LEN3: Twins intended to trade Hardy all along
Everyone's favorite Bears fan passes along this tidbit among others in his latest blog.
Anyone think this was anything but Gardy's doghouse having only one exit? Because I've just come into possession of some fine riverfront real estate...
over 1 year ago
ravenfly
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What I've been saying all along!
This trade was all Gardenhire’s doing.
"FTYITAWAB" -less cowbell, more 'neau
fairly obvious
well it we needed speed. Hardy didn’t have it. So he was going to be traded. It was just a matter of what we got in return.
Brian
Which is sad because they originally said..
That they wouldn’t have traded Gomez for him if he was just going to be here for one year. Gomez was under contract for awhile.
I’m not sad Gomez is gone, minus the OF defense he brought, but it sucks that their thought process changed. I liked Hardy and was hoping he’d be here for another three years.
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
Knowing what we do now, I would rather have kept Gomez.
I would rather have the speed in the outfield.
I definitely agree
I reserve the right to change my mind if these relievers turn into something great though lol
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
I'd rather have Hardy...
and a manager with an IQ above 40.
That's manager of the year
with an IQ above 40 haha
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
Gomez>>>Repko
But I have some hope for Hoey. And we did get a good year out of Hardy.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Agreed on Gomez being better than Repko
I’m trying to figure out if that would have worked at the beginning of the season. Gomez as Repko, I mean. Repko wasn’t called up until the end of June. Did we have a place on the bench for Gomez or would Thome (or someone else) have to be subtracted? I can’t remember what our bench was at the beginning of the season…
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
Then bench would have been Gomez, Butera and Tolbert
plus one more utility infielder. If they still wanted Thome they would have had to either trade Kubel or go with only one backup infielder. Neither scenario seems likely.
They could have made it work
Gardy just didn’t want Gomez sitting on his bench. But they needed Repko earlier than they brought him up. Hence we had an outfield of Delmon/Cuddy/Kubel at one point. That was the worst defensive outfield wearing Twins unis since Sofield/Hatcher/Engel, though Cordova/Becker/Munoz would give that one a run for its money.
A bench of Punto, Butera, Gomez and Thome would have been fine. That assumes starting the year with Velencia at third and Kubel as the DH.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
And it wouldn't have worked at short
Unless you hand the shortstop position to Casilla. No!!! That’s crazy talk!!!
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
But they didn't call up Repko until Cuddy moved to first
because they needed (wanted) two extra infielders. I remember the Delmon/Cuddy/Kubel outfield. I was shaking my head because Gardy had chosen to give Span a day off when Baker (or was it Slowey) was the starter.
You forgot about Harris. (Not that I blame you.) I had Harris at third and Punto at short.
And we got a good year out of Thome
If the Twins had kept Gomez they would not have had room for Jimmers.
There's always room for Jimmers.
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
"Gardy MOY. Feel great disturbance in Force. As if millions of Internet cranks cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced." -BatGirl
by less cowbell, more 'neau on Dec 15, 2010 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
Interesting...
I wonder who their free agent or trade targets were – I am guessing they weren’t planning on standing pat with a Plouffe-Casilla middle infield.
I’d note that the article doesn’t say explicitly pin this on Gardy, other than that he made the “we need more speed” comments. Am I alone in not remembering Hardy being in his doghouse last year? I mean, yeah, he was hurt a bunch, but Gardy complained more about Hudson’s nagging injuries than Hardy’s.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
Infield was one of the strengths of last year's team
Hardy and Hudson won Gardy a shiny award and he thinks they were the problem?
by DJL44 on Dec 15, 2010 12:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm with you, I don't remember Hardy being in the doghouse
I remember Gardy saying things about Hudson, but not Hardy. We might have just missed it..
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
Gawd, gimme a break
JJ is on the field for 100 games and you guys think he is the reason G-Tool won MOY. Laughable. I went to a game near the end of July and I looked at the scoreboard while JJ was at the dish. He had 16 RBI. Say what you want, but he was far from a savior. And obviously, something he did here did not work out with the manager. Gardy runs a good club, a positive team, and if he wanted JJ gone, I would bet there was a reason — womanizing, drinking, shirking his injury rehab. The Brewers didn’t want him either so time to get off the cross on JJ, we need the wood.
Hudson and Hardy...
were both damn valuable players on this team last year. They were NOT the problem.
MI was definitely one of the strengths of this team. Yet Gardy saw a “problem” with it. That’s a huge red-flag to me about his competency.
Yes, that's the point
Defensively, ti was the best DP combination in baseball. That will win you more games than a number 9 hitter with 50 RBI.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Hardy and Hudson were a huge part of the difference between 2009 and 2010
Yeah, we can go back to playing Gardy-in-his-prime clones at the keystone and still eek out some division titles as the rest of the team picks up their slack, but it certainly doesn’t make us a better team.
And I love how being in Gardy’s doghouse suddenly makes someone immediately suspect of various moral failings! Christ, Gardy gave a reason: they weren’t fast. It’s a bad reason, but I’m not sure why we need to start blaming players with invented charges when the organization makes inexplicable decisions.
And look,
no one’s saying they were all-stars. They were just pretty good regulars, which is something that this team has been allergic to at SS and 2nd for years.
I Agree
It was nice for once to have a SS/2B who could play good D and hit the ball. Gah, I cant even remember the last time we had that. I’m all for we need to get more speed but I wanted it the in outfield.
yep
speed in the OF makes the D better and makes the team better on the bases. speed in the infield really only makes the team better on the bases…especially when you go from Hudson/Hardy who were very good defensively.
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
Couldn't have said it better.
First time, in a long time, that I saw an up the middle that I was 100% satisfied with (Mauer/Hudson/Hardy/Span). All can hit and play average to above average D.
Hudson was a head case
What did he hit .268? After the half inning, Hudson stays on the field talking to the other team or the umpire, I mean for the whole between inning. I felt bad for the Twins players having to put up with his constant talking. It made you wonder who’s side he was really on?
Hardy and Hudson were solid pros but at that cost, and given their limitations, the Twins made the right choice to move on. Will they win the World Series in 2011? Probably not, but they might get a couple of new pieces that will lead to it down the road. And they sure didn’t win the World Series with Hudson and JJ this year…
by Old Twins Cap on Dec 15, 2010 5:16 PM EST up reply actions
but that's the thing...
you have to pay for 2 important positions like that. It’s not like Hardy or Hudson were overpaid. If anything they were underpaid.
Solid MI’s like that don’t just grow on trees. But Gardy treats them like they do. And/or they’re not good.
The guy is incompetent.
That's the irony
Nobody cares more about SS and 2B than Gardy. But he seems incapable of managing teams that have a decent pair. Between Rivas, Rodriguez, Punto, Castro, Harris, Tolbert and the very young Casilla (did I miss anybody?), this team has had some of the worst players at those positions in the league. And zero stability. The two years they were good (Bartlett/Castillo, Hardy/Hudson), the team was great, but we dumped the pair afterward, just to recycle already rejected options. And the guy urging us to dump them? Gardy. He is such a picky little prick, he is not satisfied with good enough. So it’s trial and error year after year. This has to end.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Dec 15, 2010 3:25 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
i know i can't derail your crusade
But really, man. Look around the league. In the grand scheme of MLB, whatever you think of Gardenhire, we could do much worse than him.
Oh I agree
But how many teams deal with this level of turnover at two of the most important positions? I’s something of a miracle we still win.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
and i in turn agree with you sir
But much of that blame has to go on the scouting and MiLB systems, since we haven’t developed a decent MI outside of Bartlett (who was admittedly run out of town by Gardy) in years and years.
Yeah, and he was acquired from the Padres for Buck
The last decent middle infielder we’ve developed from within was Chuck Knoblauch. And it’s not like we haven’t tried. Todd Walker, Rivas, um. OK we haven’t really tried.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I almost mentioned Guzman
But he was a trade acquisition, too. Also, he was only good for a couple years before getting hurt and losing all hitting ability.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
Yup
It was supposed to be Guzy and Rivas for a decade. But as soon as the gravy train rolled up, they hopped on.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Are we talking about the same JJ?
First, I like JJ just fine. He has a rock-steady glove, a good arm and some pop. It was clear that when Gardy said that the Twins were going to get faster that probably meant JJ was gone. He was very, very slow on the bases last year. Now that may be because of some foot injury or whatever but nonetheless he was slow.
Regardless, the Twins knew there would be interest from JJ, so they simply tendered him to get some compensation for him via trade. Hell, they also got to dump half of Brendan Harris’ contract at the same time. I thought it was a very shrewed move. To have a guy who is not in your plans get you two prospects and dump over $500k… pretty solid move by GM Smith.
Now, is Casilla going to make people forget JJ? Probably not.
1 of 2 things will happen:
5% chance that Casilla will lock down the #9 spot in the line-up, play 155+ games, bat .285+, steal 30+ bases and play solid defense.
95% chance that Casilla will sprain his wrist, pull a rib cage muscle, tear a quad, get mononucleosis, severly bruise his knee, any or all of the above OR play so putridly that he will be replaced by Matt Tolbert, who will be replaced by Trevor Plouffe, who will be replaced by Josh Parmalee, the will move Nishi over to SS and start Luke Hughes there and may even see some panic starts by Michael Cuddyer from time to time.
but that's the thing...
no one has a problem with them moving Hardy if he’s not in their plans.
What people have a problem with is: that he’s not in their plans!
It’s not smart. At all. And it’s not like they saved a lot of money when you consider Yoshi. I’d much rather have Hardy and Casilla than Casilla and Yoshi. And that pair, for 2011, would have cost less.
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