Jorge Posada Out of New York: Would You Want Him As A Twin?

by Jesse on Nov 10, 2011 10:37 PM EST in By the Numbers

NEW YORK, NY - OCTOBER 01: Jorge Posada #20 of the New York Yankees hits a single in the second inning against the Detroit Tigers during Game One of the American League Division Series at Yankee Stadium on October 1, 2011 in New York City. (Photo by Chris Trotman/Getty Images)

Jorge Posada had a rough year. He was one of the members of the Yankee Dynasty, but throughout the year it was shown that even the grace bestowed by that fact runs out eventually. New York broke open the season with Posada as their designated hitter, and ended up catching just once all year: for six innings on September 10th.

As designated hitters went, Posada was one of the worst in the American League. Only Adam Dunn had a worse season. Posada obviously felt a little put out when he was ousted as the starting catcher, and according to this it sounds like those feelings haven't changed:

Posada_medium

So why would we want Posada, who turned 40 in August and hit .235/.315/.398 in 2011, to play for the Twins? This is why.

2011 - Jorge Posada	AVG	OBP	SLG
vs LHP (as RHB, 65 AB) vs RHP (as LHB, 279 AB)	.092 .269	.169 .348	.108 .466

2011 - Jorge Posada

AVG

OBP

SLG

vs LHP (as RHB, 65 AB)

vs RHP (as LHB, 279 AB)

.092

.269

.169

.348

.108

.466

Posada's season looked terrible, at least in part, because he was so astonishingly bad versus southpaws in 65 measly at bats. It destroyed his overall triple slash. But looking at his splits versus right-handed pitchers he still looks like a useful bat. Not only that, he could back up at first base and be the team's emergency third catcher.

Let's go back to my Offseason Blueprint for the Twins, where my payroll came in at just over $110 million. Right now I'd make the following alterations.

Instead of signing Roy Oswalt ($11 million per), I'm either tendering Kevin Slowey ($3.5 million) or finding another starter worth $3 to $4 million, and
I'm not offering Jason Kubel arbitration, in case he accepts, and in his place I'm offering Jorge Posada a one-year, $2.5 million deal to be my starting DH versus right-handed pitchers. Jonny Gomes gets first crack at being my DH versus left-handed pitchers.

That saves me $7.5 million on a starter, and just over $4 million by replacing Kubel with Posada.

This team, at just under $100 million, certainly isn't as good as the version with Oswalt and Kubel, but it still wouldn't be a bad side. But what about you? Would you take a chance on Posada?

Poll

Would you sign Jorge Posada to be your DH versus right-handed starters?

Yes - he's capable and the Twins need offense

169 votes

No - he's on his way out...and he was a Yankee

364 votes

533 votes | Poll has closed

Tweet Comment 54 comments | 0 recs |

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Comments

Maybe as a cheap DH

But he wasn’t a particularly good catcher when he was young. Now, he’s a sieve.

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Nov 10, 2011 10:39 PM EST reply actions

He'd be a good back-up catcher, but…

Jorge would want to play every day, which would mean he would have to DH on the days Mauer is catching. He’d also be good insurance if Mauer has another injury- and illness-plagued season. I voted “No” because I don’t think the Twins would be able to give him enough at-bats, and I am under the assumption that Morneau would be the full-time DH next year. Besides, he wouldn’t look right in Twins pinstripes.

by leo3375 on Nov 10, 2011 10:41 PM EST reply actions

He'd be a terrible backup catcher

Even less likely to play than Mauer, not a good enough hitter to DH. He’s done.

by DJL44 on Nov 10, 2011 11:05 PM EST up reply actions

Right

by amiller92 on Nov 11, 2011 9:36 AM EST up reply actions

I'm not in favor of the Twins going after a DH only player

Posada caught 6 innings last year so he won’t be a back up for Mauer. He play 14 games at 1st but the Twins will have Morneau/Mauer/whoever else over there. Unless you can get him on the cheap, no thanks.

"I learned something yesterday. No use in having rules if there's no punishment for breaking them. You'll be fine if you bite down on the trigger. Enjoy your breakfast."

by John_Locke on Nov 10, 2011 10:42 PM EST reply actions

This says it all:

http://twitter.com/LaVelleNeal/status/134758928914456576

Why? To keep their quota of 40-year olds intact? RT @twinsbpcatcher: @LaVelleNeal Any chance the #Twins make an offer to Jorge Posada?
5 hours ago via TweetDeck

by funnytrain on Nov 10, 2011 10:45 PM EST reply actions

I love La Velle,

but the snark doesn’t really answer the question.

by Jesse on Nov 10, 2011 10:46 PM EST up reply actions

It doesn't, but it seems like an indication that the Twins wouldn't do it, at all.

by funnytrain on Nov 11, 2011 2:17 AM EST up reply actions

Call me cynical, but I think we've entered a rebuilding period for the Twins

There’s too much to fix and too small a (projected) payroll to fix it with. I don’t see where signing an aging DH when we’ve got the M&M boys helps with that at all. Plus, I don’t think I could stomach cheering for Posada and his rodent-like visage.

by ColossusOfRhode on Nov 10, 2011 10:59 PM EST reply actions

On the other hand,

if this IS a rebuilding period for the Twins, finding a quasi-productive and inexpensive bat that won’t block anybody…that’s a good thing, right? Posada is a recognizeable name, and he should still be productive in a platoon situation. If he’s just terrible and the Twins decide to let him go, then no harm no foul because we weren’t expecting to compete anyway.

It’s not ideal, and I think there’s risk involved, but I’m not completely opposed to Posada. He’d have to be used properly, caveat caveat caveat…but when you’re trying to fill out a roster on a limited budget with players who should be able to contribute, he’s on that list somewhere even if it’s not at the top.

by Jesse on Nov 10, 2011 11:05 PM EST up reply actions

I don't think he's worth a guaranteed contract right now

I’d rather play Parmelee.

by DJL44 on Nov 10, 2011 11:06 PM EST up reply actions

If that were the choice, I'd agree.

But I’d be surprised if they gave Parm the DH slot out of spring training.

by Jesse on Nov 10, 2011 11:08 PM EST up reply actions

Oh boy

That would be an admission of a bad year upcoming. Parmalee is in Denard Span territory, as in he’s close to becoming a non-prospect unless he suddenly puts all that talent together in the high minors and his production drastically increases.

"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all."
~ Earl Weaver
"In God we trust. All others must provide evidence."
~ Billy Beane

by AdamOnFirst on Nov 10, 2011 11:13 PM EST up reply actions

Playing Posada would be just as desperate

by DJL44 on Nov 10, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions

Right now

Chris Parmelee is my 1st Baseman coming out of Spring Training. Justin Morneau is my DH if he wants it.

BTW, did you take some of my crazy pills Jesse? The closest I want to get to Posada is in the visitor’s dugout when they retire his number at Yankee Stadium and the Twins role in the night is Joe Mauer giving Posada a gift from the Twins.

I'm a proud fan of the Minnesota Twins and Dallas Cowboys!
"Life is precious and time is a key element. Let’s make every moment count and help those who have a greater need than our own." – Harmon Killebrew
Champagne SuperTolbert Saves the day!!!

by Jessy S on Nov 11, 2011 3:39 AM EST up reply actions

I just woke up.

Maybe my coffee isn’t working yet but the last 9 words make me think your crazy pills are safe and sound.

by spanspanspan on Nov 11, 2011 8:27 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs

Jessy being Jessy.

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
#OccupyTwinkieTown

by less cowbell, more 'neau on Nov 11, 2011 8:42 AM EST up reply actions

I just think we have better options at DH

Mainly, I suspect that’s where Morneau winds up next season based on his last concussion.

Plus, did I mention the rodent-like visage? I would feel all kinds of wrong cheering for Posada. (I actually have nothing against the guy personally, but years of living in Boston have me conditioned against him.)

by ColossusOfRhode on Nov 10, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions

I'm new to Boston.

Clearly being from MN hansn’t indoctrinated me strongly enough. With enough time I’m sure Boston will.

by Jesse on Nov 10, 2011 11:25 PM EST up reply actions

If being a Twins fan from MN hasn't indoctrinated hatred of the evil yanqui empire in you by now,

You haven’t been paying attention.

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
#OccupyTwinkieTown

by less cowbell, more 'neau on Nov 10, 2011 11:31 PM EST up reply actions

It's hard to avoid Red Sox Nation when you're living there

Of course, when I first moved there they were still the lovable underdogs that hadn’t won a championship in 80+ years and Red Sox fans as a whole were less annoying. But the Yankees were even more hated then, especially after 2003. The whole Red Sox/Yankee rivalry is much more subdued now.

by ColossusOfRhode on Nov 10, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions

When the Twins come to town

Be sure to get a seat at Fenway, and mention both England and Twinkie Town on your Circle Me Bert Sign.

by Jessy S on Nov 11, 2011 3:41 AM EST up reply actions

I did actually get to a game late in the year.

It was the last Boston vs Tampa series, and I got to see the one game where the Sox actually won. Really great seats down the right field line.

by Jesse on Nov 11, 2011 9:39 AM EST up reply actions

Yes, we are in a rebuilding year.

Had everyone been health last year we had a chance. Now its time to bring in a couple of Vets at SS, Catcher and DH on the cheep. Revere, Benson, Parmelee, Valencia, Plouffe, Hendricks, Oliveros, Gut, Gibson and Dozier all need to get to their chance now.

by b1 on Nov 11, 2011 8:22 AM EST up reply actions

No, we are not in a rebuilding year.

Ryan also made sure to point out the Twins plan on getting back to their winning ways next season, and that he doesn’t view next year as a rebuilding year despite losing 99 games in 2011.

“We’re going to try to win,” Ryan said. “There’s no question about that. We have some good players here and hopefully over the winter we have our guys report to Spring Training without any of their ailments. So there’s no reason to think we won’t go through this thing without trying to win.”

Link

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
#OccupyTwinkieTown

by less cowbell, more 'neau on Nov 11, 2011 8:39 AM EST up reply actions

Plop plop fizz fizz...

by spanspanspan on Nov 11, 2011 8:43 AM EST up reply actions

Oh what a relief it is!

I would love to believe Ryan on this, but:

a) That’s what he’s going to say regardless. No GM comes out and says, “Yeah, we’re not even going to bother trying to win.”
b) He needs to make some huge off-season moves for it to happen, and if he’s actually serious about cutting the payroll, that’s harder.
c) Even if it’s true, I still don’t want Posada.

But really, I’d love to be wrong… well, not on point c.

by ColossusOfRhode on Nov 11, 2011 1:17 PM EST up reply actions

This makes me happy

Just go for it. When everyone is healthy we’re still one of the best teams in the Central and who knows what kind of injuries/unexpected challenges our rivals will face in 2012?

The beard abides.

by Jason Kubel's Beard on Nov 11, 2011 11:45 AM EST up reply actions

THis would only

This would only make sense if they did it later on in the offseason AFTER they’ve addressed more pressing concerns, namely a second catcher, the middle infield, and the pitching staff.

I’d rather see them get somebody like Ryan Doumit and kill two birds with one stone.

I also don’t trust Gardenhire to platoon Posada properly.

by AdamOnFirst on Nov 10, 2011 11:06 PM EST reply actions

I agree on all points.

by Jesse on Nov 10, 2011 11:07 PM EST up reply actions

More importantly

His home road splits are ATROCIOUS. Guy was a .169/.256/.259 hitter on the road last year (where half of his at bats were). Obviously, as he was hitting mostly against righties, he was helped considerably by the ludicrously favorable conditions of Yankee Stadium for left-handed hitters. Taking him out of that environment and having him try to hit his home runs onto Carl’s home-run porch instead of Ruth’s short porch seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

by AdamOnFirst on Nov 10, 2011 11:10 PM EST up reply actions

This has been true since new Yankee stadium opened...

… in 2009, and it has gotten worse since then. I feel fairly strongly that the stupid hitting environment of that ballpark has been the exclusive reason he’s staved off decline this long.

by AdamOnFirst on Nov 10, 2011 11:12 PM EST up reply actions

I've always found it interesting

how free agents go to the Yankees and suddenly develop some extra power.

Great point about the ballpark and Posada. I’ve pretty much gone from “I’m not sure, I’ll have to think about this” to “no, this just isn’t a good idea at all.”

by Jesse on Nov 10, 2011 11:14 PM EST up reply actions

Interesting thought, but...

No. Posada doesn’t solve any problems the Twins have. At least, not any better than anyone else the Twins have.

by sw mn guy on Nov 10, 2011 11:09 PM EST reply actions

If we're going with old back up catchers

Let’s get Mike Redmond back behind the plate. Outdoor NBP?

"Don't take life for granted, because tomorrow isn't promised to any one of us." -Kirby Puckett
#OccupyTwinkieTown

by less cowbell, more 'neau on Nov 10, 2011 11:28 PM EST reply actions

I don't know if he'd be my first choice

but platooning him with Gomes wouldn’t be a bad option. Surprisingly, Posada was one of the Yankees I liked (along with Rivera and Cano), so to see him as a Twin wouldn’t bother me.

by Caleb A on Nov 11, 2011 1:44 AM EST reply actions

There aren't enough roster spots for a DH platoon

by DJL44 on Nov 11, 2011 9:33 AM EST up reply actions

No

Too old and can’t catch anymore

by DavidRF on Nov 11, 2011 1:47 AM EST reply actions

Only if they nontender Casilla.

Otherwise there’s a serious nose overload issue.

by timprov on Nov 11, 2011 4:36 AM EST reply actions 1 recs

No

Gardy doesn’t platoon so we wouldn’t be protected from the LH side of those splits.

by BD57 on Nov 11, 2011 6:44 AM EST reply actions

I like Posada's bat but,

I think we’ll need a DH that can play the Field. Posada can play a little at 1b, I think, but he can’t catch any more.

by b1 on Nov 11, 2011 8:10 AM EST reply actions

The Phillies seem to think Thome can play first base sometimes

I’m not against signing Posada if the deal is cheap, so long as the Twins have evidence he can catch 60 or 70 games.

by spanspanspan on Nov 11, 2011 8:29 AM EST up reply actions

He caught six inning of one game last year

by DavidRF on Nov 11, 2011 9:37 AM EST up reply actions

I pretty much hate Jorge Posada

so no

The beard abides.

by Jason Kubel's Beard on Nov 11, 2011 9:32 AM EST reply actions 1 recs

Posada is,was and will always be a bit of a douche... I hope the Yankees keep him.

by PtP_Guru on Nov 11, 2011 10:39 AM EST up reply actions

I don't see it

Hes never really been a DH-quality bat.

by amiller92 on Nov 11, 2011 9:41 AM EST reply actions

He has no idea how spoiled he has been being overpaid market value by the Yankees all these years.

He won’t like our offer.

by PtP_Guru on Nov 11, 2011 9:49 AM EST reply actions

I'd rather see Damon as a DH

Slash right fielder. He at least was hitting in stretches last year.

by Black Metallic on Nov 11, 2011 9:52 AM EST reply actions

I don't think you want to see Johnny Damon any where near RF.

by PtP_Guru on Nov 11, 2011 10:38 AM EST up reply actions

That would be a rag arm outfield

Revere, Span and Damon means the cutoff man has to go out 100 feet.

by DJL44 on Nov 11, 2011 11:15 AM EST up reply actions

the old 8th grade double cut...

or this classic…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5nuY1X8GBY

by PtP_Guru on Nov 11, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions

Two cut-off men if Nishioka is playing short

"You're thinking too much. Just have fun." -- Bennie "The Jet" Rodriguez in Sandlot

by cmathewson on Nov 11, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions

Yeah, I dunno about this

After spending his career playing for the Yankees, and with the attitude problems he had this year when the Yankees dropped him in the batting order… I just can’t imagine him fitting into the Twins clubhouse.