Should the Twins go after Jamie Shields

by Jessy S on Oct 25, 2011 7:09 PM EDT

I ask the above question because Jamie Shields could be a possible piece of trade bait by the Tampa Bay Rays. I a article posted by D Rays Bay, the Rays actually discuss trading him to the Miami Marlins for Logan Morrison. Now that is a trade would be rejected because the Marlins are moving into a new ballpark, and they have their own pitchers in the minors. This is despite Logan's twitter happy ways. After the Jump, what it could take for the Twins to land Shields.

The above link is included because it includes info on Shields trade value. But the gist of it is that Shields is under contract for three more years at a total of $28 million. With that said, his value should be about $30 million total. We also have BJ Upton who is available for trade and could get shipped out in one massive three or four team deal. I am not saying that the Twins will land Upton though he could be included.

Now here are the players I could give up if I were to do this trade: Keep in mind that the Twins will likely have to send only three players to complete the trade. Keep in mind that the Rays are going to want a power bat, but might not get it from the Twins.

Trevor Plouffe: Despite showing power, he has been in Gardy's doghouse and could be a good offensive outfielder for the Rays.
Kevin Slowey: Another one of the players in Gardy's doghouse, he could project to be a cheap 5th starter.
Danny Valencia: Another player that reportedly entered Gardy's doghouse due to errors committed on the field. However, it would be nuts for the Twins to trade him because the manager hates some of his play.
Jim Hoey: He would be an afterthought in this trade, but somebody is looking for bullpen help, and there is a chance that the Twins might be able to unload him.
Joe Benson: Yes he could figure into our plans if the Twins don't resign Michael Cuddyer and Jason Kubel, but he is almost major league ready. Also, the Twins will likely be going after a veteran major league outfielder anyway as the Twins prefer that Benson and Chris Parmelee stay down in Triple A.
Oswaldo Arcia: Twins don't like his high number of strikeouts in the minors, but could project to be a steal for another team.
Brian Dozier or Alexi Casilla: Either could project to be a fine trade pick, but Dozier could project to be a good player for Rochester so he likely stays.

For the record, I am not thinking about trading all the above players for one person. This is just a list of people that the Twins could trade in the off-season. Adding Shields does help our rotation, and the starting pitching market is looking somewhat bare. The trick for Minnesota is to make sure that we are not hosed in any deal.

Poll

Do you think James Shields would be a good addition to the Twins?

Yes

52 votes

Maybe, but let's keep Danny Valencia and Joe Benson

60 votes

No, Jessy S. is a Looney Toon for thinking we need him.

21 votes

133 votes | Poll has closed

Tweet Comment 33 comments | 0 recs |

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Comments

Allow my ignorance to intervein

But I stopped immediately when I saw “I am not saying that the Twins will land Upton though he could be included” My vision went hazy and then a video clip montage of Elmon started playing in my head, and then the haze turned into red and the idea of another Tampa Bay outfielder caused my head to explode!

JIM JAMS BUSINESS IS MASHING TATERS, AND BUSINESS IS GOOD!!!

by MashinTaters on Oct 25, 2011 8:04 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs

I should clearify one thing

Upton would be included in the overall trade, but he wouldn’t be headed to the Twins.

I'm a proud fan of the Minnesota Twins and Dallas Cowboys!
"Life is precious and time is a key element. Let’s make every moment count and help those who have a greater need than our own." – Harmon Killebrew
Champagne SuperTolbert Saves the day!!!

by Jessy S on Oct 25, 2011 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions

"Go after Jamie Shields"

Like Coco Crisp did?

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
"Millar nice shirt lol my god awesome lol only u can do that lol" -Ozzie Guillen

by less cowbell, more 'neau on Oct 25, 2011 9:19 PM EDT reply actions

They fight like baby rabbits.

by Jesse on Oct 25, 2011 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions

Fun story

I went to a game in Oakland this year and randomly stood next to Coco Crisp’s wife while in line for a beer and we got to chatting. Among other tidbits, she told me the Rays are the only team she really dislikes and the only team she doesn’t want him traded to because of that fight.

by ColossusOfRhode on Oct 25, 2011 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions

N-O-P-E

the time to do that was LAST off-season

NOT this off-season.

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 26, 2011 5:05 AM EDT reply actions

We need a pitcher

And Shields seems to be a good choice.

by Jessy S on Oct 26, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions

I think his point was the cost.

Shields could have been relatively cheap and was a good trade target, since his peripherals were good, but his overall numbers weren’t. After this season, his value is sky high and will cost a bundle.

by Caleb A on Oct 26, 2011 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions

Exactly you don't go after guys right after they have their career year...thats just asking for it. (ugly way)

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 27, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions

Yeah i agree we need 1 pitcher

But Shields is not the answer judging by what they got for Garza it’d cost us 4-5 young players or prospects, and Shields is primed to fail next year, or at least pitch much more to his actual median.

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 27, 2011 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions

Twins don't need a #1

They need a couple #2-3 guys, better defense up the middle, a bullpen, and some guys who can hit.

by spanspanspan on Oct 28, 2011 5:27 AM EDT up reply actions

So, basically...

They need a whole new team. I can’t really argue with that.

by ColossusOfRhode on Oct 28, 2011 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions

Maybe we can have all the Rangers.

by spanspanspan on Oct 28, 2011 6:50 PM EDT up reply actions

Sounds like a plan

But let’s keep Mauer and Morneau for nostalgia’s sake.

by ColossusOfRhode on Oct 28, 2011 7:51 PM EDT up reply actions

That bunch of losers?

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
"Millar nice shirt lol my god awesome lol only u can do that lol" -Ozzie Guillen

by less cowbell, more 'neau on Oct 29, 2011 8:36 AM EDT up reply actions

Losing world series again

= reduced trade value.

by spanspanspan on Oct 29, 2011 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions

i didn't say thay needed a #1 ace, they need 1 SP and that is all they need

Balckburn and Duensing in the bullpen i could see something like this:

1. Baker
2. Liriano (plz ohh god)
3. Buerhle / Marcum / Wolf / someone else?
4. Pavano
5. Hendriks
-—
insurance ; Diamond, Bromberg, Gibson hopefully in September….

Bullpen:

Nathan. Perkins, Wuertz, Duensing, Oliveros, Gutierrez/Waldrop/Slama, Blackburn / or slowey

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 29, 2011 7:42 AM EDT up reply actions

Sorry, I misinterpreted what you meant.

I think the Twins need 2 pitchers, both middle of the rotation guys.

Rotation for 2012 would be Baker/Pavano/Someone/Someone/Liriano. I like Hendriks, but I don’t know if he’s quite ready so I’d put him in your Insurance category.

Bullpen… I have a feeling we won’t get Nathan back. So try Perkins as the closer. Duensing and Swarzak as the long relievers. And some mix of others.

I’d have Blackburn and Slowey in every trade negotiation if possible.

by spanspanspan on Oct 29, 2011 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions

Good grief

Ploufe, Hoey, Slowey, Dozier, Casilla and Valencia have zero trade value. Actually, they have negative trade value.

Benson and Arcia have some trade value, I suppose, but not that much. With both you really have to hope that they learn to hit breaking balls. Shields is worth far more than them.

by Gunnarthor on Oct 26, 2011 4:35 PM EDT reply actions

I love how people think they understand trade value

Do us a favor. Admit you have no idea what a players’ trade value is. Nobody really does. But a 26-year-old infielder who led the organization in home runs has some trade value. Same with a 27 year-old player who led the team is RBI, and has the second highest OPS on the team since June of 2010 of any player with more than 700 plate appearances. And the top infield prospect in the system above rookie ball is worth something on the trade market.

I find trade speculation interesting to a point. That point is when people start pontificating that Player A is worth X or Player B is worthless.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2011 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions

Wow

Plouffe might have been the worst defensive player in baseball last year. He’s never been a highly regarded prospect and, while he has some pop, he had his breakout season at age 25 after three years at AAA. He managed a -1.5 bWAR if you care.

Valencia is slightly better than a replacement level player. He’ll be 27 next year, is a bad fielder but has some pop and is durable. “the second highest OPS on the team since June of 2010 of any player with more than 700 plate appearances.”??? Way to manipulate statistics to the point of absurdity. He managed a -1.1 bWAR if you care.

Dozier might be our top statistical middle infielder but Klaw and said his ceiling is still utility infielder and even John Sickels, who likes him, admits that many in the scouting community still have their doubts about him. He was 24 and at AA.

None of these guys are worth anything to other teams.

by Gunnarthor on Oct 27, 2011 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions

Thank you, oh great wise one, for sharing your wisdom

I’m not saying their trade value is huge. But it is not negative.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 27, 2011 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions

Whatever big guy

You think guys like Plouffe and Valencia have trade value, that’s your opinion. But when you have to resort to BS like “the second highest OPS on the team since June of 2010 of any player with more than 700 plate appearances,” you probably shouldn’t act like it’s your time of the month when people point out the problems with your ‘logic.’

Since I don’t want to turn this into a flamewar, have a nice Halloween.

by Gunnarthor on Oct 28, 2011 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions

He's right

Valencia can’t possibly have negative trade value. He is a serf level player (salary wise) that can handle himself at 3b at a near average level. That has positive value. He’s not gonna net you something huge, but you won’t have to send money to dump him (Brendon Harris).

by archie2227 on Oct 28, 2011 1:30 AM EDT up reply actions

Happy Halloween!

Here’s a pet peeve: Assuming that GMs use the same metrics you care about to evaluate players’ trade value. Most GMs don’t look at things like UZR, VORP or WAR. They look at more traditional metrics plus age, contract status, and upside.

Should they care about UZR, WAR and VORP? Yes. But most don’t. And even those who do look as much at upside and total cost as numbers. They’re looking for deals. Plouffe would be a good deal right now because he has upside and his value is deflated by all the errors. If you send a fringe reliever, you hope you get a guy who can hit enough to play third, and you work with him on his throws. If he cleans that up, you’ve got a cheap average third baseman for five years.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Oct 31, 2011 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions

The Ed Wade anatomy of a trade article was interesting

Every organization ranks all the prospects in baseball for upside potential. They have value charts for each player and each prospect and match them up. Some teams obviously do this better than others.

by DJL44 on Nov 1, 2011 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions

certainly the notion that Slowey has negative value is absurd

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 27, 2011 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions

Actually, the opposite

Instead of Jamie Shields, the Twins should go after Logan Morrison. Liriano for Morrison and Brad Hand?

by sonofsal on Oct 27, 2011 12:02 AM EDT reply actions

I'd do that in a second, Ozzie might just might too

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 27, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions

I voted for Jessy S is a Looney Toon

But him wanting Jamie Shields isn’t why I think that

Mikael Granlund: The Great Hope

by NorthernStar on Oct 27, 2011 12:53 AM EDT reply actions 5 recs

I don't see it...

There isn’t enough talent on this list where I move Shields if I am Tampa… if a 3rd team is involved then they get shafted.

by Al Damlo on Oct 27, 2011 11:29 AM EDT reply actions

I too want Shields badly

But there is just no way this particular trade would happen. I’d rather take my chances just signing a free agent, perhaps Edwin Jackson. I’ve also considered the value of trading a package headed by Slowey, although I don’t know exactly who we’d get.

And seriously, why would the Rays be even remotely interested in Hoey?

When I was a kid, I would cover a blue futon with a white blanket, prop it up with a fan set on high, and pretend it was the Metrodome. That should tell you a lot.

by MarshalltheIrish on Oct 27, 2011 1:45 PM EDT reply actions