Joe C: Twins In Position of Strength w/Hudson, Washburn
Joe Christensen just put up a new blog explaining why the Twins are in a good position with their remaining free agent targets, saying:
"Hudson is reportedly trying to choose between the Nationals and Twins. The Nats went 59-103 last season, so if Hudson wants to contend in 2010, that's an easy choice. From what we've gathered, the Nats have offered more money, though not enough for Hudson to accept, at least not yet."
Click through to read further details.
over 2 years ago
Jesse
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I like the fact that Hudson seems to have landed in the bargain basement, yet again
But that will make it all the more upsetting if the Twins don’t close the deal. (although sounds like Hudson has some bias towards DC, ineptitude of the baseball team notwithstanding)
Maybe if we extend Mauer first, he’ll have so much money that he’ll go out and make some signings on his own.
Hudson offer
Has anyone actually confirmed that the Twins have made an offer to Orlando Hudson? I understand him not wanting to accept a lowball offer from the Nats, but all I’ve heard regarding the Twins is “interest”, which may or may not be coming from the ball club as opposed to the player…I hope the club has interest, as Hudson is a clear upgrade at 2B and the #2 spot in the order, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we’re holding off making an offer until the Mauer contract situation is nailed down.
by Adam Peterson on Feb 4, 2010 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
Rosenthal says we've "intensified our pursuit"
whatever the hell that means
by Steven Ellingson on Feb 4, 2010 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
I think it means something like this
Intensify forward fire power!
Who: Admiral Piett
Notes: Said as he sees an A-Wing hurtling towards the command bridge of his Super Star Destroyer, before the A-Wing slams into the bridge and brings the ship down
Doofenschmirtz Evil, INC.
Phineas and Ferb
I don't want the Twins to crash into the Death Star
haven’t they lost to the Yankees enough recently?
by ckb on Feb 4, 2010 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
but in crashing
into the Death Star, they will bring it down and then Luke (Joe Mauer), Han Solo (Justin Morneau), Princess Leah (Nick Punto), and the wookies (rest of the Twins) are the victors!
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
oh
and let us not forget about Chewy (played by Jim Thome)
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
I dont think so
“Moi, moi, I love you” sounds more of a Punto/Tolbert saying to Ron Gardenhire.
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
I'm waiting patiently for a Nick Punto/Princess Leia photoshop.
RonGarde: Target Field is going to be exactly like Progressive Field, except you'll have a chance to die of frostbite in the middle of July
It's really personal with you and Punto, isn't it?
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
"All morons hate it when you call them a moron." -Holden Caufield
by less cowbell, more 'neau on Feb 4, 2010 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
As you wish, fischean.
As long as it’s only in good fun.

"What is best in life?"
"To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women."
by cryhavoc on Feb 4, 2010 6:06 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Great. Too bad he's not lefthanded
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Damn it! I hate when I do that!
I once had Matthew Stafford’s jersey reversed.
Fixed.

"What is best in life?"
"To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women."
by cryhavoc on Feb 4, 2010 7:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Hahaha, oh my god.
Thank you.
RonGarde: Target Field is going to be exactly like Progressive Field, except you'll have a chance to die of frostbite in the middle of July
It seems to me
that signing Washburn actually might have a negative effect on the Twins win expectation, given that it would take away starts from someone who would be a better pitcher. Depth is great, and no team goes through a season with 5 or even 6 starters, but I would much prefer Liriano in the rotation than Washburn.
Depth is especially nice when you are in a position to begin with your best guys getting the playing time, then using the depth as your best guys suffer injuries. If you give Washburn a major league deal you are essentially artificially moving him up in line that his performance and abilities does not warrant.
Hudson, on the other hand, yes please.
by Eric in Madison on Feb 4, 2010 11:20 AM EST reply actions
What if
Liriano struggles again? Bring him in from the pen and that gives us another lefty we could use as a reliever.
by Bert: Oh, we're live? on Feb 4, 2010 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
But...
What do you do with Brian Duensing then? He’s also a lefty and worthy of a rotation spot.
by TheBlackFreighter on Feb 4, 2010 11:39 AM EST up reply actions
Seasoning
AAA. We all saw Swarzak pitch well at first then suck in his second stint. Duensing is certainly not above being the no. 1 or 2 starter at Rochester, in fact I think it would do wonders for him in the long run.
Nevermind
Let me take my original posting back. We should make a new rule that only POSITIVE thoughts can be posted about Liriano. It would be HUGE if he could resemble the Liriano of 06!!!
by Bert: Oh, we're live? on Feb 4, 2010 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
What is this, the Emeril show?
Actually, I have little confidence in Duensing, but it isn’t because I think he needs more time in the minors; I just don’t think he’s that good.
Let’s say they start with a rotation of Baker, Slowey, Pavano, Blackburn, and Liriano (in whatever order). It still leaves Duensing, Swarzak, Manship and Perkins (as of now) as possible fill ins. I’d rather go that route than hand Washburn a rotation spot, which is what signing him amounts to. If he were actually, you know, better than the pitchers they already have, I’d be happy about it, but since I don’t think he is, I have no interest.
by Eric in Madison on Feb 4, 2010 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
Exactly.
I couldn’t agree more. I was posing Duensing as a hypothetical as I would still rather trot him out there versus Washburn.
by TheBlackFreighter on Feb 4, 2010 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
Duensing is old
Older than Liriano. If we “season” him too much, he’ll be over his peak before he gets a full year in the big leagues. But I do agree that it’s most sensible to leave him in AAA, just because we plenty of relievers, and a lot of guys with no options, so we might as well leave the guys we can in AAA to come up when someone struggles or gets hurt.
by Steven Ellingson on Feb 4, 2010 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
Right
I don’t know how much more seasoning he needs. He’s had two years of AAA and his MLB stat line reads like a #3 starter: 5 W 2L 84 IP 31 BB 53K 3.64 ERA. THe walks concern me. Otherwsie, he was very good last year. And he saved us down the stretch when 3/5 of our opening-day rotation was on the DL. You don’t send him down because he needs more seasoning. You send him down because there’s no room for him and he has an option.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
ERA
A projected ERA of 3.67 from Liriano? I’ll take it…Does that seem low for anyone? I mean granted he is coming off a good winter league showing, but is that overly optimistic? It seems like it to me, but I sure hope he can pull it off. But back to the content, please please please sign Hudson and stay away from Washburn!!!!! I would rather have them sign neither than sign Washburn. It just doesn’t make sense to me. He had a decent first half, but an AWFUL second half!!! AWFUL!!! I’ll take my chances with perkins/liriano/duensing any day…
Liriano
Liriano was certainly not that good last year, but he was also incredibly lucky. I think a 3.67 ERA is easily attainable keeping in mind his strange stats from last year, his impressive contact rate and the fact that his velocity and location appear to be improving. Check out Fire Gardy for a great read on Liriano’s luck last year: http://firegardy.com/2010/02/02/the-luck-of-the-liriano/
by TheBlackFreighter on Feb 4, 2010 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
unluck is a form of luck
Do you want to know the terrifying truth, or do you want to see me sock a few dingers?
by natetheskate on Feb 4, 2010 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
All the Hudson talk
I am starting to wonder if all of this Hudson hysteria is going to lead to an even more affordable option in Felipe Lopez. They are very similar players, and honestly, if the Twins land either one, I will be much more excited to see what this lineup can do.
It’s rare that there are still a few very good options to fill holes where the Twins are obviously lacking. I don’t think I stand alone in saying that if the Twins fail to land one of these guys, it will be quite disappointing.
Maybe Mauer’s contract should have a stipulation that the Twins must sign one of these guys. :P
I agree
Depending on how much more money the Nats are offering (probably at least one million more on the base salary), the Twins likely threw an offer out there (something like 1 yr/$3.5 mil + incentives and a mutual option for 2011) while assuming he signs with the Nats. When/if he picks the Nats, the Twins get Lopez for even cheaper.
If that happens, I could see them picking up Washburn for the difference, $2-3 mil or so. He can’t ask for any more now, and I would take him for $3 mil or less. You can’t deny he would be a great 4-5 starter as long as we understand that’s what he is. Then Duensing, Swarzak, maybe Perkins can all start in AAA (unless Perkins is traded). Depth is good, especially relatively cheap depth.
If Hudson signs with the Gnats
The Twins will sign Lopez. You heard it here first.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Almost
I said it right above you, but good try. :P
Beat me by a second
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Ha ha yep..
Let’s hope we’re right.
If Hudson signs with the Nats, that is. I’d rather have him here.
Lopez
Lopez has had zero buzz surrounding him all offseason. It’s a bit strange. All I’ve heard is that people think he is a prima donna and that the Cardinals were interested in bringing him aboard to play a variety of positions. I would hope the Twins would be in on him, if the Hudson talks break down.
by TheBlackFreighter on Feb 4, 2010 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
Felipe Lopez
All I’ve heard regarding Lopez is that the Cardinals are a likely destination, and that the Twins apparently don’t like his defense. I’d like to think Lopez is a clear backup option, but the front office statements make me doubt this.
by Adam Peterson on Feb 4, 2010 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
That's too bad..
He isn’t too much of a step down. Some people have been saying his defense was actually slightly better than Hudson’s in 2009.
Lopez has greater upside than Hudson
and Hudson is more of a known commodity. If they both duplicated their seasons last year, Lopez would be considerably more valuable. He probably won’t though. Hudson is basically guaranteed to be over 2 wins better than a replacement player.
Washburn
Like I said in my response to the Hudson comment, if we don’t overpay for Washburn, I’m fully behind a signing. As long as Gardy understands he isn’t a no. 2 or even no. 3 starter, he improves the staff.
Meh
When you have three options for one role, and all of them have had major league success, you don’t need to sign a fourth. Put it this way, I would not trade Perkins or Liriano for Washburn. If you sign Washburn, you’ll need to get rid of one of those two.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
+1
Well put. Signing him would amount to a trading of one of those two, and I certainly wouldn’t want to do that. Especially Liriano. Same thing with Hudson or Lopez, it would equivalate trading Casilla, if he would make the team anyway, but I think I would do that. Provided we can get an option or something on a contract we would sign Lopez/Hudson too.
really?
Washburn is no better than Liriano or Duensing. He’s been a mediocre pitcher for several years, other than a brief stretch where he had the best outfield defense of all time (arguably) tracking down his flyballs in a pitcher-friendly ballpark. Washburn would be a terrible acquisition for the Twins because he would be stealing starts from Liriano or Duensing and is coming back from a knee injury. If we were truly in need of a 5th starter, I would be in favor of the Twins taking a flier, but that is certainly not the case and he certainly will not be good.
by TheBlackFreighter on Feb 4, 2010 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe..
I understand he’s a flyball pitcher and he is mediocre, but when healthy, you know what you’ll get from him. Duensing will probably start in AAA, Perkins is gone. Granted, I think Liriano will have a bounceback year, but Washburn has been consistent his whole career until his injured second half with Detroit last year. Perkins has been the opposite of consistent, and I like having depth to the staff.
On the other hand, I would much rather have Liriano as my fifth starter. I’m just saying if we’re talking Washburn for under $3 mil, I’d probably do it.
Good Point
You raise a good point. I think I would rather have Perkins (especially when salary is considered) in the rotation. But then you have to consider that he’s going to be gone as soon as they can trade him, anyways. Both Liriano and Duensing have a leg-up in the race for the no. 5 position in the rotation, and Perkins would throw a fit if he ended up in AAA again, whereas Duensing could go there, and either one of them would pitch out of the bullpen as well.
Washburn is overkill
We have 6 solid options plus a few others with experience now in the majors. We’ll be fine in the rotation. Signing washburn indicates a complete lack of faith in Slowey and Pavano staying injury free next year.
I will be disappointed if we don’t get an IF either Lopez or Hudson at this point. If we can get either one under 5 million and it seems a certainty at this point then the front office has no excuse. This place will be sold out next year and we deserve a winner for building it.
Doofenschmirtz Evil, INC.
Phineas and Ferb
I agree, Washburn is overkill.
If they want to bring in a redundant arm to compete for a starting job, I’d rather have gone with Lewis.
lack of faith
I should point out that the lack of faith in remaining injury free is valid and I don’t mind if Washburn does get signed, just not at the cost of Hudson or Lopez at 2b.
Doofenschmirtz Evil, INC.
Phineas and Ferb
No to Washbum
Yes please to Hudson!
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
Lopez is
not going to sign with the Twins. The FO and Gardy hate him, so therefore, he isnt going to come to MN.
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
I'm just saying Id take him
unbunch your panties a bit
Beadlemaniacs - Award winning* college basketball blog
You know you like college hockey
I would take him
too, especially on a multi year deal and he would be cheaper than Hudson. But the FO doesnt want him, so lets go get Hudson!
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
oh and I am
not Nick Punto, so I don’t where panties.
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any of us." - Kirby Puckett
I bet you Nick Punto knows how to spell "wear"
by Steven Ellingson on Feb 4, 2010 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
Wow, that sounded a lot meaner than I meant it to be.
Maybe I’m the one with my panties in a bunch.
by Steven Ellingson on Feb 4, 2010 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
I just need to learn to put winkie faces after my comments.
especially when I’m correcting grammar.
by Steven Ellingson on Feb 4, 2010 1:15 PM EST up reply actions
that would be a good rule,
we should all imagine that we are kindergarden teachers as we write our responses.
by montanatwinsfan on Feb 4, 2010 1:55 PM EST up reply actions
Lopez
Personally, I’d rather have either Felipe Lopez (.360-.380 OBP) or Jose Lopez (20 plus home runs from the right side and young enough to conceivlably improve a bit) over hudson, but in all honesty, hudson is still a HUGE upgrade at second, and I’d take it in a heart beat if that’s all we get.
Washburn on the other hand… here’s to hoping someone else signs him so that we don’t make that mistake. If we lose 3 or more pitchers to significant injury, then we’d regret not signing him, but in any other scenario we would likely regret signing him.
by diehardtwinsfan on Feb 4, 2010 12:23 PM EST reply actions
Jose Lopez would cost assets in a trade
and he only offers power. He isn’t a bad player but he is no where near the value that Felipe Lopez or Orlando Hudson are likely to be.
Twins don't like F.Lopez defense
LENIII posted that awhile back… doubtful F.Lopez ends up with the Twins in my opinion.
I think it’ll be Hudson, Jose Lopez or nada.
LEN III has been known to be wrong
He’s much more fast an loose on his blog. He’ll go with something if he has one anonymous source. So maybe he talked to TR, who saw him for a series last year, and it happened to be a bad series. His view does not necessarily represent the whole scouting department, which has reports from every scout in Lopez’s geography.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Frontrunner?
According to MLBTR we have “intensified our pursuit” of Hudson. Although he is still asking for a one-year deal worth at least $6 mil. Think we will do it? Or is that still too high?
MLBTR
MLBTR relays the Morosi/Rosenthal report that the Twins have intensified their pursuit. MLBTR speculates the Twins could be the frontrunner at this point.
I'm don't think we end up with Hudson.
Sorry, I just got a bad feeling about it. I mean come on, you have some pretty strong hints coming from Christensen’s (who is basically the mouth piece for F.O.) mouth.
The Twins don’t need either player.
and the biggest one:
But the Twins already have two switch-hitting second base options in Nick Punto and Alexi Casilla. Both have been maddeningly inconsistent, but at their best, they’ve shown an ability to handle 2-hole duties.
Who other then our F.O. could possibly think either of these goons can handle the #2 spot?
by Michael in N.Cali on Feb 4, 2010 1:09 PM EST reply actions
Yeah, I'm ok with Punto as the 2b
but he absolutely should never be considered to hit anywhere but 8th or 9th. That’s the only way to minimize his horrible bat.
by Steven Ellingson on Feb 4, 2010 1:16 PM EST up reply actions
Encouraging
I took Joe C.‘s article as encouraging news. That means that the front office won’t overpay, and will be negotiating with the upper hand. They can say “we don’t need you” to any of the FAs and the FAs will have to take what they can get or end up playing for the Nationals.
It was even more encouraging with Washburn, meaning that the Twins realize they can’t afford to pay him anywhere near the original offer of $5 mil, if at all.
Finally
The Thome signing is official. That took a week and a half.
What about Lowell?
Don’t the Red Sox still need to get rid of him?
Almost Done?!!?
MLB.com’s Bill Ladson tweets that Hudson will not play for the Nationals, and a deal is almost done with the Twins.
from mlbtraderumors.com
Orlando Hudson Close To Deal With Twins
By Tim Dierkes [February 4, 2010 at 12:32pm CST]
12:32pm: MLB.com’s Bill Ladson tweets that Hudson will not play for the Nationals, and a deal is almost done with the Twins.
Doofenschmirtz Evil, INC.
Phineas and Ferb
+1
Today would be quite nice.
RonGarde: Target Field is going to be exactly like Progressive Field, except you'll have a chance to die of frostbite in the middle of July
Indeed.
But after the somewhat deflating updates about Mauer’s not-contract…well, today would just be nice.
RonGarde: Target Field is going to be exactly like Progressive Field, except you'll have a chance to die of frostbite in the middle of July
FINISH HIM
Hudson wobbles on his feet. Smith removes his mask – revealing a skull with glowing eyes.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
























