing. He hit a bunch of balls to the RCF gap last year and I feel like if he continues that approach he will become a very serviceable MLB third baseman. One thing to keep in mind is that in 524 plate appearances in 2010 between AAA and MLB he hit 7 HR’s. In over 2000 minor league plate appearances he hit only 54. In over 750 NCAA plate appearances he hit just 23 HR’s. Unless the juice gets loose in Danny V’s veins I don’t see that aspect of his game changing. I will stick with 12 for next year with the potential for 17.
~AL

by Al Damlo on Dec 1, 2010 5:39 PM EST reply actions  

His swing is a lot like Delmon's: he hits the ball where it's pitched

He’s just a more disciplined hitter than Delmon. Not coincidentally, two Twins hit balls into the upper deck in left last year; Valencia and Young.

I’m not saying he’ll hit more than 20. But he has good power. If you ever watched him in batting practice, you would know. He hit more balls farther than any Twin not named Thome.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 1, 2010 7:03 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't know if he'll ever hit mroe than 20 in a season either

but certainly 15 is feasible….

I called it - Joe Mauer's first career Home-Run at Target Field !!!

Why Oh Why did the D'Backs select A.J. Pollock over Mike Trout?

I hate Hunter Wendelstedt, you hate Hunter Wendelstedt we all hate hunter w

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Dec 1, 2010 10:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Boggs, Gwynn, Ichiro

Valencia is not any of these 3 so please pardon the comparison but all three of these guys could (and can) hit rockets. I was at a Mariners game at the Dome and Ichiro was hitting shot after shot into the Mezzanine and beyond… it was incredible. When Boggs & Gwynn were playing they had consistantly some of the top bat swings speeds in baseball. Their swing type was such that it produced line drives not fly balls. I hope you are right I hope he does hit 20+… and hit .300… and drive in 100. That would be amazing! Even coming close to those numbers would shock me. At this point though I don’t think he has that ability and hope he stays with the same approach.

by Al Damlo on Dec 3, 2010 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

He's never shown that ability

It would be highly unlikely to show up in the majors. Valencia won’t be Chipper Jones. He’s much more likely to be Joe Randa. He’ll be useful but not an All-Star.

by DJL44 on Dec 3, 2010 4:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Joe Randa

Not a bad comparison… I hope he is better than that though… he is the epitome of mediocrity at 3B. I do see a higher ceiling than Randa but not in the HR department… at least for now. I may change my mind when Valencia has 15 HR’s by the All-Star Break.

by Al Damlo on Dec 3, 2010 4:49 PM EST up reply actions  

That bullpen won't happen

“Bullpen:

CL: Nathan

SU: Mijares

SU: Neshek

Mid: Slama

Mid: Delaney

Mid: Burnett

Lefty: Perkins"

I’m absolutely positive this won’t be the opening day bullpen. That’s an awful pen.

by DJL44 on Dec 3, 2010 3:37 PM EST reply actions  

+1

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 3, 2010 4:10 PM EST up reply actions  

maybe...

You might think it is awful… but it will be our pen. If it is awful I can see the Twins going out and getting someone… maybe Heath Bell or Mike Adams from SD. The problem with that pen is there is so many unknowns. Will Nathan be close to what he was? Will Mijares be in shape? Will Neshek be back to what he was 2+ years ago? Are Slam and Delaney just minor league studs or can they become viable MLB options? You and I know those answers far less than the Twins front office does. If the Twins do make a move and get a reliever, then the answer is they are not confident in the group I outlined. If they don’t, then they are. Simple as that.

by Al Damlo on Dec 3, 2010 4:13 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm certain it won't be the bullpen

Partly because the bullpen will have Matt Capps and is more likely to have Jeff Manship than 5 of those guys. The Royals have a better bullpen than the one you projected. My guess is only one, maybe 2 of Delaney, Slama, Neshek, Burnett and Perkins make the opening day roster.

by DJL44 on Dec 3, 2010 4:24 PM EST up reply actions  

you may be right...

Maybe the Twins will offer Capps a contract. I have been hearing both sides of whether he will be non-tendered or not. He definately makes the bullpen better. I hope you are right on his contract status… and probably are, who knows.

CL: Nathan
SU: Capps
SU: Mijares
Mid: Slama
Mid: Neshek
Mid: Delaney
Long: Perkins or Manship or Burnett

Royals Bullpen 2011:
Cl: Soria
SU: Meche
Lefty: Hughes
Mid: Tejada
Mid: Wood
Mid: Holland
*
Even my Twins bullpen was better than this Royals one. Maybe I just think too highly of the futures of Delaney, Slama and Burnett. I think they are ready now and hope that Neshek gets his confidence back and becomes that back-end reliever he was projected to become.
*
You might be right though, the Twins relievers I listed might suck and are worse than the Royals.

by Al Damlo on Dec 3, 2010 4:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Capps was tendered yesterday

Bill Smith said they’re keeping him.

Delaney hasn’t done squat at AAA (too many walks, ERA at 4.5). I don’t know what would have earned him a shot at a major league bullpen. There will be dozens of relievers better than Delaney fighting for a shot at an MLB roster this spring. Slama didn’t exactly have a great debut last year. There’s a reason the Twins passed them over in favor of Burnett and Burnett wasn’t wonderful. I see Gutierrez ahead of those guys on the depth chart.

by DJL44 on Dec 3, 2010 5:38 PM EST up reply actions  

AAAA

You could be right. Sometimes it isn’t all about results in the minors though. The idea is to fine tune certain aspect of their skills before coming up. That leads to some misleading stats at times. What I have seen from Delaney is pretty solid stuff. Slama too. My thought is Burnett was brought up instead of those guys to ensure regular work and improvement for the other two. Burnett is a pretty straight forward pitcher. Not a lot of extra stuff there and provides steadiness that the others don’t have yet. The ceiling is much higher on both Delaney and Slama from what I have seen.

by Al Damlo on Dec 6, 2010 9:49 AM EST up reply actions  

I think Kevin Slowey is awesome !!!

its just too bad he’s been ravaged by injuries and other ‘small problem’s’ throughout his Twins career it seems like he’s never 100% healthy

He had the chance to be this team’s next Brad Radke and a strong #2 starter ceiling behind only Liriano but it just hasn’t worked out for him… i still like the guy a lot though

and I’m pretty sure he still has 2 screws in his throwing wrist.

I called it - Joe Mauer's first career Home-Run at Target Field !!!

Why Oh Why did the D'Backs select A.J. Pollock over Mike Trout?

I hate Hunter Wendelstedt, you hate Hunter Wendelstedt we all hate hunter w

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Dec 3, 2010 7:40 PM EST reply actions  

Are you related?

Kevin’s problems are with command of his off-speed stuff. He has pretty good command of the fastball, 8 out of 10 starts. Once in a while he’s too strong and overthrows. But his off-speed command is really spotty. I would never compare him to Radke or even Tapani because he has never shown any consistency with his off-speed command. Radke was a machine with his change up. Ditto Tapani. Slowey is very inconsistent with his change. And his breaking pitches are on-again-off-again.. Until he gains consistency, he will not be another Radke or Tapani.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 3, 2010 11:54 PM EST up reply actions  

I know stats arn't eveything

but for the last two year the guy has a 23-9 record and 191 k’s 44 walks. Yes he gives up Hr’s and Hits but the guy can pitch and I think he’d be a big loss if we didn’t have him.

by b1 on Dec 4, 2010 3:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't get me wrong, he's a good picher

But he is not another Brad Radke. I hope he becomes one. But he’s not there yet.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 4, 2010 6:47 PM EST up reply actions  

I thought the two are very simular so I got some stats

Radke in 12yrs with the Twins 148 W – 139 L, 4.22 era, 445 BB- 1467 K’s. The thing that got me was that evey year was about the same. Here are the 12yr Avg’s 12.3 Wins- 11.58 Losses, 27.16 Hr’s, 37.08 Walks – 122.25 K’s. Now for Slowey’s 4 yr Avg. 9.75 Wins-5.25 Losses, 18.5 Hr’s, 19.75 Walks-90.25 K’s. If Slowey were to keep this up I do think his numbers would be very close to Radke’s. Take what you want from this, you could make arguments for Slowey being Better or Worse, I just thought I’d put the numbers out there.

by b1 on Dec 5, 2010 8:14 AM EST up reply actions  

Radke was on a lot of bad teams

It’s easier to put up good numbers when you don’t have Rich Becker in center, Matt Wallbeck behind the plate and Pat Mears at short, particularly if you are not a strikeout pitcher.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 5, 2010 1:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Touche

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 5, 2010 6:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Stats schmats

Sometimes when comparing two players we need to step back from the numbers and go with your gut. I don’t know what those numbers were saying but Radke was a gamer. Every start he gave some very bad Twins teams a chance to win. I know people don’t get contract extentions for being a “gamer” but maybe they should. If that was the case Slowey would not get one at this point of his career. Like I said before Slowey and Garza were my guys when they first came up. Since then I have seen little improvement from Slowey and he always seems to have the demeanor that he is just a little smarter and better than the rest of us. Confidence is great, arrogance is not and I think it is holding him back. Maybe the original post was right, maybe he has just been hurt. I hope that is the case and he comes out and has a great ’11 season. The Twins staff desperately needs someone to come in and become that legit #2 behind Franchise.

by Al Damlo on Dec 6, 2010 9:57 AM EST up reply actions  

All in all I take from this that some under

value Slowey. I might be over valuing him. Pav’s was 17-11 with 37 walks and 117 k’s Slowey was 13-6 with 29 walks and 116 k’s. Why should we say one guy had a killer year and the other guy is lucky to make the starting rotation? I don’t see it the say way as some of you. I always thought Slowey should be second in the rotation and always gave the Team a good chance to win. Maybe he’s got a horseshoe in his pocket. Baker is the guy I’d like to see step-up.

by b1 on Dec 6, 2010 7:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Look at all the numbers

Slowey got rocked a lot, especially on the road, which is why his xFIP was 4.48 thopugh his FIP was 3.98. Pavs was pretty consistent—his FIP was 4.01 and his xFIP was 4.02. Slowey benefited from Target Field a lot because he gives up a lot of fly balls. But get him in Toronto or New York, and those warning track fly balls are 10 rows deep.

The other measure of consistency is innings. Slowey only pitched 155 innings in 2010. Pavano pitched 221 innings. Why? Because Pavano kept his team in the game for six or seven innings every night. Slowey’s inconsistency led to a lot of short starts. Think of it this way: Having Slowey on the roster forced us to carry an extra reliever to cover those extra 70 innings.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Dec 6, 2010 11:00 PM EST up reply actions  

His lack of innings was due to injuries

as for being rocked, seems like he’d of had more then 6 losses. I’ll leave it here. I think he’s on the edge of being good or bad. But so far I’d day the guys been a good #4 starter.

by b1 on Dec 6, 2010 11:16 PM EST up reply actions  

yea pavano 2010 was almost pavano 2004

gave up a few more long balls, but that’s about it. i really think the twins should bring him back, if only to eat innings so games aren’t left in the bullpen’s hands.

and you can put it on the boaaaaaard YES, HELL YES

by yefrem on Dec 7, 2010 10:57 AM EST up reply actions  

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