Minnesota Twins Winter Meetings Open Thread, Day 2
by Jesse on Dec 7, 2010 7:42 AM EST
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Print7:30 pm - Another very quiet day. The crickets are chirping...
- Scott Miller from CBS Sports says that Matt Guerrier is NOT looking for a Joaquin Benoit-like 3 yr / $16.5M contract. MLB Trade Rumors cites last year's $15M contract for Brandon Lyon as an example of the market coming down quickly on relievers.
- David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution says that the Brewers are shopping Carlos Gomez and are reluctant to part with Lorenzo Cain. That was quick. Been there, done that with Gomez.
- Joe Pawlikowski from Fan Graphs notes that Koji Uehara is close to returning to the Baltimore Orioles.
12:00 pm - Still quiet, a couple notes about potential Twins targets going elsewhere
- LEN III guesses that any Twins interest in Rich Harden would be as a reliever. I agree, though he'd probably be an expensive option.
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MLB Trade Rumors reports that Josh Willingham may be expendable now that the Nationals have signed Werth, but that the asking price is very high. The Twins are not said to be involved, but if the asking price comes down he may make a decent platoon mate with Jason Kubel.
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Dan Connolly of the Baltimore Sun thinks the Rays are on the verge of trading Jason Bartlett to the Orioles in exchange for outfielder Nolan Reimold. This is interesting on a number of levels, not only because it would take another potential Hardy suitor off the table, not to mention Bartlett, but also because I like Reimold as a solid right handed outfield bat with around average range. Coming off an injury, he could be a decent buy low candidate. I wouldn't give up Hardy unless there was another very good piece.
9:10 am - Not much to report yet, mostly reaction from previous signings and rumors
- LEN III gets the sense that the Twins want to get the Nishioka done "soon" so they can get onto other things (presumably pitching, trading J.J. Hardy). He also notes that the Joaquin Benoit contract (3 yrs, $16.5M) has really shaken up the bullpen market, and may have outpriced the Twins.
- MLB Trade Rumors reports that the Rockies have signed Ty Wigginton to a 2 year, $7.5M contract. Dave Cameron at Fan Graphs is not impressed with this, or with the Jose Lopez trade, and believes the market appears to be "bananas" at this point.
- Ben Goessling at MASN Sports believes the Nationals are very much in the market for starting pitching, even after signing Jayson Werth to a $126M contract. The Nationals have been noted as a possible destination for Carl Pavano.
- Jon Morosi of Fox Sports says the Twins have "checked in" on Rich Harden, and asks whether he is a starter or a reliever at this point.
Day one, and especially day four, can be kind of slow. Let's see if things pick up today. Now, let's start the day right with a heaping bowl of Twins breakfast news...
6:45 am -
- According to this, the Twins have discussed one, two and three-year deals with Tsuyoshi Nishioka's agent, Rick Thurman. The latest offer is reported to be three years at a total of $9 to $10 million (not including the posting fee, naturally).
- Jon Heyman has just reported that Nishioka is looking for three years at $12 million.
- I don't know who's really instigating all this J.J. Hardy trade talk. It might be Gardenhire, but even Smith is dropping too many hints. He says Gardy will be allowed to determine which position Nishioka will play. Okay, we get it: Hardy is available. Going beyond that, can we please stop saying how flexible Alexi Casilla is and how flexible Nishioka could be? If the front office is trying to get everyone to notice the blatantly obvious writing in between the lines, they've done a brilliant job of it. To me this looks like a trainwreck waiting to happen. And I'm usually pretty optimistic and can see the front office's view on almost anything. But all this anti-Hardy bias is really quite startling. You have one of the best shortstops in baseball, why are you working so hard to make it look like you don't care whether he stays or goes?
- On that same link from LEN III, he notes that if Carl Pavano can't find a three-year job that he likes, it might be possible for him to come back to the Twins on a two-year deal. Pure speculation, though. Neal also was doing some checking on rumors that the Twins were interested in Sean White. If we are, we might as well be interested in any other reliever who can't strike anyone one.
- Almost every team in baseball has expressed interest in Jesse Crain and Matt Guerrier.
- Parker thinks that Koji Uehara makes a lot of sense for the Twins. I agree, to an extent. Uehara was the only new name to crop up in the Twins rumor mill yesterday.
- Ken Rosenthal says that Ty Wigginton is close to signing with the Rockies as a bench bat. He's the kind of guy that would have been useful off the bench for the Twins, but if that's what the front office determines they really need, then those kind of players always available at the trade deadline.
That's all for now. Check back regularly, as Adam will be periodically updating this thread throughout the day.
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Hardy
You have one of the best shortstops in baseball, why are you working so hard to make it look like you don’t care whether he stays or goes?
THANK YOU! I simply do NOT understand this. If we’re gonna keep him, why are you (making some assumptions about human nature here) pissing him off by telling everyone you don’t want him? And if you’re going to get rid of him, you had BETTER know something the rest of the statistically-minded baseball people don’t!
+1
Trading Hardy is trading from a position of weakness. And what is sad is that there are so many good free agents for the pen in this market that we could essentially fix the pen cheaply. Trading Hardy makes no sense unless we are blown away by it, and unless San Francisco comes by offering Jonathan Sanchez or something like that, I see no reason why we would want to do this.
by diehardtwinsfan on Dec 7, 2010 8:24 AM EST up reply actions
+1 as well...
you’re basically telling the world: “ya, him and alexi casilla are equals in our minds.”
+1000000
And I don’t think anyone can look at Casilla’s WAR and fielding percentages as a shortstop and say they are.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 7, 2010 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
Like that his wrist is completely ruined
But then that would be foisting damaged goods on an opposing GM – something that is frowned upon.
Not true
JJ is pretty healthy when it comes to his injury history and all that. The free agent market for Shortstops is not good and the Twins know that so why not dangle JJ Hardy to the wolves.
I keep waiting...
…to hear something, ANYTHING bad about him.
If they do trade him, they’re gonna have two opportunities to explain why. After he’s gone if they know something terrible about him, or at Alexi Casilla’s “breakout player of the year” party… If we move him and one of those two things doesn’t happen, it’s an epic screw up.
Does the front office has access to baseball-reference.com? If they do, they should know that Alexi Casilla isn’t good. At anything.
I think that all this trade talk has to be because of what his arbitration salary could end up being.
Blocked
The Twins FO blocks such sites from personel…even on their home computer.
by PinkiePinkerton on Dec 7, 2010 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, the dismissal of Hardy makes no sense to me either
I mean, are you really looking forward to a Nishioka-Casilla middle infield? How is that championship caliber? Casilla, who can be, charitably, described as inconsistent, and a guy who will probably need adjustment time at the very least?
I thought we were past those days.
I say SHONDA you say WOLVES" SHONDA! WOLVES!
I wonder if they've decided they'd rather use Hardy's money on Pavano.
Just speculation. I think it’s a terrible decision if they do. As mentioned by others, Casilla’s not a starting major leaguer unless he takes a huge leap forward, while Pavano would be replacing a pretty decent starting pitcher in the rotation.
But it sounds to me that Hardy’s almost surely gone. All this “we need to fix the infield” talk would be an odd way to treat him if he was coming back.
I'm starting to think you are right.
Get a bull-pen arm for hardy/save ~6-7 mil and resign Pavano to “sure up” our starting rotation. I think it is a horrid idea. I loved Pavano last year and he is a AL Central killer, but he is 35 and is asking for 33+ million over 3 years. I cant see that being worth it in the long run at all. Also, the market is FULL of good RPing.
i cant see the Twins giving him a three year deal at most i think they would give him would be a two year deal
Danoo
I can't see any 10mil a year deal
for Pavano being worth it. Period. This is why wins are an overvalued stat. Everything else says he was lucky to have an ERA south of 4.5 last year.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 7, 2010 3:40 PM EST up reply actions
Supply and demand
Lots of teams, including us, need a good starting pitcher. Once Lee is off the market that leaves only Pavano for not sign and pray pitchers.
Actually the advanced stats had him around 4.00 both of the last two years.
Which would mean he was only slightly lucky in 2010 and pretty darn unlucky in 2009.
I’ve been really violently anti-Pavano resigning, but with the size of some of these contracts being handed out… At least for next year, Pavano for around 10 a year is probably a pretty nice deal if a win is worth upwards of $5 million. Yeah, you hate mutli-year deals with old pitchers, but I’m finding myself almost seeing the logic…
I'd be ok for a 2 year deal
That and it might allow us to trade a starter for bullpen help or possibly just transition one of our starters to the bullpen. Not sure who’s stuff would play best in the bullpen though. Obviously Duensing can do it well but he deserves to be a starter. If he falters then move him back there. Blackburn finished strong and had solid years in 2008-09, some team may like him enough to give up a young cheap bullpen option.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
SO much skittishness
I don’t recall seeing the fanbase so obnoxiously skittish about something as the Hardy situation. This could all be POSTURING on SMith’s part, anybody think of that? If Hardy has 6 teams vying for him, SMith may smell a chance to real in some really juicy offers. SO he can walk around and say “oh yeah, well, we’ve got all this versatility, we’ve got all these guys who can play short… of course, we could also just do this instead, and use this HArdy guy, or whatever, I don’t care… maybe a big trade offer might convince me one way or the other, or whatever…”
ANybody think he might be baiting trade partners? If 6 teams are interested, and he seems like he can definitely be talked out of Hardy, then suddenly maybe Hardy becomes a CRUCIAL part of 2 or 3 teams offseason plans, and they are FORCED to bid HEAVILY for him. If they get a really good deal, OF COURSE they should trade him.
ALl this goes away if they trade him for some lukewarm bullpen package, but all this other anxiety is mostly unwarranted, as you never really can be sure what sort of plan these guys are hatching.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane
This is part of the problem.
There’s posturing, and then there’s being obnoxious. Right now, the FO is being pretty obnoxious about Hardy and their ambivalence towards him being a part of the club.
Oh, and you want to know what’s a really bad strategy for posturing: letting everyone know that you don’t really care if he’s around or not. If you want to posture, you have to pretend you want to keep him.
Which is very unusual tho.
The Twins do deals behind the curtain. They don’t go out and make comments about moving players. I wish I could be the fly on the wall in Bill Smith’s office/room for winter meetings to really know what is going on about Hardy
by twinscrazy_german on Dec 7, 2010 12:10 PM EST up reply actions
Oh come on. He's Bill Smith, not Emperor Paltpatine.
You really think he’s capable of that kind of double-fake bank shot? Misdirecting all the other GMs while he picks their pockets!
You’re giving the FO waaaaaaaay too much credit. They’re acting like they want to trade Hardy because they want to trade Hardy.
It's not just that.
In part I think Adam has a point, but I also think he’s over-reacting to how a lot of the fanbase is reacting. And it’s not the Strib commenter fanbase necessarily, it’s the even-keel and intelligent fanbase: something stinks. We’re not sure what it is, but it doesn’t take a genius to read between the lines.
And like I said—if this really was the FO posturing, they’re doing a terrible job of it. You don’t get max return on a guy by letting everyone know he’s not really in your plans.
What smell is
we’ve had Punto,Harris,Casilia, Plouffe and Tolbert. We want Hardy! I can see trying to get him down to 3mil, but lets face it All the other team know we have not other SS to replace him with, till we sign the Janpaneese guy. Till then we have no leverage.
by b1 on Dec 7, 2010 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
Uh oh
If he’s not Emperor Palpatine, what if he’s Anakin? Does that mean that some other GM is telling him that he has to trade JJ Hardy in order to save his wife from certain death?
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
This is even more evidence that trading Hardy's a high priority:
7:38am: La Velle E. Neal III of the Minneapolis Star-Tribune gets the sense that the Twins would like to get something done sooner rather than later, despite the fact that they have until Dec. 26 to sign Nishioka. Neal says the Twins are pushing for an agreement to happen during the Winter Meetings, and the sides exchanged multiple proposals yesterday.
Posted on mlbtraderumors.com. Smells to me like they want to ice the Nishioka thing so they can move on Hardy.
Apparently we (along with the Mets and Nats) are now interested in Freddy Garcia.
俳句！
by fischean on Dec 7, 2010 9:34 AM EST via mobile reply actions
And seriously, Bill Smith...
Unless you are absolutely blown away with some great deal for Hardy, you are going to have a lot of pissed off Twins fans if he’s not in Minnesota next year. Not cool with all the “Casilla’s able to fill in” talk.
俳句！
by fischean on Dec 7, 2010 9:36 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'm sure that's a concern, since he had a ton of days off last year.
But even with those days off, I have to think he was more productive than Casilla would have been playing every day.
俳句！
If they want to bring back Thome (or a similar type of player)
they probably want to avoid needing to carry two backup infielders.
If he trades Hardy, I think I may bitch slap him at TwinsFest.
by Brady Eyestone on Dec 7, 2010 1:20 PM EST up reply actions
Yes
My roomie and I just had this conversation. Maybe it can be a line, like the photo line, only slappier.
That's um...awesome.
Perhaps create an express “Twinkie Town Only” line so you can get your slappin’ done quickly and still get in line for a Joe Mauer autograph.
俳句！
I like this idea
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
Casilla filling in
Means lots of utility innings from Matt Tolbert. We’d like to avoid that if at all possible.
If Hardy leaves
then does Casilla or Yoshi play short?
"Brian Cardinal left Purdue being the only Boilermaker to receive both the "Mr. Hustle" Award and the "Courage" Award four years in a row"
Yoshi
Casilla’s numbers at short are consistently abysmal, and he’s not going to improve as a fielder at this point.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 7, 2010 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
Actually...
At least according to UZR, Casilla’s been excellent at short – his UZR/150 is a ridiculous 25.7. However, that’s based on a whopping 233 innings at the position, not even 30 games’ worth, and he’s got a career -7.9 rate at second base, which is generally considered the more difficult position. It’s possible that he could just be better at short (Nick Punto, in what is probably a big enough sample size to consider, has a much better UZR/150 at short than at second), but I’m not sure how much stock I’d put in that.
Anyway, I agree with you on the infield alignment if they jettison Hardy – Nishioka was a Gold Glove shortstop in Japan last year, and I think the Twins still think of Casilla as primarily a second baseman.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
But worrying about Yoshi's development as a hitter
wouldn’t it be nice to take his mind off playing SS?
"Brian Cardinal left Purdue being the only Boilermaker to receive both the "Mr. Hustle" Award and the "Courage" Award four years in a row"
I doubt that’s terribly relevant. More likely, Gardy wouldn’t want him to play short because of the language barrier. He sees his short stop as the captain of the infield and needs him to take charge.
Well exactly,
he probably has a lot on his plate, and running the infield is a little much when the most important thing for him is to get used to big league pitching. However, now thinking of Casilla as captain of anything and ‘taking charge,’ makes me feel queasy.
"Brian Cardinal left Purdue being the only Boilermaker to receive both the "Mr. Hustle" Award and the "Courage" Award four years in a row"
His WAR is a run lower at short than 2b. His fielding percentage 20% lower
So I’m befuddled how UZR comes out higher.
And I’ve always seen it that short is ‘the’ hardest infield position to fill.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 7, 2010 8:22 PM EST up reply actions
I'm guessing he has fewer innings at short.
and UZR doesn’t care about fielding %.
yes well, doesn't matter what his range is if he boots it in the end.
UZR is a semi-useful but flawed stat, IMHO. When it disagrees with WAR and fielding %, I’d say it misses.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 7, 2010 10:59 PM EST up reply actions
UZR takes into account errors
It’s all about outs on balls in your zone and out of your zone. An error counts the same as a ball that got under your glove and wasn’t scored an error.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
and this goes against what I said how?
If his UZR is out of whack with every other element of his metric at the position, it’s realistic to believe it’s a flaw in the metric.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 8, 2010 1:52 AM EST up reply actions
How about he plays better at short?
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
That's a lot more reasonable than that a tried-and-true metric is broken
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Alternate explanation
I think the best explanation for Casilla’s high UZR at short is “He’s only got a month’s worth of innings there, which is probably not even 10% of what one would consider a reasonable sample size for that metric.” Even full-year samples of UZR are worth being suspicious of – I believe I’ve heard that you need closer to three years’ worth of data to really trust it.
For what it’s worth, I think “tried-and-true” is a bit of an overstatement about UZR – I generally trust it, but I don’t think it’s anything close to perfect.
Shawn – where did you get the fielding WAR numbers?
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
OK
I agree that UZR is far from perfect. As I’ve said many times, until they can measure the speed and trajectory of balls in play, there will be no perfect metric. Some guys get lucky bounces and a lot of lazy fly balls come their way. Some guys are haunted by hard hit balls in their zones all the time. That’s why UZR numbers can fluctuate so much. But if a guy is consistently above or below average year over year, UZR can tell you that. In that, it’s the best metric we have, however flawed.
My issue was with the characterization that one anomalous UZR reading means the stat itself is broken. If there are common anomalies, or patterns that belie the true value of players of a certain ilk, then perhaps the stat is broken. That’s my sense with RF. The fact that UZR matches our scouting reports most of the time precludes an easy call that it’s broken.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Makes sense
My skepticism about UZR in my post was probably as overdone as I thought your optimism was – the truth is that it’s probably a good stat with some limitations, and I don’t think either of us really disputes that.
I think the biggest problem with the use of UZR is not so much that it’s unreliable, but that we might put too much trust in it, especially with insufficient sample sizes.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
are they trying to save money on Hardy so they can sign cliff lee?
by eau claire twins fan on Dec 7, 2010 9:58 AM EST reply actions
i pray that it they don't trade him
to clear payroll for Orlando Cabrera. We all know how much Gardy loves O-cab and his sparkling .303 OBP in the 2-hole
so, i go to school in Wisconsin and most of the Brewers fan’s here call Hardy ‘J.J. Herpes’ because of apparent rumors about him.
maybe somebody in the FO has it out to get him because of that.
by eau claire twins fan on Dec 7, 2010 10:00 AM EST reply actions
haha I've heard stories about that too
"Brian Cardinal left Purdue being the only Boilermaker to receive both the "Mr. Hustle" Award and the "Courage" Award four years in a row"
well, we all know Gardy has daughters...
with shall we say “character flaws”
Didn’t Bartlett get run out of town for doing one? For some reason I heard that rumor about another X-Twin too…
by diehardtwinsfan on Dec 7, 2010 11:21 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, and he left her in a grocery cart on the front stoop
That was just a vicious rumor. Bartlett never dated one of Gardy’s daughters.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I have to admit, it would explain a lot about Gardy's emnity towards Bartlett
But there is absolutely no evidence for or against it.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Bartlett wasn't "run out of town"
He wasn’t Gardy’s favorite. That’s for sure. But the Twins were not actively shopping him either. Tampa asked for him as part of the Garza/Young trade and the Twins agreed.
Obviously they undervalued Bartlett and they may undervalue Hardy for similar reasons. Gardy has certain ideas about what kind of player a shortstop should be. Also, the Twins (Gardy) aren’t the biggest consumers of advanced defensive statistics.
Rockies get Wiggy
MLB Trade Rumors: Wigginton received a two-year, $7.5MM deal with an option for 2013 from the Rockies.
The Rockies are having a great offseason, IMO. Meanwhile, I’m really disappointed we didn’t get Wigginton. I’ve wanted him here for the past 2-3 years. He can play 1B, 3B and 2B (although none of them particularly well other than other than maybe 1B, from what I understand). He’s like Cuddyer, I suppose, but getting closer to his true value.
Also, with Morneau’s comeback still in question and Valencia still relatively unproven, and the fact that he’s a decent hitter with some pop from the right side, this seemed like a no-brainer. Instead of (estimated) $4MM for one-dimensional (but tater-mashingly lovable) Jim Thome, you could pay less for a versatile bat that can actually fill a need. Also, he’s content with the bench role, apparently, and is expected to receive 300-350 ABs this season. Right now, who gives Danny V a day off?
the rockies gave TULO a huge raise 4 years premature
and want to do the same with UBALDO.
and you can put it on the boaaaaaard YES, HELL YES
thome > wigginton
tolbert is fine to backup 3rd. deal kubel and fill dh with thome/mauer. he’ll get his 350 a/b’s here and probably cross 600 before the all-star break.
and you can put it on the boaaaaaard YES, HELL YES
Tolbert is only fine to back up DannyV
in the Gardyverse, where .200 hitters are optimal. If you start hitting too much, your defense is suspect, whether or not statistics back up the concern.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 7, 2010 3:46 PM EST up reply actions
Just thinking...
how nice a Hardy-Nishioka infield would look. If the Glove Glove equivalent winning Nishioka is as good as suggested, the Twins could have a middle infield combination among the best in the AL.
We signed Adam Everett for no reason other than defense. Hardy brings that and more.
I’m with those that feel if Hardy is traded it needs to be something that the rest of the AL Central finds unsettling.
"You got to be careful if you don't know where you're going, because you might not get there." - Yogi Berra
+1
That would look real nice, and I would be very happy with Casilla is the utility guy if/when injuries occur. My fear is that the FO wants to get a bullpen arm really badly, and is dangling Hardy to get one.
by Adam Peterson on Dec 7, 2010 10:37 AM EST up reply actions
Argh
the FO wants to get a bullpen arm really badly
I think that’s the panic trigger for me. I have little confidence in the Twins ability to assess value of relief pitchers. Of course they are important but they are also in MUCH greater supply than great shortstops. Don’t doooo it Bill!
agreed
There’s nothing on the reliever market worth one of the best shortstops in the AL.
by Shawn Gillogly on Dec 7, 2010 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
Why would they show so much eagerness to trade him?
I don’t see any good purpose in appearing to be such motivated sellers. If they are committed to trading Hardy, you would think they would pump up his value. It just makes no sense. That’s why I blame Gardy. He’s not good at helping out the FO, imho.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I think they are saying his name wrong in it but that might just be because they pretend to be italian
by twinscrazy_german on Dec 7, 2010 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
Please don't trade Hardy, you idiots
The beard abides.
by Jason Kubel's Beard on Dec 7, 2010 10:46 AM EST reply actions
Please get him locked up instead for several years in Target Field!
I wonder what Hardy himself wants?
by twinscrazy_german on Dec 7, 2010 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
He wants to come back to the Twins.
According to a brief phonecall he had with a Twins blogger recently.
I hope that blogger told him the fans want him back too!
We need BS’s number so we can tell him how stupid this would be.
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
O's/Rays talking Reimold/Bartlett.
Not sure I like that one. Rays must be counting on a bounce-back from Reimold.
I’d give them Kubel for Bartlett.
Hardy for stud reliever (I don’t like it, but it’s going to happen anyway). Uggh.
Duensing for Lorenzo Cain.
Heavy prospect package for Greinke.
Re-sign Thome
Sign Uehara
Liriano/Greinke/Baker/Slowey/Blackburn (Gibson in the wings; he’s not in the Greinke trade, but no one else is off limits, including Hicks, with Cain on board)
Bullpen: Nathan/Capps/Hanrahan/Uehara/Mijares/Burnett/one of Neshek/Perkins/Waldrop/Slama/Gutierrez/Manship
Cain-CF
Yoshi-2b
Mauer-C
Morneau-1b
Young-RF/DH
Cuddy-DH/RF (with Thome)
Valencia-3b
Span-LF
Bartlett-SS
Bench: Thome/Casilla/Morales (he’s out of options and Pavstache will be gone for BFF DruBu)/Repko
Tell me that’s not a vastly improved team. Added a ton of speed to the lineup. Improve the defense a ton in the OF. Improved the pitching a ton, plus the defense upgrade. Lineup at least as good, if not better. Cuddy gets some time as a super-utility guy playing some at 1b/3b/DH/RF/LF.
Duensing won't be enough for Cain
I do like the idea of relegating Cuddyer to a Wigginton (last year with the Orioles) role…play slightly below average defense at multiple positions but hit for power.
I'm not sure...
Would Slowey be enough?
I like Slowey more, but I’d deal either. Would fit their pitching need and be under control for a few more years. If we have to throw in something else, then so be it.
I'm sure Slowey would be more attractive to them
I’d be curious to know what they’d want. I’m surprised they’d even be willing to deal Cain..last update on him on MLBTR they were saying that he wasn’t actually available.
My bad on the Reimold defensive numbers
Something didn’t add up when I posted the update. Was looking at WAR instead of UZR…Reimold is around a -10 defender over his career, which is more in line with what I saw from him in Baltimore. He’d make a nice platoon mate with Kubel, IMO, but not if the O’s are looking for a starting SS in return.
I just got off the phone with Bill Smith and he told me what we are going to do!
Being I’m such a nice guy I will share it with all my Twins brethren.
1.Sign Nishi to a 3 year, ~11 mil contract
2. Trade Delmon Young for Dice-k (they are picking up 16 mil of his contract) and Junichi Tazawa. The Red Soxs need a power RH outfielder and we need pitching help!
3. Sign Uehara to a 2 year ~6 mil contract
4. Trade Cuddy for Fukudome (Cubs eat ~7 mil) and he replaces Delmon Young
5. Sign Hideki Matsui to play DH and be a bench player
6. Trade Hicks+Gibson for Ichiro. This will help us increase the speed in our outfield while giving us a top of the order bat.
7. Sign WANG (even though he is chinese) as a buy low to help fill Sloweys spot
8.Trade Kubel to the braves for Kawakami/Saito
9. Trade Baker for Kuroda
10. Give Hardy away because we don’t like that guy anways
Mauer-C
Morneau-1B
Nishi-2B
Casillo-SS
Danny V-3B
OF-Span/Ichiro/Fukudome
DH-Matsui
Liriano, Kuroda, Dice-K, Wang, Kawakami (Blackburn as back up!)-SP
Capps, Nathan, Saito, Tawaza, Uehara, Nathan, Mijares-RP
I know what your thinking. BEST TEAM EVER! Or….that I have too much time on my hands, WHICH would be a valid point. We would add more speed to the outfield with out costing us too much power, re-build our under producing starting rotation, AND rebuild our bull-pen. Also, the state would rename Minneapolis to Minnejapan.
Cmb0252
Then we're moving the team to Japan to dominate the NPB.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
You got some of the lineup names wrong
C: Ma Uel
1B Mol Neauu
3b Dani San
by twinscrazy_german on Dec 7, 2010 2:22 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Talk about dreaming
For the record, if Seattle wants to trade Ichiro, we should be listening.
singing Uehara would be good good ballpen arm
Danoo
by Danoo on Dec 7, 2010 2:25 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Yes, let's sing
“Uehara, you brilliant ballpen arm”
by twinscrazy_german on Dec 7, 2010 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
beat me to a comment about that spelling error!
Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD
Oh it's more than one
And maybe we should sign Uhura instead. I bet Pavstache could convince Pavano to stay that way. So would Hardy.
by twinscrazy_german on Dec 7, 2010 2:58 PM EST up reply actions
I've heard a lot about the Twins ball pen this year
Seems to be running dry. Seems like they’re willing to do almost anything to upgrade their ball pen.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
They could get Cross for the ball pen
http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=cross-001dav
Jessy S. Would like him. He had an ERA over 5 in AA last year.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
by cmathewson on Dec 7, 2010 4:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
According to MLBTR/Heyman
The Royals have softened on their stance of trading Greinke within the division. Still makes me nervous what we’d have to give up, given what we know they’re asking for from Toronto.
Heyman’s tweet makes me think we’re still in the hunt…nobody else in the division has been linked to Greinke I don’t believe.
It would have to be alot
Not sure I’m still on board with getting Greinke
"Baseball is the only major sport that appears backward in a mirror" ~George Carlin
by thewild_viking_twins on Dec 7, 2010 3:42 PM EST up reply actions
My problem with Wang is that he may try to rush everything. If he does that, he’ll be done to early.
I am sure Rick Anderson will tell him to take it slow with the ladies
by twinscrazy_german on Dec 7, 2010 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
I think Wang is going to put his balls on everybody’s chins.
by Brady Eyestone on Dec 7, 2010 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
He does tend to rush
Then he flies open and his back-door slider tends to hang.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
So, initially, the potential for the game threads made me hope for a Wang signing
Now I’m getting nervous…
You gotta watch out for the hanging slider from Wang
It can result in a dinger.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I Believe
that once Wang’s been yanked a couple of times, he’ll be able to last a lot longer.
Phil Davison for President in 2012
by carlpavanosmoustache on Dec 7, 2010 5:22 PM EST up reply actions
You don't want Gardy to pull Wang prematurely
He’s always one good screwball from getting out of the inning without any runs.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I don't want Gardy to pull Wang
at all — premature or not. You pull Wang and bad things happen. Ask the Catholic Church.
by Old Twins Cap on Dec 7, 2010 8:40 PM EST up reply actions
Gardy could go blind from pulling Wang
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
he'll stop when he needs glasses
Phil Davison for President in 2012
by carlpavanosmoustache on Dec 8, 2010 1:55 AM EST up reply actions
i hear it causes blindness
Phil Davison for President in 2012
by carlpavanosmoustache on Dec 8, 2010 1:53 AM EST up reply actions
The problem with Wang is that he hangs around with a couple of nuts.
Does anyone know? Does Wang beat himself or does the other team beat him.
by b1 on Dec 7, 2010 8:39 PM EST up reply actions
If we can't get Wang
maybe we should call Florida or Baltimore, we could always use a big Johnson (Jim or Josh), as long as we can keep our Hard(y)
Phil Davison for President in 2012
by carlpavanosmoustache on Dec 7, 2010 4:50 PM EST reply actions
Dennys Reyes is available...
just saying…
by eau claire twins fan on Dec 7, 2010 5:22 PM EST reply actions
[IMG]http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd491/Brady_Eyestone/kenny_powers1.jpg[/IMG]
I hear he’s toiling around in Mexico, and he’s throwing 99 MPH.
time to end all this "the Twins play baseball the right way"
Fundamentals are a crutch for the talentless – Kenny Powers
I can at least dream that his cap had a TC on it…
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