If Orlando Hudson Is In, Who's Out?
A shortlist of candidates who could lose their spot on the 40-man roster once the Twins add Orlando Hudson. Butera, Casilla and Perkins are all candidates, but who else makes the list? Read on after the jump.
Drew Butera - Kind of the "dark horse" candidate, which isn't a good thing in this case, simply because of the number of catchers already on Minnesota's 40-man roster (four). What might save him is the injury to Jose Morales, as minor as it may be. With spring training just around the corner, it's likely Ron Gardenhire will want to see what both Butera and Wilson Ramos can offer, because one of them will serve as Joe Mauer's backup when the season kicks off. Ramos is the prospect, but Butera's apparent strength defensively should make it an interesting decision.
Alexi Casilla - Alexi is probably the favorite to go, for two reasons. First, that overload of infielders that this team had before losing a spot on the bench to Jim Thome (a two-infielder bench down to one) is still there. Even if the team uses Matt Tolbert's last option this season, which seems likely, the 25-man roster is still full. Second, Alexi is out of options. This has already been discussed at length throughout the comments here on a few different threads. If the Twins do decide that Casilla is the guy, they'll have ten days to trade him before he'd have to be released.
Brendan Harris - This one is just me, and I know, it's a bizarre option considering that the Twins had already penciled him in as the starter at third base (pre-Hudson signing) after signing him to a two-year contract. But if the Twins want to shave a little cash off their payroll and make space for younger and, more importantly, less expensive players, then it's an option. It's not likely, but it's worth mentioning.
Luke Hughes - This is a popular option for people who believe all of the following. First, that Valencia doesn't have competition from Hughes for third base. Second, that the Twins would still go with a two-infielder bench that would include Casilla but not Tolbert. Third, that the Twins would keep just four outfielders on the roster (Delmon Young, Denard Span, Michael Cuddyer and Jason Kubel). Personally, I think there are a lot of other names that are higher on the list than Hughes.
Glen Perkins - Perkins' name has come up repeatedly when people talk about trades, but the word is that teams want to see him throw this spring before they "spring" for him. (See what I did there?) Still, if the Twins can get something they're happy with in the next day or two, this option isn't out of the question. The most popular wish around Twinkie Town is to package Perkins with Casilla in any deal, although I'm not sure how keen the front office would be to pull the trigger on that one.
Jason Pridie - It's possible, but it's not probable. In the case of a long-term injury to Span the Twins would need to find a replacement, and Minnesota would be forced to add that player to the 40-man roster. Meaning, naturally, that they'd need to take one more person off of it.
Those who can't be removed: Alex Burnett (P), Clay Condrey (P), Rob Delaney (P), Deolis Guerra (P), Loek Van Mil (P), Estarlin De Los Santos (IF), Danny Valencia (IF), Jim Thome (DH)
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It should be Drew Butera
Though it should have been Butera the last time. It will probably be Luke Hughes…
agreed
this is who it should be. He has a good chance to pass through waivers and potentially stay with the Twins. Although if I were him, I’d look at other organizations if given the chance, which I think DFA’ing him would allow.
He’s 4 string here long term. Though he might be 2nd string for a short time at the beginning of the season, which is the monkey wrench in this whole thing.
We can also replace his -replacement level production easily, probably, if worse comes to worse. That said, it probably won’t be him, lol.
Waiving Harris is interesting.
Works nicely as a procedural move – waive him now, knowing that nobody’s going to take his salary on, and add him back at the end of spring training when you’ve either traded Casilla or Perkins or can waive de los Santos for him.
Delmon could work on the same theory.
The big difference there
is that the Twins don’t have an overload of outfielders, and Young still has more potential than Harris.
Seems like there's a decent chance either would be nabbed
Delmon especially. But the two-year contract might scare people away though with Harris. Veeery interesting.
Giving away Casilla for nothing would sort of stick in my craw.
Same here.
I suppose in some way it’s a good thing, as it’s the result of so many good additions. It’s not like we’d be losing him over Tony Batista or Phil Nevin.
Still a bunch of FAs
And it looks like Damon or Gomes could probably be had for about as much money as Delmon. I wouldn’t cry over that.
Again,
the problem with this line of thinking is that if you want Damon or Gomes, you’re still going to have to find another spot on the 40-man roster. Losing an outfielder just complicates things and is unnecessary.
You have whatever the chance is that nobody claims Delmon (pretty high, I think, who wants to pay this guy $2.6m in this market?). And if it doesn’t work, you sign Gomes, actually upgrade the team a little, and are in the same spot as before except with an extra physical week to try to trade somebody, and no longer stuck with a headcase.
I’d probably still rather waive Pridie; if someone is insane enough to claim him there are plenty of guys with his skillset. Waiving Pridie and signing Taveras to a minor league deal with a verbal guarantee of being the fourth OF solves the problem and probably upgrades the team slightly.
I think we have to agree to disagree on Delmon.
He’s only 24, still has upside. There are plenty of rebuilding teams who wouldn’t mind throwing a couple mil at Delmon in the hope he reaches his potential. In theory it’s not a bad idea, but we’re already struggling to find room for Hudson. And I don’t see any sense in removing Young for O-Hud.
Look at the stats
Gomes had an OPS of .879 last year and one .801 for his career. That’s a lot better than Delmon.
No on Harris
My feeling on him is that he can’t seem to play an entire season well. But is fine for about 95 games. Gardy just needs to give him that and split the other games amongst the scrappy puppies.
Butera
They’ll keep Casilla as he will still be a cheap option next year after spending a year on the bench. He’ll make less than 1 million in arbitration for 2011…. well maybe 1 but thats going to be about it. Plus Casilla will have another year of growing under his belt .
Butera is redundant competing with 2 other catchers for the back up job.
Hughes would be my next guess although he could push for a bench job in 2011 after Thome leaves.
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Phineas and Ferb
Not that simple
Butera is competing with two other catchers for the backup job… and one of those two is injured. Morales is supposed to be ready in mid-March, but if he has any sort of complication with his recovery, releasing Butera means that not only is Ramos the only backup catcher, but there isn’t even another guy available without a 40-man roster move if he or Mauer go on the DL (so you’d have to release someone else anyway).
In a vacuum, releasing Butera is a pretty low-risk move (I doubt he’ll be claimed by anyone), but I’d be just a bit more skittish about it with Morales on the shelf, and knowing how the Twins love their emergency catcher contingencies, they’re probably even more concerned than I am.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
If they signed a veteran like Molina to a MFA contract, Butera would be expendable
But not before.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
People?
No way do you even think of losing Young or Harris… or even Casilla. Hudson and Thome have 1 year deals. Pridie is a dime a dozen and Hughes is forth option at third. I would drop Punto so Gardy has no chance of playing him. Harris can fill utility if a better 3rd baseman comes along… Though I’ve believe Harris is the 3rd baseman. He hits 280 when he is everyday player with chance to hit 20 HR given that chance. He and Delmon both had promising numbers when they were playing all the time at Tampa and while giving that chance for Twins
I voted Casilla, but I hope it's Butera
"I couldn't do that. Could you do that? Why can they do it? Who are those guys?"
Voted Casilla
Don’t like the situation, but it is what it is. Signing Thome and Hudson is well worth it. But doing so means we have to make room. Maybe signing Hudson for two years would have made losing a player easier.
I just think that the Twins have too much depth in the IF. I just don’t see it being Hughes for the fact that Valencia hasn’t shown us much yet. Even when he does arrive at the Show, its not expected for him to hit much better then .280 and his defense isn’t stunning. Hughes provides the Twins with another option at the rotating 3B position. Where is Gary G?
Gardy isn’t going to get rid of a proven vet like Harris over a Casilla or Butera.
Butera probably would have been the easy choice, except now he may make the roster out of spring and its no guarantee how long he will be needed.
I think it’s going to be Casilla. Mostly because he has had his chances like Gomez had. And the surplus in the IF. Not saying I like it. But it just seems the clear option to me.
Having 10 days to trade him, maybe they can get something back, but the problem with trading ANYONE is that you have to trade someone else with him or you still have the same problem, which is one extra spot. And what are you going to get? A SP or RP? We already are set. A OF? Well then maybe its Elmon and Casilla traded for a starting OF. A 3B? I think the Twins are content with Punto/Harris and done adding payroll.
The missing name
Tolbert is my choice to throw overboard.
Butera #2, Hughes #3.
by AM. on Feb 7, 2010 10:05 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I think Tolbert too
I don’t care if he has an option. We might need Butera for April/May if Morales can’t go.
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Casilla
Give him an opportunity to help someone else. Maybe the Gnats will take him for a PTBNL.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Butera is my
Butera would likely be my choice. I’d predict it will be Casilla though. I’d be absolutely shocked if it’s Perkins, he’s a starting pitcher lefty with some value, not a guy organizations give up for free.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane
Why do people want to give up on Alexi?
Wasnt it just two years ago that he was our 2nd baseman of the future? He did very well in 2008, and he stuggled in 2009. So what. Who got the game winning hit to send us to New York? Alexi did. That’s how you repay the guy? Cmon man.
I say we keep Alexi because I believe in him as a player. He just needs a little confidence and he can really do things. Get rid of Hughes, nobody’ll pick him up so then we can send him to Rochester.
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by Percy Harvin My Fav! on Feb 7, 2010 11:40 PM EST reply actions
+1
But i do believe he will be picked up. I think we should either go with a 5 man bench and see how everyone does…Have Thome, Punto, Moralas, Pridi, and Alexi. I dont think Neshek will be will be with the team to begin the season anyway.
They have to give up on someone...
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane
Confidence
He has shown that he’s either a good player or he’s horrible. We’ve seen wild fluctuations in the level of play based on his confidence. Even this winter, he was horrible during the season and great i the playoffs. It was all confidence. He’s had three oppotunities in the MLB, and never really established himself because, when he’s bad, he’s so badhe doesn’t belong in the majors. Last year, he started the season with .400 OPS for the first month and found the bench. He had a two-week stretch of good play when Cabrera was building him up.
Oh, as to the game winning hit thing: Several players stepped up in that game, including Tolbert. The fact that he was the last one to step up means nothing in terms of his chances of being a consistent good player in the majors.
Now he doesn’t have a role with this team. Time to move on.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
In addition...
Oh, as to the game winning hit thing: Several players stepped up in that game, including Tolbert.
Good point. Also, the winning pitcher in that game was Bobby Keppel. He is now with the Nippon Ham Fighters.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
But you've gotta keep him!
After all, he had one good at-bat when everyone was watching!
If Casilla is not the answer this year (and he’s not) then they’ve got to cut bait. He has a 66 career OPS+ in 900 plate appearances. He’s not a good second baseman with average range at best and a tendency to make mental errors. The Twins are contenders, they can’t afford to give players 4th and 5th chances.
casilla reminds me of bartlett, I don’t want to see them make that mistake again
by Disorderly Conduct on Feb 8, 2010 10:54 AM EST up reply actions
On the other hand...
Casilla reminds me of Luis Rivas, and I don’t want to see them make that mistake again, either.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
Bartlett was much more consistent offensively and defensively
Casilla will go 2-30. Then 10-20. Then 3-70. Casilla has the talent to be like Bartlett. But his slumps are just catastrophic.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
My take.....
The Twins will carry Alexi sicne he is still cheap, can play 2B or SS. He’s still an option (shades of Luis Rivas) for second in 2011.
Tolbert has an option. The Twins will keep him and send him down. His upside is betetr than, say, Hughes in today’s marketplace.
Butera would be my #1 choice, except he will probably need to start the season with the Twins. Ramos would be better served going strong at Rochester. Morales will need some time at AAA, too.
I refuse to give up on Perkins. He has value as a long-relief guy if the Twins decide to send Duensing to Rochester as a starter, don’t sign Jaarod and start Liriano. I think Perkins, given an attitude adjustment, could settle inot a role of solid relief guy. I wish some guys would be happier to be in the majors and worry less about their deserved role in the game. Hey, you make money if you pitch…well…in the majors, period.
I don’t put a lot of necessary stock in Pridie. If you do cut him, you find someone else to fill a hole at Rochester. I don’t think the Twins need to carry a 5th outfielder. Punto can play center in a pinch, for a night, a game. Or if Tolbert is the man, he can too.
So, it looks like Hughes. He has Valencia, Plouffe, Tolbert ahead of him. The Twins may still have Macri at AAA. Dinkelman and SIngleton and Gardenhire are in the wings. In the game of numbers, he’s not totally necessary. Besides, he may get through waivers and the Twins can still keep him in the system for another season.
A team still ahs to keep the guy on the 40-man (which means they would need to bring Casilla along in April, whever).
And, Delmon Young…don’t give up on him. Yes, the Twins MAY have Revere, Benson, Tosoni coming up in 2011/2012, or the option of playing Kubel out there fulltime when Thome steals our hearts in the Great Minnesota Outdoor Lovefest.
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Span
So if Span gets hurt, who plays center?
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane
Hopefully.......
You sign anotehr comparable journey,an. Or Brendan Robert, or Dustin Martin or…surprise…give Ben Revere some early time in the outfield. Let him sink and swim like the Twins did Gomez. AT least you have the option of sending him up and down over four years!
A repalcement CF is a phone call and plane ticket away.
Punto, Tolbert, hell even Cuddyer…can plug the whole for a game.
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No
First, Tolbert will be in AAA. Second, Punto is horrible in the outfield. Third, Cuddy is an emergency center fielder at best. Fourth, what happens if Span is day to day for three games? Fifth, who spells Delmon in the late innings when they pinch hit Thome for him with Kubel at DH?
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Ramos won't be hurt by getting a cup of coffee in MN
You are taking about him playing in MN for about a month. This isn’t exactly going to kill his development. Drop Butera, who is worthless, and if Morales cannot go, let Ramos play up in the bigs for the two weeks or so Morales needs to be completely ready. This way, you don’t risk loosing Casilla or Hughes, who would both be picked up by someone.
by diehardtwinsfan on Feb 8, 2010 8:06 AM EST up reply actions
+1
Plus, if he’s productive up here it could help his trade value- because if Morales proves to be a competent back up this year, I have a feeling Ramos will be dealt.
Maybe so, but if Morales is injured and Butera is gone, catching depth is very thin.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I doubt you will lose butera
My guess is that he clears waivers… so it isn’t like you cannot put him back on the 40 if needed.
by diehardtwinsfan on Feb 8, 2010 10:55 AM EST reply actions
If you put him back on the 40 man, somebody has to go
That’s just deferring the problem, and taking a real risk that someone will claim him at the same time. I don’t know how many times I have to write this, but the Twins go into camp with two healthy backup catcher candidates. They cannot afford to go down to one healthy back-up catcher candidate because, if one of their two healthy catchers go down, they must scramble to sign somebody. Catcher is one position where you need a lot of depth. And they have less depth than they have had in years, with Morales going down. Last year, they had all these guys plus Redmond in camp.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Perkins has value
The notion that the Twins would cut Perkins from the 40 man roster is pretty implausible. This is a guy who could easily make the rotation of half the teams in the league, including the Twins.
by AM. on Feb 8, 2010 1:51 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Belatedly
…realized that’s what you meant. Given the burned bridges, I can see a trade as at least an option/solution. I’d prefer Harris or Tolbert going before Casilla, though, either cut or part of the trade.
by AM. on Feb 8, 2010 8:44 PM EST via mobile up reply actions

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