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Around SBN: An Explanation For Some Of The Perplexing HOF Snubs

Twins 10, Royals 3: Offense Pounds Early and Often

Last time out, Francisco Liriano pitched seven scoreless innings but ended up with a no decision when the Texas Rangers later tied the game at 1-1. Last night at Target Field, run support was not a problem as the Twins pounded Royals pitching for a 6-run third inning and nine early runs on the way to a 10-3 victory. With the win, the Twins move to 82-57, and since the Chicago White Sox finally lost (9-1 to Justin Verlander and the Tigers), the division lead now sits at 4.5 games with 23 games remaining in the 2010 season. Good times all around, and the Twins have a chance to sweep the three game series as Brian Duensing faces Zack Greinke tonight.

The Twins opened the scoring in the bottom of the second with a Jim Thome walk, Delmon Young double off the wall in right center, and sacrifice fly from J.J. Hardy to put the Twins up 1-0. The Twins would build on this lead in the third, Denard Span led off with a sharp grounder that caught Royals first baseman Billy Butler with a high hop off his thumb, knocking Butler out of the game. After outs by Orlando Hudson and Joe Mauer, it didn't look like the start of a big inning. But Jason Kubel started the rally with a grounder up the middle to score Span and put the Twins up 2-0. And a single, walk, single, single and Matt Tolbert triple off the wall later and the Twins were up 7-0. 

This was all Liriano would need, as he was in command all night. Josh Fields was able to hit a home run just over the fence in left in the fourth inning, only the fourth home run allowed by Liriano all year. And a wild pitch in the fifth would score another Royals run, but that's all they would get, as Liriano threw 95 pitches over seven innings, with 11 ground ball outs against 5 fly balls and 4 strikeouts against zero walks.

Studs, duds and a few notes after the jump:

Star-divide

Studs

  1. Delmon Young: 3-4, R, 4 RBI, 2 2B. Delmon smashed the ball all over the field last night. Hopefully this is the start of another hot streak.
  2. Francisco Liriano: 7 IP, 7 H, 2 ER, 0 BB, 4 SO. An efficient seven innings, Liriano wasn't quite as sharp as last time out against the Rangers. But he was plenty good for his 13th win.
  3. Jim Thome: 1-1, 3 R, RBI, HR, 2 BB. This is turning into the norm for Thome, two walks and another long home run crushed to right field, almost the same place as the night before.
  4. J.J. Hardy: 1-3, 3 RBI. Hardy continues to produce runs at the bottom of the order.

Duds

I'm going to go with no duds last night. Every starter had at least one hit, and there were no pitching implosions.

Notes

  • Ben Revere made his Major League debut last night, replacing Denard Span in the 7th. He was a bit impatient at the plate, striking out on a slider out of the zone, but he should get plenty of opportunities as a pinch runner and defensive replacement down the stretch.
  • Pat Neshek returned from Rochester and pitched the ninth. He wasn't sharp, giving up two walks and a hit, but he got out with only one run allowed, perfectly fine when you come into an 8-run ball game.
  • With the home run, Thome has now tied Frank Robinson with 586 career home runs. He now has 22 home runs and 52 RBI in only 241 at bats this season. Put me squarely in the "sign him to an extension, one year plus a team option" camp.
  • Delmon Young drove in four more runs and now has 97 RBI on the season. He could hit the century mark as early as tonight if he can get to Greinke.

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One reason I don't want to get rid of Delmon Young:

he drives in runs.

Also…if people would like to be on base for Thome when he hits these home runs, that would be great. How many of his homers have been solo shots this season?

by Jesse on Sep 8, 2010 7:50 AM EDT reply actions  

13

13 of his 22 are solo
6 are 2 runs shots
3 are 3 run shots
no grand slams

by DedicatedFollowerOfFashion on Sep 8, 2010 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

+1

If we had a clear upgrade at the corner outfield spots, I’d be willing to trade him. But I suspect his offensive improvement this season is only the start. He’ll always be poor in the outfield, but this year his offense is finally giving him value. I still wish we’d move Delmon back to right field, but that will never happen while Cuddyer is still here.

by Adam Peterson on Sep 8, 2010 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Perhaps

A lot may happen before 2012. Will Benson and/or Revere be ready to contribute at the Major League level? I sure hope so, but no guarantees. How close will Morales and Hicks be?

I’d love to see a great defender like Franklin Gutierrez out there, but if I were Seattle I wouldn’t trade him straight up for Delmon.

by Adam Peterson on Sep 8, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wouldn't either

Gutierrez is a 2.5 WAR player this season according to Fangraphs. Obviously that is nothing compared to the 6 WAR of last year, but his fielding is only 8 instead of 31 runs and his batting is down. Still, I wouldn’t do that trade if I was the Mariners.
They really seem to value pitching and defense up there.

by twinscrazy_german on Sep 8, 2010 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed

Losing Delmon would leave a pretty big hole and the only way to fill that would be a trade for a guy who’s better. I don’t think there is anyone out there that fits that.

Baseball reminds us of all that once was good, and that could be again.-Terence Mann/James Earl Jones in FoD

by Twins33 on Sep 8, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

i love

Looking at the standings and seeing a 4.

by clutterheart on Sep 8, 2010 9:07 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Three game series

It’s kind of like a five run lead. Nice to be outside of where a three game sweep could swing the division lead.

by Adam Peterson on Sep 8, 2010 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

RBI's

Delmon has been extremely valuable this year when he’s been “on”. No doubt about that.

However, I wouldn’t use RBI’s as the proof. RBI’’s depend too heavily on how many good hitters are ahead of you in the lineup. Remember earlier this year when many felt Delmon should be higher in the lineup? The fact that he stayed down fairly low has kept that many more good hitters in front of him, thereby helping out his RBI number. RBI’s are not without value, but it’s like W/L for a pitcher. There is a large factor the hitter does not control.

by Pesky on Sep 8, 2010 9:40 AM EDT reply actions  

Case In Point

2 of Young’s hits and all 4 of his RBI’s came with the bases loaded – granted, he still has to go out there and put the bat solidly on the ball, but he was actually getting pitches to hit thanks to those bases being juiced. Getting to go up after a greatly feared smasher will do that for you, especially when that smasher can take a walk with the best of ’em.

"...and we'll see ya tomorrow night!" - Jack Buck, Game 6, 1991 World Series

by WindyCityTwinsFan on Sep 8, 2010 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Consistency

His approach will not lend itself to any consistency at all. When he’s seeing the ball well, he’s hitting the ball well. Otherwise, he’s almost an automatic out on one pitch every at bat.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Sep 8, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

It's not unusual to have inconsistent hitters

While Delmon is particularly extreme, not everyone can be Joe Mauer. I look at the overall numbers. If he manages a .300+ average and drives in 100+ runs while slugging around .500, I’m fine with it. Doesn’t mean I’m going to run out there and give him a 5 year extension, but I’m ecstatic to finally see some of the Delmon we’ve all been waiting for.

by Adam Peterson on Sep 8, 2010 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

Your data on Delmon is only comprised of this year though

And so far this year, Delmon is hitting .367 with runners in scoring position and .391 with the bases juiced over a grand total of 147 ABs (23 of which were with the bases loaded).

In other words, luck has certainly played a role for Delmon, who is hitting .303 overall. That doesn’t account for all his RBIs or anything, but like virtually all small sample size “clutch” performances, I wouldn’t expect him to continue to hit that well with runners in scoring position.

by WolvesFan03 on Sep 8, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree, sample size and luck is an issue

and I would expect his batting average with RISP to regress to around his overall average. So my guess would be 10-15 of his RBI so far are a result of the high AVG w/ RISP. But this team needs a right handed slugger behind Mauer, Morneau, Kubel and Thome.

by Adam Peterson on Sep 8, 2010 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

Neshek topped out

at 82 mph last night. His “velo” is way down.

Perkins OTOH, was hitting 92 and busting RH hitters inside.

by Old Twins Cap on Sep 8, 2010 10:09 AM EDT reply actions  

Perkins looked very good

Perhaps he has a future in the bullpen. More likely he’s making a case as a trade for a fringe prospect during the offseason.

I like Neshek, but he looks done. He was successful because of a low-90s fastball coming from a weird angle, plus a good breaking pitch. Without the good fastball he doesn’t have enough.

Maybe he regains it during the offseason, but right now he looks like a candidate to make room for some of the other minor leaguers on the 40-man.

by Adam Peterson on Sep 8, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

He doesn't look good

Two things he had when he was going good: Pinpoint control and a 92 MPH fastball. He has neither. I worry about his future.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Sep 8, 2010 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed, and too bad. I like Neshek a lot.

"'Over'? Did you say 'over'? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell, no!"

by rubberbiscuit on Sep 8, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Goodness gracious,

while I agree with nearly everything said above about Neshek (and frankly consider his performance last night dud-worthy), let’s not write his obit yet. It took Liriano a couple of years to rebound after his TJ surgery.

My life's goal: to force fischean itno using her moderator powers or, at the very least, using her witch magic to impoove my spelling.

by montanatwinsfan on Sep 8, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Liriano had his velocity within 4 MPH of his original velocity, at least

Neshek has lost a lot, and he didn’t have that much to begin with. I think it’s legitimately worrying.

by Hillstop on Sep 8, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Neshek's delivery is unique

I wouldn’t compare him to another pitcher who had TJ surgery. His delivery puts a lot more pressure on his elbow than just about any pitcher I have seen. Based on that, it might take longer for him to get back to his old self. He might not ever get there. One thing seems clear: He’s not there yet.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Sep 8, 2010 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Biggest problem was his location

If he puts that stuff on the corners he can be effective.

by DJL44 on Sep 8, 2010 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think it was 86 and maybe even 88 from Neshek

…and I though Bremer compared that to his old low 90’s speed.

His speed is down for sure, but if he can find the plate more consistently I hope he gets in some more September games. His jerky motion can fool a lot of batters, and I trust him a lot more than Perkins, Flores, or some of the others in the pen.

by Buddy Grant on Sep 8, 2010 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

According to Gameday data, he topped out at 86 last night.

On a somewhat sad note, gameday classified all of his ‘fastballs’ as changeups. Oh, the irony.

by Twins4Life on Sep 8, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was looking at PitchFX data from a Brewers game that I watched

because a position player pitched a (perfect!) inning in it. All of the pitches were 50 mph lobs that barely got within 5 feet of the batter, but PitchFX classified them all as knuckleballs.

by Hillstop on Sep 8, 2010 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

My favorite stat of the night:

Young: 4 RBI’s with 2 outs. Nice to see him warming up a bit!

I always loved that one.

by FoulJack on Sep 8, 2010 10:47 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

He would have had 6 rbis

but Thome was on base ahead of him and jogged to third on both of Delmon’s doubles.

by Old Twins Cap on Sep 8, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ben Revere

Put your hat on straight!

by DJL44 on Sep 8, 2010 11:21 AM EDT reply actions  

So kind of an off topic question

but what is our relationship with SSS? I ask because I went and read their game thread from last night and it, to an extent, humanised them. For example, they seem to hate Hawk Harrelson too.

42

by Armaskarhu on Sep 8, 2010 11:45 AM EDT reply actions  

I am not certain what Mr. belushi is trying to assert with the drunken rail walker analogy below, but some questions are better left unanswered.

Why will rabbits eat their own poop when fresh grass is available?
If Ozzie Guillen bitches about one of his own players and reporters aren’t there to hear it, does Ozzie make any sense?
Why do sheep look so attractive in bikinis?
There are some questions in this life that just aren’t answerable.

My life's goal: to force fischean itno using her moderator powers or, at the very least, using her witch magic to impoove my spelling.

by montanatwinsfan on Sep 8, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

You asked for it

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Sep 8, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think they hate Hawk.

But if a TWINS fan were to go over there and hate Hawk, they will jump to Hawk’s defense every time.

by Twins4Life on Sep 8, 2010 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Imagine a drunk crossing the Amazon on a thin rail. The river is, of course, filled with piranha.

I don’t think he’ll make it.

Hating Hawk is a common factor in much of the western world…

"'Over'? Did you say 'over'? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell, no!"

by rubberbiscuit on Sep 8, 2010 12:45 PM EDT reply actions  

Twins magic number

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett

by less cowbell, more 'neau on Sep 8, 2010 2:56 PM EDT reply actions  

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