Twins Sweep A's with 4-2 Win, Slowey Doesn't Allow a Hit, Thome Homers
by Jesse on Aug 15, 2010 5:56 PM EDT
in Game Recaps
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PrintAnother strong team performance seals the sweep...but somehow I think the sweep might be story 1-B. Story 1-A, naturally, will be: did the Twins do the right thing by pulling Kevin Slowey after seven innings?
In case you missed it, Slowey pitched exceptionally well on Sunday afternoon. The 26-year old right hander didn't allow a single hit over the course of his seven innings. That isn't to say he had perfect control, because he didn't--three walks and a ball in the left shoulderblade of Mark Ellis will tell you that. Indeed, his control seemed to get a bit worse in the seventh inning, and by the time Slowey recorded the third out he'd thrown 106 pitches on the afternoon.
But if I'm honest, right now I'm not sure which side of the issue I'm on. On one hand I wish that Gardy had at least given Slowey the opportunity to go out there and see what happened. But on a more rational level, and I lean more towards this decision, I have to think Gardy did the right thing. Forget the pitch count, it wasn't about that. The Twins were hanging onto a 1-0 lead at the time, and they couldn't know that the offense was about to put up a three-spot in the bottom half of the inning. On top of that, Slowey was starting to miss his spots more often. He'd walked Jack Cust to open the top of the seventh, on four pitches. He induced a groundout from Kevin Kouzmanoff, but three of the pitches in that plate appearance weren't anywhere close, either. Slowey then hit Ellis, although the bean ball was the second pitch that was too far inside for comfort. Rajai Davis would ground into a double play to end it, but Slowey was obviously losing his control.
Still...his line was pretty good.
Two sides of the issue. My heart wishes Slowey could have come out for the eighth, but my brain knows that lifting him was probably the right move to make.
[EDIT: After thinking about this for a few more minutes, I definitely agree with Gardenhire's decision to remove Slowey. I'd forgotten about his recent spate of elbow soreness. And Gardy knew how unpopular of a decision this would be. Good for him for doing the right thing.]
"First of all, I’ll start off by saying I’d boo me, too, if I took a pitcher out with a no-hitter going, but I would do it a thousand times the same way because Slowey’s just come off an elbow injury and we’re not even going to come close to risking this guy ... We had to back him up the last time. It’s the way it is. It’s sad because I’d be booing too, I want to throw a no-hitter myself, but I also know that I’m responsible for this young man’s arm, and we were going to protect him no matter what."
And from Slowey:
"I was a little disappointed ... I don’t think it would be possible not to be a litttle bit disappointed, but I think more than anything I was encouraged. I was encouraged by the way it was presented to me. I was encouraged by the fact that Gardy and Andy [pitching coach Rick Anderson] care a lot more about me as a person and as a pitcher in the long run than they do about winning one game or having one accomplishment. I think that says a lot about them and a lot about our organization."
More on the game after the jump.
Minnesota pushed across a run in the third with a two-out rally. Orlando Hudson and Joe Mauer squeaked out back-to-back singles before Jason Kubel looped one down the left field line. It bounced over the fence in the corner for a ground-rule double.
Their next chance came in the bottom of the seventh. And it was baffling to me, I can only imagine it would be baffling to any A's fan.
Hudson and Mauer reached again, and ended up on second and third with two away. Instead of walking Jim Thome in order to face Danny Valencia, Jerry Blevins and the Athletics decided to pitch to Thome. Three pitches, three balls, and then Blevins...for some inexplicable reason...threw Thome a fastball.
Down the middle.
A 3-0 fastball, to Jim Thome, down the middle.
If you blinked you missed the ball landing in the right field seats. It was a rocket, and it was a thing of beauty. Thome's 580th career home run put the Twins up 4-0, and some lucky fan caught a home run ball from a future Hall of Famer. I hope he writes a letter of gratitude to the Oakland organization, and to Blevins specifically, because I'm still not sure why it happened.
Jon Rauch came on to pitch the eighth, and proceeded to give up a pair of hits and a walk before getting pulled. Jesse Crain relieved him with one out and runners on second and third, and promptly picked up two outs to end the threat. Crain dropped a clearly unexpected curveball over the outside edge of the plate for a called third strike on Cust--the one guy in the lineup to be even moderately afraid of. Matt Capps retired the side for his 30th save of the season, his fourth as a Twin.
- Cliff Pennington made a great play to end the bottom of the fifth inning, ranging far to his right to snag a hard-hit grounder from Michael Cuddyer and then throwing across the diamond to get him by a step. It kept the A's in the game at the time.
- Oakland has some good, young starting pitching. Raise your hand if you're surprised. Thankfully we got them at a time where our own starters are pitching just as well.
- Mauer was 2-for-3 with a pair of walks. Just another Joe Mauer day. Ho-hum.
- Danny Valencia didn't hit the ball hard every time but he still picked up three hits, including his 11th double of the season.
- Since his three-inning, five-run performance against the White Sox one month ago today, Slowey has pitched 34.1 innings and allowed just eight runs.
- Alexi Casilla put down a perfect drag bunt to lead off the bottom of the eighth, and then promptly stole second base with ease. The man has skills. He's a lot of fun to watch when his head is in the game, unlike his errant throw from short that allowed Ellis to reach in the fifth.
- Jason Repko made a fantastic leaping catch at the wall in left field today. I'm not saying he should start in front of anyone, especially not Delmon Young, but I don't think Young would have made that grab.
Studs
Kevin Slowey: 7 IP, 5 K, 3 BB, 0 H, 0 R, .483 WPA
Jim Thome: 1-for-4, HR, 3 RBI, R, .061 WPA
Joe Mauer: 2-for-3, 2 BB, R, .076 WPA
Danny Valencia: 3-for-4, 2B, .043 WPA
Jesse Crain: 0.2 IP, 1 K, 0 H, 0 R, .063 WPA
Orlando Hudson: 1-for-4, BB, 2 R, .048 WPA
Duds
Jon Rauch: 0.1 IP, 2 H, BB, 2 R, -.088 WPA
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This is dumb.
And is regular major league practice despite it being really dumb. It’s ridiculous to make the decision before you have to. Suppose they score seven runs – you can tell Slowey to go out there, throw batting practice fastballs, and hope they hit them at people.
Well, in this situation it's not dumb at all.
This wasn’t done under normal circumstances. They wanted to look out for Slowey’s arm, and in the scheme of Kevin’s season that’s a good thing. As I said below, if he was healthy I’d have said go for it…and I’m sure Gardy would have as well. But this was not about pitch counts, it was about protecting Slowey’s arm. And I’m okay with that.
Dumb?
What’s dumb is making a decision for the sake of a statistic that isn’t W/L.
The only reason that you should let players stay in to chase a shut-out/no-no/perfect game, etc., is to engender loyalty among the players that want to go down in history. As a manager, you should only consider what’s good for the wins and losses.
For instance,
- Is a reliever more likely to hold the team scoreless
- Is your pitcher more likely to be tired, and pitch more poorly in his next start, or late in the year
- Is your pitcher dealing with arm trouble, and you’re risking injury by leaving him out there
If that is true, why Rauch?
If Gardy cared, truly and only, about making sure the BEST pitcher came out for the 8th, why did he call Rauch? Seriously. He’s a great guy and brings a lot of energy, but he’s a disaster since losing his closer slot. Gardy called Rauch because it was 4-0 and he wants Rauch to work things out before the end of the season. And if that’s the logic, you may as well bring back the starter, who is throwing the best game of his life. I was at the park. It was fantasy. Guys are diving to make great plays. Slowey’s getting K’s to make up for errors (like Casilla’s airmail). He was en fuego — and should have finished the game (admittedly, I wanted a no hitter, too, but I really believe Slowey was the best option at that point in a close game. He was pitching so well).
Gardy wanted to make an unpopular decision to show how “disciplined” he is. It’s just like when he over-manages by bringing in righty/righty; lefty/lefty. At a certain point, a starting pitcher is the better option. Yesterday, it was clear that Slowey was the better choice over Rauch. He was the better choice over just about any guy in the pen — save, perhaps, Crain.
Another fifteen or twenty pitches would not have harmed Slowey.
People are obsessed with hits
Slowey was hit-lucky yesterday. He’d already given up several baserunners. I’ve never understood why 3BB 0H was supposed to be so much better than 0BB 1H.
Obsessed with hits
Historically, throwing a no hitter is a rare feat because it’s very hard to accomplish. I think it’s even harder when you allow a couple of baserunners — walks and errors — because the control is not quite there. But, Slowey deserved a shot at history. Gardy denied him of that. Yes, it’s nice that the organization takes care of his body but he should have had the chance to throw a no-no.
Yes, very rare
It’s only been done 268 times before, roughly as many as hitting for the cycle. You don’t stop at first after a ground-rule double if you’re a single short of the cycle – you do what helps your team win the game, stats be damned.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
That cycle scenario would be sort of awesome
And how about this: the player stops on first (or second or third) to complete the cycle…on a home run! (If you want to add plausibility, you could say the team is way out of contention and hitting for the cycle on that particular day will result in a massive donation to charity by a corporate sponser.) What happens? YOU make the call!
Who was the basketball player about 8 years ago
who went to the opponent’s basket and threw one off the rim to get the rebound and record a triple double?
Maybe, maybe not. You don't know.
And with his control, you don’t know when one was going to be left down the middle. The right move was taking him out of the game. You don’t play for a no-hitter, you play to win the game.
Thanks, Herm!
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
That wouldn't happen
If you send a pitcher with a no-hitter back onto the mound they’re going to try their damndest to get the no-hitter.
So then what?
He’s thrown 106 in seven, if he throws another 16 he’s at 120. Keep him out there in Edwin Jackson territory? This is a guy you have to count on for another nine starts. If he can’t go we’ll see someone like Perkins starting games again.
by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Aug 15, 2010 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
Also, had he not missed his last start due to a sore elbow the decision might have been different. You don’t risk further damage in his first game back by running his pitch count up to 130.
by NYCisTwinsTerritory on Aug 15, 2010 6:18 PM EDT reply actions
I think you have to send him out there until he gives up a hit
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
oops, hit return.
For me it was about Slowey’s elbow. It had been sore, and the guy just missed his last start. If we’re dealing with a pitcher with no injury concerns, then yes…send him back out there. But this wasn’t the case here. It pays to be careful in these situations, because if the worst happens not only is Slowey’s career given a massive hiccup but the Twins would need to find another starting pitcher.
And on top of that, considering the way he was throwing (especially in the seventh), the no-hitter was a long shot anyway. And I’d rather have a higher possibility of a win than risk it for a no-hitter.
That's exactly right...
It’s Slowey’s elbow. Had we not just had him taking extra rest to help cope with persistent pain, I’d say sure, but… We just did. No way do you want him pitching, especially not after the 7th, where he was pretty lucky to get out in one piece.
Go Twins!
+1
My thoughts exactly.
so you can run and tell that, run and tell that, run and tell that
homeboy, home, home, homeboy
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Aug 15, 2010 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Gleeman convinced me
He was never going to finish anyway, so why risk further injury for an eight-inning no hitter?
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
Great quote from Slowey
More than anything I was encouraged. I was encouraged by the way it was presented to me, I was encouraged by the fact that Gardy and Andy care a whole lot more about me as a person and as a pitcher in the long term than they do about winning one game, or having one accomplishment. I think that says a lot about them, and it says a lot about our organization.
Correct decision
It seems pretty clear cut to me. A no-hitter is not important from the team perspective- keeping Slowey healthy is. It’s not just that he’d thrown a lot of pitches, but also his command was off most of the night and he labored at times. The move makes sense from Slowey’s perspective as well, since I’m sure he’d rather pitch 10 more years than have one really notable regular season game.
Untrue
This is untrue. A no-hitter is great from a team perspective. Guys are diving all over the place to make great plays and give Slowey his shot at the no-no. You take him out and what’s that say to Repko in left after making that great catch to keep the no hitter alive? What’s it say to Valencia and Hudson, who both made great stops to keep the no hitter alive? It says, “we don’t care about no hitters.”
That’s a bad message. Gardy — and Slowey — will look back at this and regret it.
Doubtful.
What’s most important, that people seem to be greatly overlooking here, is that Slowey stays healthy and continues to be able to pitch well for the team. He was pulled with 106 pitches thrown. Getting that no-hitter (and note: just because he would be left in doesn’t mean he’d get it) with what-130 pitches?-and then being unable to pitch for his next start (or two…) because his arm hurts isn’t worth the risk. Let’s not forget he had JUST missed a start because of soreness. Gardy absolutely made the right decision with the potential risks.
"All I want to do is beat the hair mannequin [Anthony LaPanta] this year"-Souhan
Eh?
I really don’t think that can be right. You make a great play and that is great for you and for the team. These guys, I’m sure, love no-hitters, but they are professional athletes. These are their careers. They aren’t going to quit baseball or let up next time because no one “cares” about their great defensive plays. I imagine their livelihood is just as important as Slowey’s no-no.
Span
Really? Span ran over to Repko to high-five him after his great catch in left without regard to the no-no that Repko just protected? Come on. He ran over because he understood the significance. A no-hitter usually happens, in part, because everyone comes together at the same time to focus on the one goal of keeping the other team off the bases. And the Twins did that yesterday — until Rauch’s whiplash started.
ugh
My life's goal: to force fischean itno using her moderator powers
by montanatwinsfan on Aug 16, 2010 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
That about sums it up.
"All I want to do is beat the hair mannequin [Anthony LaPanta] this year"-Souhan
So what?
Of course that catch meant a lot. It was a great play. But Span’s hi-five means nothing in the context of winning the game. Nobody stops trying just because the no-hitter is done.
The game was 1-0 at that point
Making a great catch preserves the lead.
Sure...
Because Repko was totally going to let that ball go if Slowey had happened to give up a hit before then. You know, once the pitcher gives up a hit, why should they even try at all in the field? It’s not like there’s anything to play for at that point.
"There are only two things that are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
by BeefMaster on Aug 16, 2010 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
+1
What, suddenly Repko is gonna say “NO WAY I WOULDN’T HAVE TRIED SO HARD IF IT WASN’T FOR THE NO-HITTER NOW I’M NOT GOING TO TRY”?
Repko actually did say that after Rauch lost the no hitter
At the same instant, Joe Mauer was quoted as saying “I only care about individual honors. How many times do I have to tell you guys that?”
so you can run and tell that, run and tell that, run and tell that
homeboy, home, home, homeboy
by what_would_gil_thorp_do on Aug 16, 2010 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions
What's it say to Repko?
Nothing, except the manager is doing what he thinks is right. It says nothing about Repko’s catch. It doesn’t say anything to Valencia or Hudson, either. Their great plays are not diminished by removing Slowey.
And no, Gardy nor Slowey will regret this. The only way they could have regretted anything is if Gardy leaves Slowey in and A) Slowey blows the lead or B) he hurts himself.
HOW SWEEP IT IS!
Three games up after the Tigs took the series from the WSux and a good chance to bury them a little deeper coming up!
Good call by Gardy pulling Slowey. You KNOW if Slowey had given up a run or threw out his arm the Gardy haters here would be complaining, “He left Slowey in too long!”
"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
"I CAN SURE KILLEBREW, BUT I PREFER SODA POP" -WordUpThome
by less cowbell, more 'neau on Aug 15, 2010 6:50 PM EDT reply actions
What a joke
as soon as that bullpen door opened I let Gardy hear it.
What a crappy decision to have to make.
I like how Gardy phrased it that “I’d be booing me too”.
If it weren’t for the injury I’m sure he at least gives him a shot at it. Now if he had gone 8 innings in 104 pitches. Then I think injury or no Gardy would have at least given him the shot to have a quick 9th inning.
Peyton's good but have you ever heard of Jeff George?
Pull 'em
Not worth the risk to the pitcher and the team.
The beard abides.
by Jason Kubel's Beard on Aug 15, 2010 7:47 PM EDT reply actions
I was at the game.
Really with they would have kept him in, but it was the right decision in the end.
I originally voted for "shoulda left him in"
But now that the game has settled in, I’ve changed my mind. Better to be safe than sorry, as Slowey’s health and performance will be very important for the rest of the season. If he had stayed and lost/hurt himself, we’d all be fuming at Gardy for that. I say also because it was only because of the recent injury, as Gardy made clear with his quotes. Can’t hate him for it…maybe we’ll get a no-no some other time. I still remember Baker’s effort a couple years ago.
And besides, we swept a team with solid pitching, are three games up, and have a chance to put the Sox in their place once again and stay on pace for even more, such as having a better record than Texas and (maybe!) New York. Enjoy everybody!
by MarshalltheIrish on Aug 15, 2010 8:08 PM EDT reply actions
I bashed him when he was going bad
To his credit, he made the adjustment and started trusting his stuff more, especially the offspead stuff.
"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot
I am wondering
if the increase in off speed stuff lead to the elbow issues.
by guinness junky on Aug 16, 2010 12:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Nice recap, Jesse.
I especially like what you said about Casilla. You can only really speculate on his mental scheme, but it seems to me like he’s often trying to make it look like MLB comes really easy to him. Like inappropriately nonchalant sometimes. But I agree that he’s shown off a lot of talent this season.
I’m on Gardy’s side re: Slowey. Really, it’s sort of fascinating that baseball fans expect managers to take no-hitters into consideration. It’s like a manager’s job is to maximize (1) wins, except to the extent that interfers with maximizing (2) no-hitters. I mean, if Slowey had allowed a single meaningless hit at that point, it would have been crazy to NOT pull him.
I've got respect
for Gardy today, doing it then explaining it like that. And even more for Slowey who took the decision personally, in a good way.
This is
THis is one of those times when you have to cede judgment to the guy close to the situation, which was Gardy and Anderson. It’s a very very hard call to have to make, but after Slowey’s elbow trouble, it’s probably the right one. If and when Slowey pitches well down the stretch and the Twins win the division, we’ll see why it was done when Slowey takes the hill in the playoffs.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane
Slowey is pitching in the playoffs?
That’s something to ponder. Do they stay with Slowey and move Duensing back to the bullpen or do they start Duensing, who has been terrific in the rotation.
of course they use slowey
he has more experience than duensing. and besides they’ll need a reliable lefty out of the bullpen.
by gardy's dog house on Aug 15, 2010 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I doubt it's that simple
If they’re playing the Yankees they should go with Duensing – LH platoon advantage and Slowey’s stuff doesn’t match up as well with Yankee hitters.
I'm no fan of Ron Gardenhire
But he handled this well. He made the tough (and correct) decision, took responsibility for it, and presented it to Slowey in a way that had him feeling valued.
As I said in the game thread, if it weren’t for the elbow concerns, I think it’s a different call.
Combined no-hitters are cool too
Shoulda gone with Crain instead of Rauch.
My issue with this is -
Just how likely is it that Slowey is going to get into dangerous fatigue territory without giving up a hit? It’s hard to tell, given the way the seventh inning went, how well he would be able to go out there and throw strikes. But if he can, It seems reasonable to let him. If he’s losing it, he’s going to put a pitch somewhere bad and give up a hit and be done before he’s in any danger the vast majority of the time. There’s a question of just how certain that is, and the indifference point is obviously very high, but at this point it seems pretty clear that nobody’s going to remember Kevin Slowey for much otherwise, so I think there’s a reasonable argument that it’s better for him long term to have the shot at the no-hitter.
They're hoping he'll be remembered for his role on a world series champion
Plus he’ll make a lot more money from staying healthy than from pitching a no hitter. Risking his health is just a bad idea all around.
How many walks do you let him allow in the 8th?
You might still have to pull him during a no-hitter while jeopardizing the game in the process.
Good Job Gardy...
This was the right move. If and only if Slowey would have pitched last week and not missed any time with “elbow soreness” should you let him pitch until he gives up a hit or not. Once again….Good call Ron Gardenhire.
"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have"
Thomas Jefferson
by RileysCannibalJct on Aug 16, 2010 12:09 AM EDT reply actions
Why not
Leave it up to Slowey if he wants to come out or not? Would he come out of his no-hit bid? Hell no! He would say give me the ball! Tough decision.
I am super stoked that the twins are going to have nice day off before a three game set with the sox at home with the advantage of a three game lead.
This is great.
Quite often, players don't do/know what is good for them.
Of course this is true of managers and coaches too, mind you, but there is so much pressure to play and perform that players often make sub-conscious decisions to be tough or to be a team player, etc…
A rough analogy from a personal experience when I was laid out cold by one of my own defenseman in High School hockey practice. I ‘woke up’ to find everyone standing over at me staring at me. I was certain I was fine right up to the point of trying to stand up and skate away. I fell twice before I let my coaches/teammates drag me to the bench. Instead of telling me to take my equipment off, the coaches let me decide if i wanted to come back out … for practice.
I had seen stars, was unconscious for at least several seconds and couldn’t even stand up for a half minute after that. But ten minutes later, while sitiing on the bench watching my teammates practice, I went back out there and finished.
The coaches should never have let me finish. I applaud Ron Gardenhire for accepting responsibility for the unpopular decision. While not exactly analogous to a head injury, it was a wise decision for Slowey’s own good and for the good of the team.
My life's goal: to force fischean itno using her moderator powers
by montanatwinsfan on Aug 16, 2010 12:15 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
A different approach
I think Gardy could have sent him back out up 4-0, and here is how: he could tell him: throws noting but fastballs down the middle. If someone gets a hit, I’m pulling you out. But there is a good chance you will get several outs, and so I’m giving you a chance for the no-no. At most, he will pitch 9 easy pitches each inning; 124 max.
Think about it…in the HR derby, with meatballs coming in, there are a ton of “outs” hit. In Target field, there are are few HRs, so Slowey might have gotten a handful of easy flies.
The elbow thing is the reason not to do this, but in general, the reliance on 100 pitches is misplaced. The danger is a pitcher getting tired, and changing his mechanics, not just pitching too many pitches.
by AM. on Aug 16, 2010 4:21 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Ummm
He’s not going to throw nothing but fastballs down the middle. If you have a shot at a no-hitter you’re going to try to get it. Besides, Rauch came in and didn’t HAVE to throw fastballs down the middle (he did anyway) and it all fell apart. If your plan is to “throw nothing but fastballs down the middle” you aren’t pursuing a no-hitter and you might as well give a reliever a chance to go down in history along with the starting pitcher.
Plus, you play to win.
You don’t play to no-hit somebody. If you’re throwing fastballs down the middle, you’re inviting trouble.
Notice that Oakland got 1-hit last night
They were not playing an offensive juggernaut. I’m saying this for perspective, not to diminish anybody’s accomplishments.
by Alexi Casilla All-Star on Aug 17, 2010 9:10 AM EDT reply actions
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